placo lining thermal bridge with parquet, expanding foam

Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ... short thermal comfort. Insulation, wood energy, heat pumps but also electricity, gas or oil, VMC ... Help in choosing and implementation, problem solving, optimization, tips and tricks ...
newstarnord
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Re: Thermal bridge placo lining with parquet, expanding foam




by newstarnord » 20/02/22, 21:09

No; for the staircase, it's just that the facade has a side staircase. So, to put the scaffolding, not easy.

Finally, I saw that there is cladding, in this case no need to make coating I suppose, but, to see.

Finally, I have a 3 cm plaster brick partition in the bathroom which communicates with the basement.
Precisely it is a little cold in this bathroom when the outside temperature drops significantly.
I had thought of insulating the partition with depron (two layers of 9mm depron each), on the garage side.

Why depron? Because it lets moisture escape according to what is specified.

Is this a good idea or is there a better insulator? Cheaper maybe?

Next, what do you think of the isosphere? Is it a flammable material in your opinion?
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Obamot
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Re: Thermal bridge placo lining with parquet, expanding foam




by Obamot » 20/02/22, 21:52

newstarnord wrote:No; for the staircase, it's just that the facade has a side staircase. So, to put the scaffolding, not easy. a little more difficult of course, because you have to put 2 extension tubes on the lowest side, there are some with a ground termination with a generously sized plate, which improves stability

Finally, I saw that there is cladding, in this case no need to make coating I suppose, but, to see. instead, this costs less, a 1cm wood wool panel which may be cemented and rigid is integrated directly into the insulation in one piece

BAB97D55-FA08-4B8F-8A94-4724BB91EC06.jpeg
The panels can have a recess for optimum sealing from one panel to the other.

Finally, I have a 3 cm plaster brick partition in the bathroom which communicates with the basement.
Precisely it is a little cold in this bathroom when the outside temperature drops significantly.
I had thought of insulating the partition with depron (two layers of 9mm depron each), on the garage side.

Why depron? Because it lets moisture escape according to what is specified. Depron is a brand. In fact it's extruded polystyrene that I was talking about earlier. 1 cm is not enough. And no, it doesn't let moisture through, it's perfectly airtight. But normal for a bathroom that must have ventilation to evacuate humidity

Is this a good idea or is there a better insulator? Cheaper maybe? It all depends, I do not know the configuration of the premises, but if you put an ITE, you will not create new problems. The cold wall phenomenon results from the lowering of the temperature INTERNAL external walls of the house, so by doing an ItI you are only moving the problems that persist, and difficult to know what is happening without a thermal camera, for the worst cases of structural crumbling the house must be razed .


Next, what do you think of the isosphere? Is it a flammable material in your opinion? yet another brand of the same type of product, polystyrene, but not to be chosen because the graphiting is destroyed by UV rays and then the material disintegrates and it is irreversible.
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newstarnord
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Re: Thermal bridge placo lining with parquet, expanding foam




by newstarnord » 21/02/22, 12:56

Obamot wrote:for the worst cases of structural crumbling you have to raze the house


No, there's no problem with the house, it's in perfect condition, the placo insulation I'm talking about, I didn't do it, I just insulated the brick partitions with vermiculite and perlite, to replace the air space, but just on 50% of the walls of the house.

Afterwards, the ventilation is not good in this house, and it is necessary to open the windows regularly, as in all the houses of this time. The problem is that the need to ventilate by opening the windows generates great thermal discomfort (risk of catching diseases in drafts, chilly people).

So I installed air extractors but these are very insufficient.
Especially when about fifteen people come to the house, for example at Christmas.
After the kitchen hood is a recycling hood.
And we often dry clothes in the basement.

Well, we have a dehumidifier of about 300W, but this one is surely undersized, we would need several, because the air extractors seem inefficient, especially when it rains.

But hey, if I understood correctly, the fact of not insulating the floor, but having insulated the walls, can generate structural problems on the house?
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Re: Thermal bridge placo lining with parquet, expanding foam




by Obamot » 21/02/22, 15:33

Hello, you describe all the symptoms of a poorly insulated and poorly heated house.

I went a bit too far in saying “raze a house”, these are extreme cases, to draw attention to the consequences of sloppy work.

You say that the scaffolding should be 12m high, C-ã-d that with a ceiling height of 2m50, it is a house of 3 floors + attic/attic... Does this mean that ALL the walls are doubled and that only 50% of the spaces between facade walls and brick partitions doubling them, have received vermiculite? Anyway, it is not advisable to do only part of it and it does not solve the structural issues of thermal bridges (so the feeling of cold will still remain).

You already have thermodynamic imbalances between (slightly) “isolated” zones and zones that are not. If there are concrete slabs on each floor, no need to tell you where the thermal bridges are. Then, we don't know if your parquet floors pass under the brick wall supposed to serve as insulation (an attempt made after the fact?) or if they rest on the slabs.

From what I understand, you have 3 areas to treat in priority:
1) basement insulation with expanded or extruded polystyrene panels (as seen previously).

2) under-roof insulation to be reinforced (we haven't talked about it, but the heat rises and all the losses pass through there.

3) know if you want to do an ITE on the facade or DIY on a case-by-case basis in ITI and collect the problems that will go with it.

If you choose the ITI, know that in volume of materials, it will be comparable to an ITE. The vermiculite applied so far is a sort of “bandage”. We see that it creates more problems than it solves and the heat comes out anyway. I don't want to go any further than that, I haven't even seen any photos (we don't even sail by sight). : Cheesy: That's all I could say about it “with a ladle”.

You could get a laser thermometer, heat the house very hard in very cold weather, and make measurement points on all the facades, every 10 cm in the critical areas (junctions / slabs-walls / roofs / basement slab / external staircase, and you would then see all the problems to be dealt with... It would give you an approximate "house thermography". The advantage is that you can go quickly by scanning areas (like the center of the walls outside their junctions )

https://www.lidl.be/p/fr-BE/parkside-th ... p100319523
Last edited by Obamot the 21 / 02 / 22, 15: 54, 1 edited once.
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newstarnord
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Re: Thermal bridge placo lining with parquet, expanding foam




by newstarnord » 21/02/22, 15:50

Hello,

Yes, it's a two-storey house: basement, living rooms and another half-attic, half-living room.
There are therefore 3 slabs, that of the basement, that of the living rooms, and that of the attic.
The attic has 6m high ceilings (approximately)

Let me describe the attic (2nd floor)
The entire roof of the attic is insulated with placo and 20 cm glass wool I believe.
Except that the attic walls (the gable walls) are not insulated, nor are there any partitions on these walls.

For the other part of this second floor with a 6m high ceiling, there is 20cms of insulation behind placo on the wall that opens onto the outside in the living room, and placo with 4cms of insulation between the attic and the hallway leading to the living room.

The adjoining house next door has exactly the same configuration except that there is no living room in their attic, and the roof is insulated with polystyrene sheets. This house has vermiculite on all its peripheral partitions in the living rooms only (1st floor).

Ours has vermiculite/perlite on 50% of its peripheral partitions in the living rooms.

I could send you photos if you give me your email address in private message?
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