Belgium: lower tax cuts for econology

[the middle]

The decision came last weekend. From 2012, the federal government will stop providing a 40% tax reduction for a number of energy-saving works. By Michel De Muelenaere.
Not good, because in recent years, I have seen a lot of roof renewal work, photovoltaic installations.
Damage.
http://www.lesoir.be/actualite/belgique ... 880532.php

[Christophe]

Having no government was good in the end ...

For the rest: it was quite predictable ... in the current context ...

[elephant]

relativize:

the allocation of certain bonuses has been returned to the regions. It is very likely that the regions will move to support the insulation and the change of boilers, possibly in favor of the most modest incomes (the others having a significant savings: 15000 euros / household on average)

Let's be logical: if by isolating for 3000 euros you save 500 liters of fuel per year at 90 cents / liter, your money is better placed than at the savings bank, not counting the real estate gain.

For the rest, it was still exaggerating to finance the purchase of cars (many of which would still have been renewed) which lead to a tax loss of 1500 to 3000 euros over their lifetime.
And this in a country where diesel vehicles are overtaxed because they consume less (excise compensation tax: 150 euros / year for a 2000 CC in addition to the annual traffic tax of around 300 euros for the same vehicle)
Whereas it should rather be encouraged to reduce the number of vehicles on the road for obvious reasons of pollution, road safety and a glaring lack of parking spaces. Unfortunately, it is not the prices, delays and lack of speed of Belgian public transport that will change the public's opinion.

[sspid14]

The budget has not yet been voted so we have to see if it will not change because Ecolo does not seem to agree!

We are talking about giving the competence (for the attribution of bonuses) to the Regions but it will be necessary that the Regions have the money to do it ... moreover, the powers would not be transferred immediately.

It is also said that the premium for the insulation of the roof would remain unchanged.
For the rest, you have to pay in full for the end of 2011, or 2012 if a deposit has been paid before November 28, 2011

The construction industry is going to have a big loss in my opinion.

[elephant]

I don't think so: they may sell a little cheaper, but everyone is convinced, the fuel oil keeps increasing.

[Christophe]

Copied / pasted from twin subject: https://www.econologie.com/forums/belgique-b ... 11310.html

rant.

I have just read on the lesoir website that the Belgian government will no longer help the citizen with regard to insulation aid and thermal audit for the year 2012.

source: lesoir newspaper
ref
http://archives.lesoir.be/%AB-un-gouver ... 7029&nav=1

Another thunderclap this morning, after the abolition of the premium on the premium for clean cars. Jean Marc Nollet denounced the total elimination of federal budgets for energy savings. Budget 2012 measures would hide other surprises. Did the negotiators hide things from us?

The communication for this weekend was intended to reassure the markets. When you scratch and analyze the budget agreement, you realize that there are a lot of hidden measures, including the tax assistance measure for home insulation. These tax assistance measures for insulation appeared in 1999. They encouraged citizens to behave in a virtuous way towards the environment. This type of measure is gradually disappearing.

Pass the hatch energy audits, aids for the installation of solar water heaters. We leave 650 million euros aside that could have equipped 400 houses and create 000 jobs are being sidelined.

What impact on the citizen?

This is a question to ask the negotiators and the future finance minister. I want the aid system that exists to be maintained, I am afraid that in 2012, the aid will be withdrawn. These are aids that are full of energy and economic sense. It will affect all families.

So if you want to do an audit in 2012. No way to put it as a tax deduction.

How do you want to reduce our carbon footprint and our dependence on oil if we no longer motivate the citizen?

I am not sure that the motivation by the tax reductions is the best way towards a more econological society ...

Why? I repeat (quickly because it was developed on forums, here for example: https://www.econologie.com/forums/arnaques-e ... t5520.html ) once again:

a) Aid keeps prices up!

b) Equipment that performs economically but is not helped will be abandoned at the cost of another that is less efficient but more helped! Ex. Insulation for the benefit of solar PV ...

a) + b) = c) Aid is a means of controlling the market; as lobbyists of all kinds ...

The proof in figures and comparative calculation for Wallonia: VS solar photovoltaic VS solar thermal insulation

Another similar topic was made this morning: https://www.econologie.com/forums/belgique-b ... 11309.html we continue down please.

After that, renewables are an easy target in terms of "budget to plan" and "deficit to decrease" ...

[Did67]

No government and still the government planes ??? What a strange country ...

Two shades:

1) Tax credits, contrary to what has been written n times, do not translate necessarily by an increase. If this is true for PV "sharks", for example, or those of double glazing, the drop in the very important tax credit on pellet boilers in France has not at all translated into a drop in prices. . Moreover, the prices are a little more expensive than in Germany, but this is explained by the volume of boilers (100 in Germany, 000 times less in France; some costs are fixed; the circuit is longer: importer ) ...

So to qualify a little.

2) Likewise, the fact that unreasonable policies (a little "ideological") have led to distortions (what you point out for PV vs insulation), does not invalidate the interest of any subsidy either to guide markets, either to "launch" a sector (the costs of which would initially be exorbitant, as long as the volumes are too reliable; therefore no one launches, therefore the volumes do not increase, therefore the prices do not fall so that is never profitable ...).

But it is true that intelligent policies are needed. With ideology, lobbies, etc ... this is not often the case ...

3) That said, all of this will end up being wiped out by debt; We will pay as many taxes or more and we will no longer orient anything at all !!!

4) The reduction of tax credits is also a privatization of the financing of these "green" investments: it will be necessary to go to the banks, and to repay them with interest, on the fuel gains ... The "liberals" find that healthier. Banks wins. You pay that much.

It's a choice.

[manet42]

Reducing energy costs does not interest states! ....

Before I used 2L of fuel oil, 500 kWh of electricity.
Now 3,7T of pellets, 2kWh of electricity, no gas, no subscription ....
As much that no longer fits into the boxes (condition, total).
I am therefore a bad citizen.

Would be better if people like me do not multiply .... except to invent a tax on solar panels, it amazes me that our enarques do not think about it .... with the free studies that we give them , are not up to it.


JC

[sspid14]

but everyone is convinced, the fuel oil keeps increasing.

Everyone is convinced that fuel oil is increasing, but when you talk about renewable energy for sure, it's utopian. Mentalities may change but slowly.
It’s always the carrot that keeps the donkey moving !!

I agree with Did67.

Reducing energy costs can interest states because it can translate into more employment during your investment, after any gain you make you will spend it on something else with a 21% vat, ...

[sspid14]

Interesting press release:

http://www.apere.org/doc/111130_CP_reduction_impot.pdf

The announcement of the abolition of tax reductions for energy-saving investments marks the sudden cessation of a dynamic favoring energy independence… in defiance of citizens taken hostage in institutional crossfire.
The news has fallen: energy-saving investments will no longer benefit from the 40% tax reduction granted so far. Competences have been transferred to the Regions, the negotiators have decided that the federal government will wash their hands of it as of 2012… Except that the transfer of competences accompanied by its budget will not actually follow until two years later.
So this is a violent halt in a dynamic that is nevertheless well launched at the level of the Regions. Ignoring the European objectives to be achieved, the development of an eminently promising sector and the post-Kyoto situation currently being negotiated in Durban, the federal government shot itself in the foot by taking an opportunistic and blind decision.
Who suffers? The citizen, put at the foot of the wall that he will not be able to isolate anyway with the help of the State… However, the energy saving had been successful in 2009. The 521 million euros invested ( 626.219 cases) fueled the local economy (installers, manufacturers and related services) and government revenue (VAT, withholding tax and SME tax), for a shortfall of 208 million euros (40% of € 521m), offset by the benefits of induced economic activities and reductions in energy consumption.
With its drastic and brutal decision, the State bites the hand that feeds it. In fact, in 2010, the Belgian State's revenues came almost exclusively from workers and consumers. The big absentees are the profits earned by capital (withholding tax, 3% of revenue), large companies and banks (corporate tax, less than 6% of revenue). Experienced in tax tools, they only contribute marginally.
Following the abolition of the tax reduction mechanism for individuals, the citizen will pay more for the functioning of the State, while having to pay more
for energy services.
Taxation must accompany the energy transition and not put a brake on it. To deprive yourself of this powerful tool is to miss the chance to revive the economy in a local dynamic, stable and promising for the future. The economic situation requires finding creative solutions ... Let's put energy into it, instead of cutting it off!

as well as :
http://www.iewonline.be/spip.php?article4559
http://edora.org/doc/menu_5/111130_Comm ... _EDORA.pdf