LED Bulbs: actual consumption and trials

[Obelix]

Hello,

Example of a 1 Watt LUXEON LED in "optimized" mounting:

Led => 1 Watt White 3.5 Volts / 300mA
Regul Current => 1.5 Volts / 300mA => 0.5 Watt

If we regulate by a linear regulator 5 Volts classic
Consumption on the battery 300mA
6Volts battery => 1.8 Watts
9Volts battery => 2.7 Watts
12Volts battery => 3.6 Watts

If we regulate by cutting power supply:
Optimized efficiency 90% or => 1.7 Watts on a battery between 6Volts and 40Volts

If we regulate from the sector:
Transformer 220/12 Volts 95% (for Chinese it is much less)
Bridge rectification (less copper, copper is very expensive!) 2.5Volts / 300mA => 0.75 Watts
Regul by power supply with decoupage => 1.7 Watts
Total 1.7 + 0.75 = 2.5 Watts => 95% => approximately 2.7 Watts

In summary:
Pay VERY attention to the assemblies because you can easily consume 3 times the power of the LEDs.
Industrialized assemblies will consume a minimum of 2 times the power of the LEDs !!

Good reflections
In fact, most leds are manufactured by "LUMILED", a subsidiary of philips.
Obelix

[Christophe]

Either for a diode of 30mW a global consumption around 70mW.
This for an "optimized" editing but not "industrialized"!

What is industrialized as a mounting then? At best we have 0.45W / Led ... or on the boxes of my bulbs there are however well marked: consumption in W = 0.03 * number of leds .... the error is therefore a factor of 15 or 1500% if you prefer! Who tolerates such errors?

It is therefore false advertising ... and there is no need to take a step back with such margins of error I am sorry ! I call it a scam ... (just like the pantone kit vendors who say 80% water !!)

However, I repeat the conclusion of my news on this subject:
"These results therefore do not in any way call into question the technology of white LEDs, very effective in low voltage. But they reveal a" fairly serious "problem concerning the technology but especially the marketing of LED bulbs 220 / 240V ..."

[Christophe]

Example of a 1 Watt LUXEON LED in "optimized" mounting:
(...)
Total 1.7 + 0.75 = 2.5 Watts => 95% => approximately 2.7 Watts

In summary:
Pay VERY attention to the assemblies because you can easily consume 3 times the power of the LEDs.
Industrialized assemblies will consume a minimum of 2 times the power of the LEDs !!

Well here is a 3rd confirmation of our tests (Delnorma and me) ... finally Luxeon and Chinese Led is almost the same thing in terms of consumption .... very bad for such results ... should I say "lies "? ...

I don't know if you saw my 1st result but they are here: https://www.econologie.com/forums/ampoules-a ... t2132.html

ps: the figures you announce is what you measured or calculated? If you have made the possible measurements to make some illustrative photos? Thank you

[Obelix]

Hello,

ps: the figures you announce is what you measured or calculated? If you have made the possible measurements to make some illustrative photos? Thank you

All in all, these are measurements taken at a "friend's" house which makes special spots for underwater photographers.
Colors and powers on demand, in user-defined forms. Finally what sheep has five legs.
We tested Luxeon 5Watts (hard to get samples), but the characteristics are too variable and the lifespan much too short at present. Still not recommended.
In this production we never talk about the price, because what is sought is the result. (if you are not afraid, I could give you orders of magnitude ... in KEuros)

As for the consumption advertised on the boxes, it's a bit the same principle as for HI-FI.
To know that everyone measures what he wants or can.
You are talking about 30mW per led, so these are standard 25mA led per led. "Industrial" current regulator 3Volts drop => 75mW, then power supply in 220 with Chinese transformer and inexpensive rectifier for the rest => 3Volts drop and 75% efficiency
Total => led 30mW + regul => 100mW + rectification => 200mW + transformer efficiency => 270mW
So without exaggerating, the "normal" components already give a consumption of 270mW per LED for mass distribution mounting.
If we look for savings it will only get worse. And for that the Chinese get along !!

Obelix

[Obelix]

Hello,

Reading the post from the beginning, I realized that in the first messages of the first page "delnoram" presented us with an "exploded" spot.

I can tell you that for this type of spot (and it should not be the only one) the overconsumption is enormous.
Indeed instead of a transformer, there is a capacitor to drop the voltage. This capacitor behaves like a ballast resistor and therefore as the consumption is 77mA and there are 4 groups of 5 leds, we can deduce:
These are 20mA LEDs so 1.5 Volts
Grouped by 5, about 7.5 Volts per group
As there are 4 groups, the power supply useful for the LEDs is:
7.5 Volts x 80mA => 0.6 Watts

The rest is 14Volts x 77mA => 1.078 Watts less 0.6 Watts or 0.478 Watts is generously dissipated in heat.
Fortunately it is a low voltage otherwise we would have had:
220 Voltsx 77mA => 17 Watts or 16.4 Watts to dissipate.

Obelix

[delnoram]

Hello,

Reading the post from the beginning, I realized that in the first messages of the first page "delnoram" presented us with an "exploded" spot.

I can tell you that for this type of spot (and it should not be the only one) the overconsumption is enormous.
Indeed instead of a transformer, there is a capacitor to drop the voltage. This capacitor behaves like a ballast resistor and therefore as the consumption is 77mA and there are 4 groups of 5 leds, we can deduce:
These are 20mA LEDs so 1.5 Volts
Grouped by 5, about 7.5 Volts per group
As there are 4 groups, the power supply useful for the LEDs is:
7.5 Volts x 80mA => 0.6 Watts

The rest is 14Volts x 77mA => 1.078 Watts less 0.6 Watts or 0.478 Watts is generously dissipated in heat.
Fortunately it is a low voltage otherwise we would have had:
220 Voltsx 77mA => 17 Watts or 16.4 Watts to dissipate.

Obelix

Hi Obelix, you're going to think it's a fixed idea ........ sorry
But the "exploded" spot (actually exploded in a vice) is a 220volt
GU10 while the measurements arriving at 1.078 watt come from a 12volt AC spot which does not have a capacitor, but is well mounted in 4 groups of 5 LEDs, for the 220v it is 20 LEDs in a row.

So for the 220v GU10 which according to the Wattmeter PM230 consumes 4.6w, I provide you with the assembly diagram.

[Obelix]

Hi Obelix, you're going to think it's a fixed idea ........ sorry
But the "exploded" spot (actually exploded in a vice) is a 220volt
GU10 while the measurements arriving at 1.078 watt come from a 12volt AC spot which does not have a capacitor, but is well mounted in 4 groups of 5 LEDs, for the 220v it is 20 LEDs in a row.

So for the 220v GU10 which according to the Wattmeter PM230 consumes 4.6w, I provide you with the assembly diagram.

Hello,

Well, there are too many unknowns to do something worthwhile.
On the other hand if you can short-circuit the capacitor and feed the spot continuously (around 40 Volts / 30mA) this will give a good idea of ​​the power required for the LEDs and of the losses generated by the system.
As is, in alternative 220, the cos (phi) must not be close to one, because the capacity induces 90 ° of phase shift between U and I ........

Happy handling!

Obelix

[ice]

Hello

I'm glad I came across this forum today.
It has been months since I rebelled against the false advertisements of LED lamps on 230 V AC.

A LED has a luminous efficiency of the same order of magnitude as that of an incandescent bulb (like ten lumens per watt).

So we cannot save much with a LED lamp ... especially since they are very expensive.

Look at led-fr.net/les_sources_lumineuses_tableau.htm

fluorescent lamp / incandescent lamp!

A fluorescent lamp has:
-An efficiency much higher than that of an incandescent bulb
-huge lifespan
-a higher price but not more than 15 €

However, they are profitable after several thousand hours!


It is a 3D graph which depends:
- From the price per kilowatt hour
-The duration of use
And give the cost

[Christophe]

Welcome to you LED

I modified your post a bit to correct the links to your site (which I had already visited ).
There is a very good comparison table on your site that I allowed myself to link. (I just don't agree on the IRC of LEDs ... which is very bad according to those I tested, but it's entirely subjective)

You are the 4th person to confirm the false advertising of the 220V LED bulbs ...

As you seem to know you in lighting would you have an idea of ​​the correction to apply to my measurements? I quote my question:

"1 ° The sensor is given for 2850 ° K
2 ° The lamp which gives the best results is that in 6400 ° K whereas it is the value furthest away from the nominal value of the sensor (the LEDs are at 5500 ° K as for them but even a correction of a factor of 2 will not change much to their miserable results ...).

Question: Should we therefore increase the values ​​given to the T ° moving farther than 2850 ° K and if so is there a simple correction to perform? "

ps: we (well, me) have a little trouble understanding your graph in 3D ... wouldn't you have the same thing in 2 2D graphics?

[delnoram]

Obelix wrote

Well, there are too many unknowns to do something worthwhile.
On the other hand if you can short-circuit the capacitor and feed the spot continuously (around 40 Volts / 30mA) this will give a good idea of ​​the power required for the LEDs and of the losses generated by the system.

Delicate handling , but before giving you the results of what I could do, I give you the result of another measurement which should enlighten you on the LEDs of the spots, even if the diode used is an Ultra High Brightness (22000mcd ).

2.40Vcc = 0lux 2.45Vcc = 1llux 2.70Vcc = 75lux 2.80Vcc = 140lux
2.90Vcc = 232lux 3.00Vcc = 330lux 3.10Vcc = 440lux 3.20Vcc = 558lux
3.30Vcc = 674lux 3.40Vcc = 770lux 3.50Vcc = 840lux

Now the famous manipulations of the 20leds spot
40vdc ...... well nothing since at minimum it should take 49volts for
1lux?

52.8Vdc 1.76mA
56.2Vdc 8.33mA
58.8Vdc 17.4mA
60.0Vdc 23.35mA

As is, in alternative 220, the cos (phi) must not be close to one, because the capacity induces 90 ° of phase shift between U and I ........

I must understand that the cos (phi) should be greater than 1 or less than 1?