Firewood and units, energy of a Stère?

[djangoe]

It is accepted and many official sites testify that the unit of measurement for firewood is the stere, either a stack of logs 1m long x 1m wide x 1m high, or another apparent volume of one cubic meter.
It is still accepted that the 1 meter woods cut into logs of 50, 45, 40, 33 cm rank better and occupy a lesser apparent volume.
Thus a cubic meter of wood cut into 40 cm logs occupies an apparent volume of 0,77m3 while the quantity of wood is identical.

This post does not seem off topic to me because it forum tackles a series of questions on wood stoves, wood boilers, their performance, the price of pellets, ...

It therefore seems important to me to compare the cost of energies to have a precise idea of ​​their cost.

Easy when you get your wood delivered to logs at as many euros per cubic meter (when you have integrated the concepts above).

Much more difficult when you choose to have long timber trucks (2, 4 or 5m, ...) delivered to be cut and split even.
Indeed, these trucks are sold either by the ton, or by the m3, or by the stere with estimates which vary from one merchant to another and different sizes of wood.
How many cubic meters with a ton of wood? This varies depending on the species of wood and the drying time, so it is difficult to assess.
I discovered on e bay an offer for small American oaks in trunk of 2.2 to 2.4 m cut for 6 months and with a diameter of 15 to 30 cm.
These trucks (between 55 and 65 m3) are sold at a price of 36.5 euro / m3 apparent and the seller specifies that with 1m3 we produce 1.4 cubic meters (or 26 euro per cubic meter.)
On an official site I learn that on average 1m3 of solid wood represents 1.3 cubic meters.
Taking the example of the truck and giving myself to a brief calculation (on the basis of an average truck of 60m3) I get 60 x 1.4 = 84 cubic meters. Also on an official site, the mass in kg / cubic meter of fresh oak is between 500 and 600kg. Let's say 550kg x 84 cubic meters = 46,2 tonnes.
What is the MMA of a logging truck?
How do you offer 1.4 cubic meters with 1m3 of visible wood when 1m3 of solid wood produces 1.3 cubic meters?

This example shows that you have to be wary and make sure of the real number of cubic meters in a truck.

My question is therefore for specialists or people who have experienced this type of delivery.
Who could tell me how many (split) steres can be obtained from logs depending on the diameter and length of the timber?

I think this may interest more than one.

[Ahmed]

A lot of questions!
Already an ambiguity, you write:

... are sold at a price of 36.5 euro / m3 apparent and the seller specifies that with 1m3 we produce 1.4 cubic meters (or 26 euro per cubic meter.)

If it is an apparent M3 it is not a real M3. To leave on real M3, you must first cuber each log, which is rarely the case. Indeed, in practice, for small calibers, we rather start from the apparent volume and, applying a coefficient we deduce a volume in M3 (therefore real).
It must be kept in mind that this coefficient gives an approximate result compared to an average: over a large quantity the figure obtained is fairly close to reality and avoids a tedious (and expensive) job of taking measurements.
This is why the coefficient chosen can vary according to the straightness of the woods: in your case, if I understood correctly, in the case of red oak perch, the abundance must be reasonable.

If your woods have only been cut for 6 months, they are not dry, barely dried and surely weigh more than 600 Kgs.

Do not forget that what makes the price of wood is the amount of work it requires: it is no small task to finish shaping wood in more than 2 M. Splitting increases the apparent volume , but not according to the work it causes. If it was so interesting, the forest operator would prefer to value it himself and sell in 50 cm.
Here are some preliminary remarks.

[djangoe]

that's what I said, if 1 m3 real produces 1.3 steres, it is not possible that 1 m3 apparent produce 1.4 steres.

[Ahmed]

It's more complicated than that. From your answer, I see that you wish, starting from M3, to have as many stereas as possible. However, this reasoning is false since there is no strict correlation between these two units.
Compared to an initial volume measured in m3, the straighter the wood, the fewer steres and the more wood.
Cf: http://www.biomasse-normandie.org/old/b ... iche=25211
But, as I told you, it is unlikely that the starting unit is the M3; these two units are often used interchangeably, which ends up blurring the trail.
In the Niomasse-Normandie document, it clearly appears that the coefficient includes a certain latitude of appreciation.

[djangoe]

It's more complicated than that. From your answer, I see that you wish, starting from M3, to have as many stereas as possible. However, this reasoning is false since there is no strict correlation between these two units.
Compared to an initial volume measured in m3, the straighter the wood, the fewer steres and the more wood.
Cf: http://www.biomasse-normandie.org/old/b ... iche=25211
But, as I told you, it is unlikely that the starting unit is the M3; these two units are often used interchangeably, which ends up blurring the trail.
In the Niomasse-Normandie document, it clearly appears that the coefficient includes a certain latitude of appreciation.

Thank you ahmed, but I have the impression that you are "breaking open doors" because you are not teaching me anything and your sources only confirm what I am denouncing: do not confuse real m3 and apparent m3. I'm not trying to make a maximum of cubic meters with m3, on the contrary I want to prove that we cannot do 1.4 cubic meters with 1m3 of visible wood. By definition 1m3 of visible wood = 1 cubic meter. The only unknown lies in the section of these woods compared to split wood.
For the rest, rest assured, I do not fire red bullets on wood merchants, I know the zeal of their work. I have been shaping my wood myself for 25 years at the rate of 200 cubic meters per year (we). I just ask that we speak a common language and that honesty remains a key word which does not seem to be the case in the ad I am talking about. I invite you to read again what I describe in my first post and to refine your conclusions. Yours

[Did67]

How do you offer 1.4 cubic meters with 1m3 of visible wood when 1m3 of solid wood produces 1.3 cubic meters?

This example shows that you have to be wary and make sure of the real number of cubic meters in a truck.

.

It's much simpler: the cubic meter is not a "precise" unit, even if it is commonly used in the timber trade! This is the amount of wood that we put in a volume of 1m3.

My father was a lumberjack. When I was young, I gave him a hand. I can guarantee that depending on our mood, we put more or less wood in a cubic meter. Well, it's not just the mood that plays, of course: logs fill less than split wood (which we can, if one wants to, better to "call" into each other; but we can also stack them in "opposition", point against point, to put more vacuum!). Straight pieces wedge better than twisted pieces ...

This is why professionals go to see the piles before an auction. He sees it at first glance. I can guarantee you that even today, I can tell you if it's a "good" stere or if the lumberjack did "fill" ...

It's perfectly legal. Nothing to say. The stere is "apparent". So you have to see before you buy. Difficult at the Ebay area !!! So it's also the perfect way to get ripped off - plus, legally!

The trunks can be "cubed". The ONF agenst have charts, which give the actual volume of wood as a function of the diameter at the base and the length of the log. There, it is much more precise. Personally, I would only buy cubed logs. Qaudn is managed by the ONF, the logs are generally "struck" or labeled with "cubed" volume.

Plus, in a bulk delivery, I challenge anyone to "measure" the number of cubic meters. The wood should be properly stacked a meter high (if it's pieces of 1 m long) and see how long the pile is!

So: 1) the stere, by definition, it is not precise
2) it is almost impossible to measure on delivery! In general, the gar tipper and disappears ...

[Did67]

I
How do you offer 1.4 cubic meters with 1m3 of visible wood when 1m3 of solid wood produces 1.3 cubic meters?
.

Sorry, I forgot this point.

Indeed, this is not clear at all. "1m3 apparent" is one cubic meter.

The "solid wood", therefore the "cubed volume of a log", gives, because of the expansion when cutting, about 1,3 to 1,4 steres (or apparent cubic m3).

But as I said, if you don't want to get tired, you can even make 1,5 by putting it away badly without showing it too much ...

[Did67]

I have been shaping my wood myself for 25 years at the rate of 200 cubic meters per year (we).

You trade then ???

Or flambé pies (I'm from Alsace) morning, noon and evening for the whole village ???

[djangoe]

I
How do you offer 1.4 cubic meters with 1m3 of visible wood when 1m3 of solid wood produces 1.3 cubic meters?
.

Sorry, I forgot this point.

Indeed, this is not clear at all. "1m3 apparent" is one cubic meter.

The "solid wood", therefore the "cubed volume of a log", gives, because of the expansion when cutting, about 1,3 to 1,4 steres (or apparent cubic m3).

But as I said, if you don't want to get tired, you can even make 1,5 by putting it away badly without showing it too much ...

OK, you are actually confirming what I said: a stere represents logs of one meter stacked on one meter high and one meter wide, or an apparent volume of one m3. It is therefore false to claim that there will be 1,4 cubic meters per apparent m3.

[Ahmed]

[Published by Christine]

Otherwise, agree with what Did 67 says.
It is obvious that an apparent M3 (a fortiori in 2 m 20 long!) Cannot give 1,4 stere. I do not see where the problem is, since stating it is simply absurd.

Note: I have never tried to systematically defend loggers, because I am aware that while many are honest, some are much less ... like their customers.