Artisans, merchants, I love you me either

[C moa]

You're right and also how well we see walking capitalist utopia.
I think the truth is out there ....

After how many years of prosperity?

Well I still wonder because when we look at the graphics on the following page which shows the evolution of the CAC 40 since its creation, the observation is very bitter.

After 22 years of existence, we see that our flagships of industry, services ... have not been valued as much as that (about 2.5 times). Even real estate does better ....
What I notice above all is that it takes a lot of time and effort to succeed in really reaching interesting levels (2000 and 2007) but that the system is thus made that in two times three movements, we can do everything lose or almost !!!

As Bham says: Prosperity ?? For who ??

For my part, I am frightened by the energy lost in paperwork, checks, statistics etc ... in the big boxes.

I did not say that we had to make a cathedral in the desert. In the industry we have very good methods that deserve to be adapted for small structures.
In terms of paperwork, controls and everything, tell yourself that setting up an oil treatment center or a refinery is a little more complicated than making a portal or installing solar panels so necessarily it takes organization. Not to mention that the sums at stake are not really of the same level, so inevitably more checks must be planned.
For example, for us a small project is a project below 300 Million USD, an average project between 500 and 900 million USD, a big project starts from a billion USD and there has no real limits. The last project that we validated this week represents an investment of 3,5 billion USD ...

The idea is good, but as you said, it is not for everyone.

Nothing prevents that from becoming ...

I can still propose another in the same kind, which we could apply to all companies: They pay the employee a salary high enough to cover everything, and he manages himself with his insurance.

The system you offer already exists, it is freelance but in front of you you no longer have employees but consultants who as soon as they find better next to you will tell you bye bye ....
That's how it works with us and it's not that simple to replace a site manager or a (good) welder who plants you (or blackmail you) because we offered him 50 € / day more than 5 km ....

[Philippe Schutt]

code: Select all

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pouvoir_d'achat

The 1st chapter "Evolution" sums it up very well. Let's not spit in the soup.
I admit that companies have not been in the same boat.

[Christophe]

During the twentieth century, the average wage of a worker was multiplied by four in constant currency. The annual duration of his work has been halved so that his hourly wage has been multiplied by eight (...)

Starting from a salary of 0 (or almost) easy to multiply by 8, in other words: the working conditions and remuneration of the average worker at the beginning of the XXth century were so low that it was quite easy to multiply his power purchase by 8.

So interesting Philippe but what about the situation since 1980? Since 2000 ?

[Woodcutter]

+1 for Loremo but still believe you?

You risk driving with an XM 28 years old!

Yes, I still believe in it (a little) ...

[...]
As Bham says: Prosperity ?? For who ??[...]

Except it's not Bham.

[C moa]

+1 with Christophe, this is what is happening in China where the salary of a skilled worker has gone from a bowl of rice to € 500 in a few years (before the crisis in any case).
They did not wait a century, the progression was faster and more brutal than in our countries but suddenly, certain groups like Adidas will relocate to Vietnam ...

[...]
As Bham says: Prosperity ?? For who ??[...]

Except it's not Bham.

Sorry shame on me
So let's give Bucheron what is Bucheron ....

You have the name that starts with the same letter too .... What is that no excuse ??

[Christophe]

+1 with Christophe, this is what is happening in China where the salary of a skilled worker has gone from a bowl of rice to € 500 in a few years (before the crisis in any case).
They did not wait a century, the progression was faster and more brutal than in our countries but suddenly, certain groups like Adidas will relocate to Vietnam ...

Exactly: the standard of living is progressing very quickly and this is a CHANCE for relocation to our countries in the medium term! I think that in 10 to 15 years relocation will be the other way around: we will relocate home ... but in 15 years will we still be able to find the skills here?

The Chinese dream will therefore last only at best 2 or 3 decades ... and not 10% of the population will have really benefited from it ...

[C moa]

Exactly: the standard of living is progressing very quickly and this is a CHANCE for relocation to our countries in the medium term! I think that in 10 to 15 years relocation will be the other way around: we will relocate home ... but in 15 years will we still be able to find the skills here?

Beyond relocation, it is also a means of limiting relocation to Asia.
Will we always be able to do ?? It's a good question, we were talking a few months ago about reopening certain coal mines, I don't know where it is but it would be a good test.

The Chinese dream will therefore last only at best 2 or 3 decades ... and not 10% of the population will have really benefited from it ...

It is over I don't know, they will undoubtedly post a good growth this year.
In a more selfish way, we can say that this economic crisis arrives at the right time in any case to block them because the same situation in 10 years, I am not sure that they would have supported the USA so much because they would have had their internal market as a growth driver.

[elephant]

The Chinese market is itself very important and has its own dynamic.

[C moa]

I do not doubt it but it is not yet sufficient to "self-sufficient" its industry at least that's what I heard on certain airwaves.

What I meant to say is that currently the vast majority of goods produced in China are exported. In 10 years, the proportion of export products / products dedicated to internal markets in overall production would probably have been very different.

The crisis has significantly modified this program.

[Philippe Schutt]

Starting from a salary of 0 (or almost) easy to multiply by 8, in other words: the working conditions and remuneration of the average worker at the beginning of the XXth century were so low that it was quite easy to multiply his power purchase by 8.

So interesting Philippe but what about the situation since 1980? Since 2000 ?

We don't even have to worry about working conditions ...
With globalization we still win, because we buy at a lower price. At least that's what our enarcs calculated. It was true at first, now it's less certain.
The idea of ​​globalization was the generalization of the motivation of the Marschal plan (if my memories are correct) which said that by enriching the poor (at the time Europe and in particular Germany) one removes the risk of war and we create new customers. China and India may have been too big fish ...