The secret (health care)

[pb2488]

So, why this attraction of homeopathy? It would be nice if a homeopathic doctor agreed to give his point of view on this forum.

His opinion would surely be quite impartial ....

What are these insinuations? Are you a doctor?
I do not see how his opinion would be less impartial than yours. Nope but.

Ask a baker if you have to eat bread .......

[abyssin3]

Hello,
Almost nothing to do with the site:
Healings by the secret, (...)
So much so that burned out centers in Switzerland have a list with tel number to help cure their patients. (...)

Yes, I've heard of it here before. And indeed I also know people or their relatives who have been treated "from a distance", for burns in all cases.
Personally, I think exclusively of a placebo effect, even for people who do not believe in miracle healings (after all, they generally believe in it).
But it's like homeopathy, in the end it doesn't matter: if we can induce a cure, even partial by a simple psychological effect, everyone is there: the doctors (less treatment = less side effects), health insurance (less treatment = less expensive than "remote consultation"), the patient (because the psychological effect is apparently quite effective). And all this without significant risk.

PS: For having learned about homeopathy (scientifically I mean, and not on "we say"), personally, I do not believe in a therapeutic virtue of high dilutions ...

[Cuicui]

- Hahnemann's recommendations:
"In general, it is incredible how much this drug, as any other, loses its strength when it is taken on sugar, for example, or that after having instilled in a liquor, one does not stir the one -this. But it is not necessary either, after stirring the dose, to leave it several hours without administering it: the vehicle, thus tranquil, always undergoes a little decomposition, which weakens or even destroys the medicinal plants mixed with it - ( quote: Samuel Hahnemann)"
- It is an assertion without foundations or at least based on foundations that are, for once, not at all impartial:
Jacques Benveniste's research concerning "the memory of water" is partly financed by the Boiron laboratories (until 1989), specialized in the production of homeopathic medicines.
In short, arrived at a certain stage of the dilution, there is not even a single atom of active principle, it remains only sugar and water.

- It would be interesting to do tests to compare current homeopathic medicines with those prescribed by Hahnemann. As long as it's not done I'll be careful not to say one way or the other.
- That Benveniste has found funding at Boiron does not bother me at all, just as I find normal that research on allopathic medicines are funded by conventional labs.
- Everyone knows that at high dilution there is no active ingredient. I have repeated it enough in some of my previous posts. This is precisely why it is disconcerting that, according to homeopathy, the effect is reinforced. Of course, all this deserves to be verified without preconceived ideas, especially if the principle seems shocking to us!

[the middle]

In launching this post, I had in mind that there are good, gentle ways to treat people, and that current medicine (in general) does not use them.
I find it very serious and very damaging.

[Obamot]

It comes little by little. It must be remembered that at the beginning of modern medicine, doctors were widely regarded as gurus. Ignace Philippe Semmelweis, who dramatically reduced the death rate from puerperal fever among mothers admitted to the maternity ward, simply required doctors to wash their hands before assisting women in giving birth [wiki].
And yet how much he was criticized for that at that time.

Medicine goes back at least to prehistory (phytotherapy), while modern medicine goes back to the 19th century. We could almost say we are at the beginning ...

Finally, it must be remembered that the principle of similarity was already used in practice. Samuel Hahnemann (1755-1843), considered the father of modern homeopathy, began to study it seriously when he realized that cinchona bark caused the same symptoms as third fever. And that is perfectly "reproducible".

[pb2488]

And that is perfectly "reproducible".

There is more than that reproducible in these works ....
Although there is also no scientific or empirical basis for the "principle of similars" ... it is a guess.
A placebo, if it is prescribed in the same context as homeopathy, has the same effects except that it can be free ... but all this still benefits from the credulity of patients ....
Homeopathy is medicine for healthy people who do not know each other ...

http://www.academie-medecine.fr/detailPublication.cfm?idRub=27&idLigne=1534.

[elephant]

Several things are certain:

1) the ministry reacts "very well" to the pressures of the lobbyists of the pharmaceutical industry (it must be said that many homeopathic remedies are manufactured "in black" by the pharmacists and do not report anything to the state

2) if some great homeopathic classics work very well on standard pathologies (Nux Vomica, Arnica, Echnicea, calendulla) others require a frank habit on the part of the practitioner and one has the impression that they do not work on everything the world. This is also why homeopathy must be practiced by a doctor, because you have to know its limits and be able to say at certain times: "stop, there is an emergency, we use the good old methods"

3) anything (such as the use of a mint toothpaste or the use of certain spices) can prevent homeopathy from working

4) as the profitability of the market is limited, no one wants to finance research: doctors who find reasonable success continue to use it and improve their skills.

5) although I am convinced that the memory of water is a smoky theory, it is probable that homeopathy will set in motion phenomena that we do not yet know, and for good reason

But when we see the spectacular effectiveness of certain preparations on young children, we are still allowed to ask questions.

And the problem is: when you see a kid coming in your office with a beautiful angina, you can not afford to give him a placebo.

[pb2488]

Several things are some:

??

1) the ministry reacts "very well" to the pressures of the lobbyists of the pharmaceutical industry (it must be said that many homeopathic remedies are manufactured "in black" by the pharmacists and do not report anything to the state

No, pharmacists do not have the means to "energize" molecules. Almost all the preparations leave Boiron laboratories and report to the state (and so much the better the vast majority of the state's money comes back to us directly or indirectly):
In France, homeopathic activity is flourishing: Boiron is the 116e biggest fortune, and Pierre Fabre, second largest shareholder in Boiron Laboratories, the 17e fortune of France.

2) if some great homeopathic classics work very well on standard pathologies (Nux Vomica, Arnica, Echnicea, calendulla) others require a frank habit on the part of the practitioner and one has the impression that they do not work on everything the world. This is also why homeopathy must be practiced by a doctor, because you have to know its limits and be able to say at certain times: "stop, there is an emergency, we use the good old methods"

For standard pathologies, "nothing" also works very well.
But fortunately it does not replace conventional drugs when they are needed, it would be dangerous ...

3) anything (such as the use of a mint toothpaste or the use of certain spices) can prevent homeopathy from working

lol ... as if by chance ...

4) as the profitability of the market is limited, no one wants to finance research: doctors who find reasonable success continue to use it and improve their skills.

Limited profitability? water and sugar ... apparently Boiron and Fabre are not complaining.
What research would there be to finance? Maybe, you should just do an additional double-blind trial campaign (since the ones you see, apparently, are not enough)

5) although I am convinced that the memory of water is a smoky theory, it is probable that homeopathy will set in motion phenomena that we do not yet know, and for good reason

Maybe, it's likely ..... but as theories are smokers, it's much more likely that homeopathy will not get you started. Samuel Hahnemann had in fact discovered the placebo effect ... and it's not bad.

But when we see the spectacular effectiveness of certain preparations on young children, we are still allowed to ask questions.

What is spectacular is the ability of the human body to heal itself.

And the problem is: when you see a kid coming in your office with a beautiful angina, you can not afford to give him a placebo.

Why not. Anyway, if angina is viral, as is very often the case, there is not much to do .... we must wait until it happens ... just a little spray to relieve at the limit.
Cdlt

[elephant]

Good pb2488 is always right, in future I will not participate any more forum where he intervenes. maybe when he has my age and my experience, we can talk with him.

[Christophe]

Once again he did not know how to moderate himself ...

Pfff ...