Nuclear accident in Japan, a Japanese Chernobyl?

[the middle]

Yesterday, my kettle overflowed, and water fell on the electric take.
Directly, this water turned into vapor.
So, I wonder how you can cool fused uranium with water.
This phenomenon could explain the problem of the condensation trays.
Yes, if there is radioactive vapor, it must be condensed, otherwise it ends up in the clouds.
In this case, there is a phenomenal amount of vapor created by the pumping of seawater.
How to successfully condense all this vapor?
It is impossible, too much cooling water is required.
Ok, I'm not a nuclear specialist at all, it's almost speculation.
But my personal industrial experience allows me to understand a certain number of obvious things.

[Christophe]

How to successfully condense all this vapor?

Well, this is the operating principle of a steam power plant (nuclear, coal, combined cycle) in normal times, with a condenser (and part also in the turbines during expansion) ...

In an emergency we no longer use steam, if there is (and there is), it is "degassed" to prevent the core / reactor vessel from exploding ...

Seawater cooling is only done on water, not steam.

It was estimated above that the flow of 30 m3 / h announced by the press was sufficient to dissipate up to 2800 MW thermal (delta 80 ° C) without going through the latent heat of the vapor, so it is not nothing and c 'is more than enough (it corresponds to a 1 GW reactor at full power) ... provided you pump without any failure!

On the other hand, obviously, this water must be discharged somewhere ... but if it is not in the primary / core (it is not a priori), it is not radioactive ... except via leaks ... and there are leaks!

There are diagrams above in this subject of the assembly which was made in urgency.

According to the animation of the world we have a pumping of sea water in the containment (for fuku 1) on the other hand they do not show where it comes out ...

There is therefore a cooling possible by "simple" conduction with the reactor core vessel ...

[Christophe]

That's it, France finally officially (or almost) speaks of a nuclear disaster:

March 15, 2011
Nuclear: crisis meeting at the Elysée at 10 a.m. and 12:30 p.m. in Matignon

A crisis meeting on the Japanese nuclear disaster was convened at 10 a.m. at the Elysée Palace and at 12:30 p.m. in Matignon, a government source told Le Monde. Nicolas Sarkozy was not to participate in the Elysée meeting: a few days before the cantonal elections, he is on the move in Tarn-et-Garonne, to meet a farmer, Sophie Poux, met during the broadcast of Jean- Pierre Pernaut on TF1 in January 2010. "If there is no president, this is not a crisis meeting", comments Franck Louvrier, communications advisor to Nicolas Sarkozy.

http://elysee.blog.lemonde.fr/2011/03/1 ... -matignon/

[the middle]

How to successfully condense all this vapor?

Well, this is the operating principle of a steam power plant (nuclear, coal, combined cycle) in normal times, with a condenser (and part also in the turbines during expansion) ...

We estimated above that the flow rate of 30 m3 / h announced by the press was enough to dissipate up to 2800 MW thermal (delta 80 ° C) so it's not nothing and it's more than enough (it corresponds to a reactor of 1 GW in full power) ... on condition of pumping without any failure!

On the other hand, obviously, this water must be discharged somewhere ... but if it is not in the primary / core, it is not radioactive ...

There are diagrams above in this subject of the assembly which was made in urgency.

According to the animation of the world we have a pumping of sea water in the containment (for fuku 1) on the other hand they do not show where it comes out ...

There is therefore a cooling possible by "simple" conduction with the reactor core vessel ...

Not convinced, it's like comparing an electric take with a pan full of water, and a take at full power without a pan on it (it turns red)
And when it's red, nothing can cool, because there is an insulation between what is molten, and water.
But hey, this reasoning is only mine.
In addition, everything is clear with regard to a conventional judgment.
But when the radioactive bars melt with the others who have to stop everything, the reaction is no longer controlled in my opinion.
What stops the reaction is carbon? I forgot; if this is the case, the carbon has burned and nothing stops the reaction.
Tell me that my memory is bad and that I am wrong.

[Leo Maximus]

I do not want to clutter the wire unnecessarily but if it interests I have satellite images of the site. No pictures from last year, pictures from a few hours ago.

ML

[Christophe]

Of course Lejuste that it is hazardous DIY !! The proof: if it worked well, there would be no explosions! But it is the only solution they have found to avoid the worst!

... at least try to avoid it because a priori the worst is happening right now !!

Anne L. is funny !!

09h
The interview with Anne Lauvergeon in Le Parisien: "There may be lessons to be learned in France"
http://www.leparisien.fr/societe/anne-l ... 359389.php
Tuesday March 15, 2011 09:50 AM

09h
Spent nuclear fuel from reactor 4 at the Japanese Fukushima-Daiichi plant may be bubbling, and the water level is currently dropping, reports the Japanese news agency Kyodo on Tuesday; Following an explosion, a fire occurred in a spent fuel retention basin in this section of the power plant, which was badly affected by the earthquake and tsunami on Friday on the northeast coast of Japan. According to Japanese authorities cited by the IAEA (International Atomic Energy Agency), the fire had been put out.

It's more of a disaster it turns into a real nuclear nightmare there!

Given the Japanese sense of honor, have there been any reports of suicides among Tepco officials?

10h
NHK reports condition of reactor # 4
http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/15_40.html

We can read there that:

The blast may have been a hydrogen explosion triggered by vaporization of the pool water, which resulted in fuel rods being exposed.

The plant's operator is rushing to cool the reactor by injecting water, as it did for the No.1 and No.3 reactors.

= fuel (used) in the air without any containment / cooling, as much to say it is equivalent to a perforated reactor ... I don't know the differences in potential radioactivity between fresh and used uranium ...

[Christophe]

I do not want to clutter the wire unnecessarily but if it interests I have satellite images of the site. No pictures from last year, pictures from a few hours ago.

ML

Uh but pkoi are you wondering? Because level congestion ... we are already badly crossed ...

In other words: send fissa !!

[the middle]

Another little thing by the way,
Thank you to you (christophe and the others) for your quick info and the work done, and without intimidation.
I no longer watch TV to follow the news in this case.
It's not sucking, it's what I think from the bottom of my heart.
In this case, long live the net.

[Christophe]

Thank you as you see I / we have not been unemployed since Friday!

There is no pacifier here! Then you bite


There, I will try / attempt to write a "letter" on the nuke! As one of our new members just did: https://www.econologie.com/forums/lettre-a-m ... 10597.html

[Leo Maximus]

General view :



Following roughly the diagonal from the bottom, n ° 1, the first to have exploded, n ° 2 (not yet exploded ...), n ° 3 which blew yesterday and n ° 4.