Human societies all is confidence!

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Christophe
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Human societies all is confidence!




by Christophe » 04/05/12, 09:33

I just realized (what is a bit late) that the (good) functioning of human societies (and animals in the broad sense) was based on one thing only: trust !

If trust is there, instead of mistrust, then society works well ... Otherwise it hangs. Without trust, you no longer have a life plan, without trust, you do not live anymore ...

It is valid for all aspects of life: friendship, private, professional, mercantile ... etc etc ... even the intimate life and leisure ...

I have on this subject an interesting survey realized by that interests me in 2010 ... which gives a ranking of the confidence following the trades ... I will post it here ...

Screenshot 2021-11-19 at 10-21-09 25 quotes to regain self-confidence.png
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moinsdewatt
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Re: Human societies: everything is trust!




by moinsdewatt » 04/05/12, 11:25

Christophe wrote:I just realized (what is a bit late) that the (good) functioning of human societies (and animals in the broad sense) was based on one thing only: trust !
... i ...


And better late than never ......

Of course. Have you ever wondered about this before in your relationship with your bank or employer?

And the currency? Huh? It's just that, trust. When you get a ticket for 50 €, you have the confidence that you can put it back in a future store to buy you a garment or something else.
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Re: Human societies: everything is trust!




by sen-no-sen » 04/05/12, 13:40

moinsdewatt wrote:
And the currency? Huh? It's just that, trust. When you get a ticket for 50 €, you have the confidence that you can put it back in a future store to buy you a garment or something else.


On a daily basis and for "the man in the street" it is more an automatism than a real confidence.
This being so it is clear that the financial market works on trust.

Christophe wrote:

I just realized (what is a bit late) that the (good) functioning of human societies (and animals in the broad sense) was based on one thing only: trust!



The notion of trust applying to the animal kingdom is somewhat exaggerated, we must speak instinctively.
This notion can only take on value when the human is involved.
To tame an animal is in a way a form of "confidence" that he gives us, but from there to say that they trust each other seems hazardous to me.
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by elephant » 04/05/12, 13:56

Sen-no sen said:

it is clear that the financial market works on trust.


Very clear: traders work with 5's top assets at 7 times the funds on deposit in their bank, it seems.
(But in fact, the titles they hold serve de facto guarantee: a bit like when you buy a house: you are unable to pay cash, but in case of problems it is still there, ready to be resold, limiting the risk )
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by dedeleco » 04/05/12, 14:57

Even our cells interact with each other in confidence to make us live, to defend ourselves against aggression, viruses, bacteria, trust that even goes to the suicide sacrifice to save other cells (apoptosis) and that includes milking as in cancer,who live for them, forgetting others,.

Multicellular organisms are dramatically more complex than our society, a much more complex cooperation in trust that remains to be discovered for the most part.
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by Christophe » 04/05/12, 15:38

Ah ah dedeleco, beautiful approach!

Obviously I did not mention finance and currency because I had included them in "purchases" ... obviously without trust, no finance!

But glad that you leave in this direction (do not go too far anyway ...)
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by sen-no-sen » 04/05/12, 16:29

dedeleco wrote:Even our cells interact with each other in confidence to make us live, to defend ourselves against aggression, viruses, bacteria, trust that even goes to the suicide sacrifice to save other cells (apoptosis) and that includes milking as in cancer,who live for them, forgetting others,.

Multicellular organisms are dramatically more complex than our society, a much more complex cooperation in trust that remains to be discovered for the most part.



Talking about trust in cells or the animal / plant kingdom is anthropomorphism.
In the case of a cell, we must speak of compatibility.

Trust is a human feeling, it is a psychological improvement of the natural instinct.
This psychological notion vanishes quickly in the animal / plant world.
An antelope, for example, knows instinctively that it will not be devoured by one of its congeners, no one is a question of confidence, but acquired reflexes (innate?) During his learning of life.

We must not confuse a human feeling with universal instincts or principles.
Trust / mistrust is exactly like good and bad: human concepts born of the complexity of our psychology.
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Re: Human societies: everything is trust!




by Obamot » 04/05/12, 16:31

elephant lessdewatt, sen-no-sen: The paradox, is not it precisely because we are afraid that we use money? The insurance'? (To which we can relate the paper money or sounding ...) So because we can hardly trust ?!

Dedeleco: I agree and I like, but I mostly see a metaphor, or we should admit an interaction between our brain and our cells (which have no cortex individually, so they do not "do not thinkIt's more of a relationship with thephysiological needs», In this case, trust is something completely tacit ...) and admit that these interactions / connections would be suprabiological (therefore a power of the mind over the body ... and there is still "field of belief", if I believe your many positions on this subject?)
In the case of cancer, there is no "breach of trust" according to some researchers (named here many times) since the body would develop cancer .."Because he needs it"! (since the toxin elimination circuit, would be lacking)

Christophe wrote:Human societies all is confidence!

Yes, yes and again yes. She is born ofneed security(So ​​well hierarchical individually, as A. Masslow has studied). Fundamental! From there, we can reflect on the role of instinct (as noted by Sen-no-sen) ... to dig. But for animals, they trust themselves "to a certain extent", and it varies from one species to another (in some species there are getteurs: and clearly the security of the group rests on them .. .)

Christophe wrote:everything is trust!
individuals [VS] society

We could even add "mutual trust" then - and that can not be just instinct anymore - is not it? Because, for there to be trust, there must be reciprocity, therefore a conscious process of mutual respect. I would also see in particular a beautiful place towards altruism. This is for the main principles.

In terms of "society", it becomes more complex. Since citizens have rights and duties. It is the confidence in the learning of "socialization".

On the other hand, a respect imposed by coercion is not sincere - especially if there is no counterpart [reciprocity] - so it is not a guarantee of social trust, nor of long-term security. .. since founded on repression. From there we can write books on the estoppel ... : Lol:
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Re: Human societies: everything is trust!




by sen-no-sen » 04/05/12, 16:50

Obamot wrote:elephant lessdewatt, sen-no-sen: The paradox, is not it precisely because we are afraid that we use money? The insurance'? (To which we can relate the paper money or sounding ...) So because we can hardly trust ?!


As you mentioned, this is part of our need for security.
Moreover any confidence is relative ...


One could even add "mutual trust" then - and there it can not be only instinct - is not it?


A parallel can be drawn between "mutual trust" and symbiosis.
In social relations the latter is more related to a notion of mutual benefit than true altruism.
Do you seriously think that your bank would lend you money without any consideration?

As for social security, it is a societal choice aimed at ensuring a balance in the same society in order to perpetuate it, and here again there is a notion of interest.


* The bank / customer relationship is closer to parasitism!
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by Obamot » 04/05/12, 17:06

There are many forms of reciprocity in altruism! These are other "Indirect graces":

- The wish that others find happiness => which then makes their own happiness! As...
- The initiation of others.
- The valorization of social relations based on other bases than the lucrative aspect.
- The promotion of all these values ​​that "raise the spirit" (artistic, cultural, etc.).
- The love of the neighbor ...
...etc.

The interest, too, is that there is no "guarantee! "
If there is reciprocity, it is therefore a "plus" which gives even more pleasure ... :D
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