Change my oil boiler against a wooden logs boiler

Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ... short thermal comfort. Insulation, wood energy, heat pumps but also electricity, gas or oil, VMC ... Help in choosing and implementation, problem solving, optimization, tips and tricks ...
julnoel
I discovered econologic
I discovered econologic
posts: 2
Registration: 26/07/11, 21:10

Change my oil boiler against a wooden logs boiler




by julnoel » 26/07/11, 22:08

Hello

I want to change a fuel oil boiler against a wood-fired boiler.

-Does the installation be plug and play?

- Should I have an additional storage tank on the boiler water circuit to maximize the use of calories in the circuit? (Another electric balloon is planned for the summer).

- In the event of an electrical failure, the water circulators do not work, but the boiler still burns (apparently), and therefore continues to heat the same water ... big worries :( Are there any overpressure valves or other solution .. any beast) ???

Thank you for your answers :)))
0 x
User avatar
Philippe Schutt
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 1611
Registration: 25/12/05, 18:03
Location: Alsace
x 33




by Philippe Schutt » 26/07/11, 22:50

plug and play no

Yes, it's better with a balloon

Yes, there are recognized means of controlling the water T ° in the event of a power failure
0 x
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 79125
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 10974




by Christophe » 26/07/11, 22:52

Hi and welcome,

answers:

- No for the following 2 points.

- Yes it is very preferable for comfort (but not compulsory because the DHW tank and the heating network, which is so strong as inertia, such as heating boards, can make a buffer)

- Yes ca it injects cold water into the boiler (100% thermomechanical without current therefore). You can see it in this picture. Thermal probe on the top outlet, bottom injection (my boiler stove): Image

https://www.econologie.com/forums/chaudiere- ... t4589.html

The worry is that depending on the pressure of your safety group and the water of your network, this one can trigger ... and therefore create a small flood if no evacuation at this level, time that the probe Heat is cooled ...

The heating in boiler woods buches is very constraining (I tested) the water yield of the installations not terrible, the fouling can be important: are you absolutely on wanting to choose this solution? If you pay 50 € or more stere, really think about it before!

In your place I would keep my old oil boiler and I would complement with wood ... at least the time to test the wood ...

Look at this message https://www.econologie.com/forums/post208393.html#208393 Of this topic https://www.econologie.com/forums/plan-de-ra ... 10985.html
0 x
dedeleco
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 9211
Registration: 16/01/10, 01:19
x 10




by dedeleco » 27/07/11, 03:17

My personal response to similar cases, keeping the old heating system as a certainty of backup heating and adding the free wood heating Which I see thrown or burnt everywhere as explained on my answer:
https://www.econologie.com/forums/post208960.html#208960

The efficiency of a wood boiler can be good if large exchanger with good combustion (not the case of Christophe's photo) and as the exchanger fills with ashes, an automatic system of cleaning the exchanger (shaken grid) What makes boilers expensive !!!

My cheap solution: stove or basic insert with ducts of hot air circulation that heat the different rooms and even a large house is well heated well in one of my home, which allows huge savings with wood gratis , thrown everywhere that just recover !!

The wood requires more work, if gratis, pick it up, saw it (on unusual windthrow), dry it, rescue (good exercise for health if sawed by hand), remove the ashes and sweep the chimney often (dirty) !!
Pruning a large tree by a professional 800 € is easy and so if you do it for free at home or neighbors (plus in my case the trees blocked my view !!) you save huge !!
0 x
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 79125
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 10974




by Christophe » 27/07/11, 10:06

Speaking of recovering woodfall, it's cutting quite a bit in my corner right now ...

But I'm afraid that if I do, it's badly seen and I'm called a thief ...

A wood waste that starts from what size / diameter of branch? There is still a lot of waste from the 1er debitage as well ... (massive trunk pieces therefore)
0 x
User avatar
Did67
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 20362
Registration: 20/01/08, 16:34
Location: Alsace
x 8685




by Did67 » 27/07/11, 11:38

1) Wood why not, provided that:

A) to have it for not too expensive: do it yourself (very good, unbeatable price and the sport gratos more), recover it (reserved for a few) ...

If you buy it, know that from 50 € the stere, the pellets is not more expensive, fully automatable ... and cleaner.

(B) burning it with an efficient boiler, ideally a microprocessor boiler that controls and optimizes combustion; If not, ecologically, even if it is CO2-neutral, it borders on the ecological disaster from the point of view of other emissions. Several countries have legislated with standards that will become more and more severe and quaisment impose where catalysis or particle filter or both!

Wood, without these details, is often presented as "green". Knowing that green does not mean anything and that it is marketing!

Well, in France, it is always permissible to do anything. Is this a sufficient reason ???

c) to work with a buffer so as not to have to regulate the fire "by suffocation" (regulation by the air supply). In this case, without a buffer, 3/4 of the time, it will be necessary to "restrain" the combustion, therefore pollute and ... accept a yield that can become deplorable (inevitably: the fire "smokes" as much as it burns; c may be good for ham, but not for nature)

The solution in this case is the buffer, which stores heat from an entire outbreak. It is always flaming thoroughly, with good combustion and good yield. Stored in the buffer.

The regulation will then use the calories of the buffer as and when needed, for a day or two or three ...

Attention, a buffer is not a balloon / DHW cylinder from 200 or 300 l. It's something like 1 500 to 2 000 l. It is often confused.

In addition to the quality of combustion and efficiency, this also has the advantage of being hot "as with fuel" while avoiding the chore of fire between two outbreaks. Ideally, the focus and buffer are calculated for one outbreak per day ...

In short, it's not "plug and play" at all.
0 x
dedeleco
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 9211
Registration: 16/01/10, 01:19
x 10




by dedeleco » 27/07/11, 12:34

A wood waste that starts from what size / diameter of branch?

There is no limit, provided that it can be burned properly which is always possible if it has been dried and kept dry.
The smaller and finer it burns quickly and strongly, like needles, leaves (so dry with air around), sawdust, small woods, which ask to put in incessantly in small quantity all the more often that " They are fine, just as for pellets, which are a means of controlling the combustion of sawdust, compacted into small grains, each of which burns rather badly.

Some made pellet leaves that work !!

Unfortunately, stoves are not with automatic introduction of anything, except very expensive boilers (pads, etc ...) and the standards of pellets are just an adaptation to pellet stoves not well designed, in my opinion , Which trap customers to make them pay dearly.

So if you have the patience to put them on regularly, every few minutes, or the imagination of realizing an automatic system of introduction of small wood, one can burn anything dry.
Dry is possible in the summer sun and also pre-drying at 40 ° C or closer to the stove one day before with water vapor making its calories by condensing on the cold walls of the drying room (possibility of drying This type with air fan that goes over a cold condenser after)
Another solution is to pass it to the grinder and burn it like wafers or granules in an improved stove.
Alternatively, they can be converted into pellets in one of the small commercial pellet machines for private use.

An example to not expensive to consider because automatic without motor:
https://www.econologie.com/forums/post208489.html#208489

Example (in Ariege in the Pyrenees, very wooded):
http://nrjboisud.over-blog.com/
http://www.energie-bois-sud.com/
Click on stove and see pdf with price !!

Model to 680 € TTC:

http://www.energie-bois-sud.com/pdf/Poe ... 0_2011.pdf
To 1130 € TTC
http://www.energie-bois-sud.com/pdf/Poe ... 0_2011.pdf

Kcal./h are to be divided by 4,18 / 3600 divided by 861 (or multiplied by 0,00116) and therefore simple stoves with platelets from 15 to 40KW about !!

Otherwise we must be able to design a simple original automatic feeding system that does not get stuck, like raclette that brings and powerful vibrator that loosens if necessary.
Well designed vibrations are very effective at moving powder or small objects. Nobody uses it, while a simple motor with a weight (or unbalance) is enough to make powerful vibrations that move anything!
So in my opinion the manufacturers lack real imagination by copying all !!!

I see full of possibilities never exploited, because then the customer spends nothing, what the pros systematically avoid!
0 x
dedeleco
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 9211
Registration: 16/01/10, 01:19
x 10




by dedeleco » 27/07/11, 12:58

Did67 proposes only what exists and not what is possible with imagination and that the pros avoid or reserve large enormous machines (under the false pretense that it is impossible to small).

It was the same in the 50s - 60s for the microwave oven (radar magnetron very expensive to machine !!) and the Japanese demonstrated that it was possible at low cost for the general public, while US firms, especially military ones , said it was impossible !!

0n can do the same for stoves, good combustion, automatic, burning anything out of a cheap crusher !!
It is much easier than for the microwave oven !!

But the pros will never do it, multiplying the complexity unnecessarily !!!
Standards with lobby under various pretexts eco are a good opportunity to block and trap the user and make pay a max !!

Result what is initially free sawdust, lost wood, becomes a cash pump, a little below other fuels. (300 € and more per tonne often for pellets in the Paris region as http://www.bergon.fr/index.php/bois/granule-de-bois-eo2
http://www.granulesbois.com/prix-granulesbois.htm
http://www.chaudiere-pellets.com/prix-c ... ules-bois/
)
0 x
dedeleco
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 9211
Registration: 16/01/10, 01:19
x 10




by dedeleco » 27/07/11, 13:52

Christophe:
If I do, it is badly seen and they call me a thief ...


A simple criterion, if at the end of 10 years (storm of end 1999) the wood was not picked up, it is clear that it will never be, already well rotten !!

Another criterion, recover the wood that your neighbor burns badly outdoors smoking you for days (my case)!

Ask neighbors if not.

Recover before the wood delivered to waste by your neighbors, enormous around my home !!
Transform your residence into a wooden waste collection center for your neighbors who will go less far !!

To prune gratis the great trees of your neighbors, who will say yes seen the 800 € asked by tree by the pruning professionals!
0 x
User avatar
Did67
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 20362
Registration: 20/01/08, 16:34
Location: Alsace
x 8685




by Did67 » 27/07/11, 14:34

I just answer the questions. I remember:

Hello

I want to change a fuel oil boiler against a wood-fired boiler.

-Does the installation be plug and play?

- Should I have an additional storage tank on the boiler water circuit to maximize the use of calories in the circuit? (Another electric balloon is planned for the summer).


Not the impression that julnoel intends to invent "heating à la déséléco", that is to say either to remain seated beside to add twigs and dried leaves in a wood stove, nor to 'invent the automatic brushless super-boiler that these ugly manufacturers refuse to invent despite heavy, repeated, far-sighted insistence, in short, so so genius in dedéco!

Dede, I also remind you that when you heat yourself entirely and exclusively as you do the bowls on every occasion, I will start listening to you (question wood-fired and pellets, I have been in total agreement with you On other topics). Always your good old gas boiler with regulation on / off ????
0 x

 


  • Similar topics
    Replies
    views
    Last message

Back to "Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ..."

Who is online ?

Users browsing this forum : No registered users and 268 guests