Tilting an Edf!

[Christophe]

Here is the experiment I have just launched: the disc counter sold me Bobono connected to a PM230, all plugged into our fridge (Zanussi of 122cm).

2 (+1) goals of this little experiment:

a) See the precision of the PM230 compared to the disc counter on a fridge whose cos phi is often "bad"

b) See the influence of the inclination of the counter compared to what it counts! Indeed I noticed that this counter turned (a lot) more slowly when it was tilted! I do not know how much and if so with all disc meters but that is the purpose of this experience!

c) Raise the consumption of the fridge (obviously ...)

Montage photo:



Photos of possible angles:







First results

I set up the device on September 14 in the evening (the post it stuck on it is the old one that I had used for the freezer whose statements are here: https://www.econologie.com/forums/suivi-de-c ... t6154.html ) with the angle of the 1st photo.

The PM230 this morning indicated 15,7 kWh and the counter 14,2 kWh. If we assume that the PM230 is correct we therefore have more than 360 kWh of annual consumption for a "small" 122cm fridge with freezer! A "new" fridge of the same size and with an A + classified freezer consumes 220 to 240 kWh according to the instructions ...

What followed

I started by measuring with the "small" angle. The next series will be with the counter "straight" (hung on the wall). Each measurement will last a month for more precision. So see you on October 14!

[boubka]

Hello
it is well known on disc site meters to slow it down (at least 10 x less) just turn it over

[Remundo]

Hi Christophe and Boubka,

I have in my family an engineer who works to make small electrical equipment (wiper motors, meters).

Among its customers, there is EDF ... The meters are made in Indonesia and EDF resells them with a particularly indecent margin, in addition to the subscription that goes with it.

To return to the technique, the forces which make the meter rotate are linked to amperages (Laplace couple).

As soon as the pivot is not perfect, the inclination acts on the friction of the pivot and therefore on the speed of rotation, because at the same time, the drawn amperage remains constant.

It is therefore necessary to find the optimal friction position to make energy "savings".

For meters quickly manufactured at low cost, the differences are likely to be significant (> 10%) ...

At the same time, given the price per kWh, there's nothing to make a fortune ... maybe 100 Euros / year to break everything

[Christophe]

Yes Remundo I think the same except that the aim of the manipulation is purely "scientific" ...

Tilting a counter is like bridging a counter: it's theft ... pure and simple!

Now I just heard that EdF was probably going to increase its subscription by 6 € per month to finance the € 4 billion for the installation of new electronic and remote sensing meters ... and € 6 per month is enormous!

So theft question ...

[bham]

Among its customers, there is EDF ... The meters are made in Indonesia and EDF resells them with a particularly indecent margin, in addition to the subscription that goes with it.

Could you clarify Remundo, just to hurt us?

[bham]

Now I just heard that EdF was probably going to increase its subscription by 6 € per month to finance the € 4 billion for the installation of new electronic and remote sensing meters ... and € 6 per month is enormous!

So you confirm what we mentioned a while ago: EDF would automatically change all the old meters?
If this is true, why is it up to the customer to pay it? € 6 / month is € 72 / year, a meter "made in Indonesia" should not cost much more, or even less.
Ah stupid, I forget the MO, it takes € 300 to move a counter!

[Remundo]

I said "in my family", he is actually the son of a very good friend of Mum ...

Anyway ... I think from memory he told me that the meter arrived at 10 Euros all expenses paid in France, and that EDF invoices the zinzin 80 Euros. Should be checked, but these are the orders of magnitude that I have retained.

If we assume that for each kWh consumed, there is already a (normal) margin, a subscription of 5 euros / month over 20 years reimburses 120 times the meter (60 euros / 10 x 20).

So allow yourself to pocket 7 times the price of the meter when it is delivered ...

And there it’s all good... and I am very kind in the rates used. Did you say monopoly and dependence?

Anyway, it was like that for the telephone during the PTT era, for electricity, it's still the same.

Fortunately, the kWh price is moderate ...

[Bibiphoque]

Hello,
This kind? :
http://www.alibaba.com/product-free/100 ... ld_In.html

With the possibility of taking readings remotely, of course invoicing you for the statement!
@+

[Remundo]

Hi Bibiphoque,

I think that's why:
http://www.google.fr/search?hl=fr&safe= ... ique&meta=

"ERDF estimates the site at 54 Euros / meter"

Not too precise, but if you add a margin invoiced to customers + VAT ...

it makes me laugh this kind of thing ... We do not need to change our counters, we receive the little paper, we mark the conso and we send everything by mail ...

Telemetry, I don't mind, but in any case, it should be FREE.

Because:
- These meters have been paid for 100 times in the 30 years that we have subscribed
- the installation of remote meters will make EDF staff cut, thus saving it money.

And all this is presented as a chivalrous effort by ERDF ... We are being had on this one there, and not only once ...

Finally, we have to go there.

[bham]

... the counter arrived at 10 Euros all costs paid in France, and that EDF invoiced the zinzin 80 Euros.

If we assume that for each kWh consumed, there is already a (normal) margin, a subscription of 5 euros / month over 20 years reimburses 120 times the meter (60 euros / 10 x 20).

So allow yourself to pocket 7 times the price of the meter when it is delivered ... ...

Thank you for your answer, indeed it is staggering but it is the kind of report that I also heard concerning articles from the Far East.

And there it’s all good... and I am very kind in the rates used. Did you say monopoly and dependence?
...

I am not sure that the monopoly changes much because in the event of liberalization it is the competitors who agree among themselves (even if it is prohibited); moreover, since the semi-privatization of EDF, prices have increased in terms of services.

Telemetry, I don't mind, but in any case, it should be FREE.
Because:
- These meters have been paid for 100 times in the 30 years that we have subscribed
- the setting up of remote meters is going to have EDF cut staff, thus saving it money.
And all this is presented as a chivalrous effort by ERDF ... We are being had on this one there, and not only once ...
Finally, we have to go there ....

+1. To be forced to pass, well we have to see if there are enough customers to challenge, maybe they will make a move