Comparative CO2 and energy: heat pump, gas and cpcu

Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ... short thermal comfort. Insulation, wood energy, heat pumps but also electricity, gas or oil, VMC ... Help in choosing and implementation, problem solving, optimization, tips and tricks ...
Christophe
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by Christophe » 05/08/09, 00:28

Ah but if Monsieur quibbles .... I bow : Cheesy:

Yes, the balance sheet of nuclear power on CO2 is not complete ... but that of coal or oil is not either: "indirect" CO2 is not taken into account ... (prospecting, extraction, refining. ..)

We just know that for oil it is around 10 to 20% ... of the final energy contained in the fuel ... but what about oil wars ...

And there is the "rest", maybe worse than CO2: human costs ...
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by Capt_Maloche » 05/08/09, 00:34

Dac odac but the exploitation of uranium and its enrichment is incommensurate with the extraction of fossil fuels

and the factor is 10
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by Christophe » 05/08/09, 00:41

I found 1 article on the subject in a number of the Ecologist of 2000, I scan it and publish it tomorrow!
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by Christophe » 05/08/09, 16:13

Here is the scanned article:
https://www.econologie.com/forums/nucleaire- ... t8139.html

Principle results:
Image
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by Capt_Maloche » 05/08/09, 17:14

Here are a few elements, but I will not hand over the energy "costs" linked to the extraction, to the "secure" transport, to the refining and to the enrichment of uranium.

For fossil fuels, it's around 10% more
uranium memory is 10 to 20 times more depending on the method (if someone wanted or could confirm on a solid basis)

These are the 2003 figures, the number of nuke power stations having not increased since and our consumption having evolved by around 10%, the share of gas, oil and coal production representing 10%, I would not be wrong in saying that we had to provide at least 5% more from imports or thermal power stations and that average CO2 emissions for electricity production in France for 2009 are at least 180x1.5 = 270g of CO2 / KW.h produced at the meters. without counting refining, enrichment, extraction, transport ...

We get there at 500 !! and I'm not doing that to say I'm right, but there is some work on it ...

sources: http://www.edf.com/html/panorama/transp ... ation.html
Image

Image

Image

Image

Image
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by Capt_Maloche » 05/08/09, 17:43

And here is the rectified comparison table with the legends:

GAZ
Image

In short, to come back to a well-sized heat pump operating under conditions allowing an average annual COP of 3 to be obtained (rare except for low consumption circuits or geothermal probes), we can read that the CO2 balance is only 30% lower to a gas installation for a cost 3 times higher and a profitable operating balance after 10 years, unfortunately at the time when the heat pump needs to be replaced
Last edited by Capt_Maloche the 05 / 08 / 09, 18: 34, 1 edited once.
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by Capt_Maloche » 05/08/09, 18:06

Christophe wrote:Here is the scanned article:
https://www.econologie.com/forums/nucleaire- ... t8139.html

Principle results:
Image


WELL THEN, SAY IT ! you're harder than me on this one

if we stick to your table, it would be 800g of CO2 per KW.h ??
What sources? AH yes, you put the link ...
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by Christophe » 05/08/09, 19:00

It's not me, I'm just "bringing" you some info, now you have to qualify these figures because they are compared to cogeneration!

Otherwise there is the full article here: https://www.econologie.com/forums/nucleaire- ... t8139.html if not readable enough I can put it in high resolution .pdf? Ask for it.

Sinon Image for the rest of your research, especially this:

Image

So it means that depending on the nature of its use, French electricity emits more or less CO2?

If we relate it to the previous curve, namely:
Image

Well, it is not hard to understand that on average over a year, we are more much closer to 180 gr / kWh than to 90 gr / kWh !!

Frankly at 180 gr / kWh + waste ... I find it hard to understand the interest of nuke ... : Cheesy:
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by Capt_Maloche » 05/08/09, 22:47

yes, but that's why there is the arrow above 180, it was the value in 2003 (for the heating period only)

with an increase of around 10% in demand since, we are in 2009 at around 270g CO2 / Kw.h since the fleet of Centrale has not increased, it is that it was necessary to produce the complement with half fossil fuels and the other half of renewable

and I repeat, that is without counting the pharaonic energy to extract the fuel, transport it, refine it and above all enrich it !!!! bringing the waste to around 500g / Kw.h

Now, if the fleet were 100% nuclear, it would be a little better, around 250 g / Kw.h : Cheesy:
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"Consumption is similar to a search consolation, a way to fill a growing existential void. With, the key, a lot of frustration and a little guilt, increasing the environmental awareness." (Gérard Mermet)
OUCH, OUILLE, OUCH, AAHH! ^ _ ^
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by Christophe » 05/08/09, 22:52

Capt_Maloche wrote:and I repeat, that is without counting the pharaonic energy to extract the fuel, transport it, refine it and above all enrich it !!!! bringing the waste to around 500g / Kw.h


There are figures in the article here: https://www.econologie.com/forums/nucleaire- ... t8139.html
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