The false crisis automakers?

[pb2488]

Moreover, this graph shows the link between car consumption and price at the pump:

Average consumption of the vehicle fleet per 100 km (vertical axis) in 1998 as a function of fuel prices in $ per liter (horizontal axis). It is just as obvious that the higher the price of fuel, the less the vehicles consume.

Source 30 Years of Energy Use in IEA Countries, IEA, 2004.

I doubt that by making the relation with the growth of the market or the profits of the manufacturers, one finds this kind of trend for consumption .....
Cdlt

[I Citro]

Sorry pb but your "demonstration" is not at all convincing ...

There is no link between the profits of a manufacturer and the size / consumption of the cars he sells (General motors which is more in the big car in the USA is bankrupt .... Dacia holds the road. ..).

If GM is bankrupt, it is because they refused to adapt, to modernize to make, in the short term, profits while the competitors, Japanese, invested in research to offer better quality and more efficient products. (more economical). Ditto for Dacia, Renault has invested in Dacia with the idea of ​​developing its profits and market shares in emerging countries. They designed a simplified vehicle for this purpose and they saw this vehicle approved in Europe land without their agreement on the French market where demand was high ... Renault was forced to market Dacia products in its French catalog, which was not in its plans, the margin on these vehicles being lower than on the Renault ... This proves that design, power, luxury and safety are not the essential criteria of part of the customer base.

If consumers wanted / had to buy vehicles that consume much less (therefore less heavy and less powerful), then manufacturers would make them and probably make just as much profit.

Of course not, the profits would be less ... A clio leaves the factory for less than 5.000 €, do you think they would manage to earn 4 to 6.000 € on a vehicle sold for less than 5.000 €, the kind of vehicle what many consumers expect ...

Moreover, this does not prevent manufacturers from constantly improving engine efficiency and pollution.

As an attentive observer of the evolution of technologies, I can tell you that the manufacturers BRAKE 2 FEET so as not to make their vehicles evolve. They only do it in homeopathic doses to maintain their customers' desire to renew their vehicles for technical reasons that are more motivating than futile stylistic reasons ... The preservation of their margins requires the amortization of their tools on the market. longer term possible ... They have known for 40 years that all engine management and peripherals had to evolve towards all-electric (electric fan, injection, fuel pump, electric power steering, electric braking, electric air conditioning, electric water pump ...) Instead of delivering all these innovations to us at the same time, they distill them to us in droplets and under the constraint of the antipollution standards imposed on them.

Advertising, which everyone denounces as manipulative and therefore of which everyone recognizes the strings, is a false pretext to hide a lack of will, realism, courage of its convictions and allows to give oneself a good conscience by accusing others, to take their responsibility away ...

Advertising works very well for a large majority of the population. Those who make the effort to unravel it and describe its strings are not numerous ... You will find them on this forum for example ... If the TF1 spectators had a little critical sense, they would change the channel ... (you surely know that if the national channels no longer advertise in the evening, it is to increase the sale of advertising space therefore the profits of TF1).

[Alain G]

Hello Europeans!

The only place where the Europeans are ahead of the Amaricans is at the Diesel level, American gasoline cars are the most efficient in the world in terms of fuel economy if you take into account the weight / power / drag ratio.

The Europeans have tried over and over again to take the North American market without more or less results, the Japanese have gained the upper hand on 2 waves of barrel increases and the Americans who do not have an adapted vehicle have been caught again and ate it all for the second time.

Note that the Volks, Audi, Saab, BMW and Mercedes do not always have a very good reputation for reliability.

Do not underestimate the Americans who have patents galore on many things in the automotive field, it is they who invented reliability on cars, unfortunately sales take precedence and the ingenuous works so that the automobiles are renewed every 6 years.

Fortunately the VE or Hyb prototypes. are on the roads in testing and from here can on our side of the ocean we will see them driving more and more on our roads.

[Obamot]

Did you know that here, when you import an American, you have even more worries than with a German? Definitely in the future I will take a Toyot or a Hond @ if I have a little more wheat in the boots but as I intend to drive with the potato, I would then choose the engine which is going well ...

[Alain G]

My dear Obamot, I have been driving a Chrysler for many years and I can tell you that they far exceed the reliability of ToyToys and Honda on many points, I have never had an engine that failed with 5 vehicles beyond 350km and 000 beyond 4km and I have a heavy foot, multiple injection since 300 while toyota was still a carburetor, stainless steel muffler since 000 while the niponne we go back, not to mention maintenance, couroie timing while chrysler is chain and so on, honda do not know how to make powerful and reliable engines, well naturally I am not talking about GM who have never been able to make reliable 1984 cylinders but hey.

Chrysler would not have sold 15 million Caravans and eaten all the competition if it had not been reliable.

[Obamot]

Here, interesting your testimony. The engine okay, but the other breakdowns? What is your annual repair budget (approximately, average) ...

Personally, I am at 2500 US $ per year, including the depreciation share of the vehicle ... But I only drive with the occasion (only one new volvo in my life ... and more never that). When the repair is impossible or costs too much, I take another vehicle ...

[Alain G]

Here, interesting your testimony. The engine okay, but the other breakdowns? What is your annual repair budget (approximately, average) ...

Personally, I am at 2500 US $ per year, including the depreciation share of the vehicle ... But I only drive with the occasion (only one new volvo in my life ... and more never that). When the repair is impossible or costs too much, I take another vehicle ...

My repair average is around $ 800 CDN per 100 km including oil changes, so not much, the problems are generally on the warranty.

I bought two and a half years ago a Plymouth Breeze 2 96 Cylinders 4 liters (chrysler engine and not Mitsubitshi which is rotten) it has driven 2.4 kms until now for a repair and purchase price including tires of only $ 130 CDN and it still drives perfectly well despite its 000 kilometers without taking a drop of oil and in much more difficult conditions given the temperature we have here in Quebec, moreover all my Chryslers start very well under - 3400C without block heater, moreover even if it comes standard I have never used them.

Here is my personal car, a 2007 Dodge Charger based on a Mercedes 500 series, 3.5 liter high output engine, 18 "rims:

[pb2488]

If GM is bankrupt it is because they refused to adapt, to modernize to make, in the short term, profits while the competitors, Japanese, invested in research to offer products of better quality and more efficient (more economical).

This is what I say: Manufacturers adapt to demand otherwise they die.

This proves that design, power, luxury and safety are not the essential criteria ofpart of the clientele.

Yes, a part and each part of the demand, if it is sufficient, has its supply which is developing opposite. But in France for the moment, this part (very economical and / or first price car) is not in the majority. The logan and sandero did not impose themselves on the market. And anyway for a long time, it is not the most economical cars, the cheapest which dominate sales in France, proof that the offer is well in phase with the demand (it is not the extremes which are selling the more).

As an attentive observer of the evolution of technologies, I can tell you that the manufacturers BRAKE 2 FEET so as not to make their vehicles evolve.

????? Unfounded ... Especially considering the budget invested in R&D and the quantity of new technologies that are unloading (example: the Japanese you mention). And they have more of an interest in a competitive environment if they don't want to suffer the same fate as GM.

Advertising works very well for a large majority of the population. Those who make the effort to unravel it and describe its tricks are not numerous ...

Finally, I do not know many people who say: "long live the pub" and who delight in reading it, it is rather the opposite ....

If the TF1 spectators had a bit of a critical sense, they would change the channel ... (you surely know that if the national channels no longer advertise in the evening, it is to increase the sale of advertising space and therefore the profits from TF1).

Lol, TF1, the big bad guys ..... everyone says that ....
Advertising space has increased on TF1 ???
Not sure it's good for the audience to add advertising .....

In short, cars for sale are always adapted to consumer demand if the technique allows it, that's why manufacturers make profits. They have no choice, their industry is in fierce competition.
Cars "(more) very economical" will arrive on the market when French consumers want / have to buy them, manufacturers will have no choice but to adapt their offers within the limits of physics and technology. They do not necessarily seek to make bigger cars: they essentially seek to adapt better and as quickly as possible to consumer demand, otherwise they sink.
This video shows that it's just a matter of consumer demand:
https://www.econologie.com/voiture-a-1l-aux-100km-telechargement-4142.html
And this graph clearly shows the link between consumption and price per liter (demand / purchasing power):


Cdlt

[Aumicron]

Just a remark concerning the discussions on the subject automobile / manufacturer / customer: they are generally too simplistic and simplistic by omission of an almost essential player in the process.

It is THE DISTRIBUTION NETWORK which is an intermediary mainly "independent" from the manufacturer but which must be taken into account in your reasoning.

[Obamot]

My repair average is around $ 800 CDN per 100 km including oil changes, so not much, the problems are generally on the warranty.

Ok, that's not too much.

I bought two and a half years ago a Plymouth Breeze 2 96 Cylinders 4 liters (chrysler engine and not Mitsubitshi which is rotten) it has driven 2.4 kms until now for a repair and purchase price including tires of only $ 130 CDN and it still drives perfectly well despite its 000 kilometers without taking a drop of oil and in much more difficult conditions given the temperature we have here in Quebec,

You mean you got this tank for this price with a set of new tires? If so, then it's cheap. How many km it had on the odometer at the time of purchase and what starting price did you pay it, ~ 1800 piastres?