Heat well or just heat ...

Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ... short thermal comfort. Insulation, wood energy, heat pumps but also electricity, gas or oil, VMC ... Help in choosing and implementation, problem solving, optimization, tips and tricks ...
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kumkat
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Heat well or just heat ...




by kumkat » 09/02/11, 12:21

A question bothers me about the heating temperature of the house
is it better to heat permanently to 18,5 ° c day and night
or at 19 ° c when we are present and 17 ° c absent and at night?
what will consume the least? I find that my boiler is rowing a lot in case 1, it takes almost 2 hours to gain the 2 ° c ...
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by Christophe » 09/02/11, 12:51

Rolala is spinning the kumkat right now! :) 8)

This question has already been raised back and forth across, here for example: https://www.econologie.com/forums/faut-il-co ... t1546.html
https://www.econologie.com/forums/chauffage- ... 10264.html

For heated floors: https://www.econologie.com/forums/abaissemen ... t9946.html

In fact, I think it is like for the DHW water heater, the optimal solution is to be defined on a case by case basis ... (solar gains, building inertia ...)
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by Obamot » 09/02/11, 15:12

Exactly. I have already noticed for old buildings, that thinking of saving at the start of the season requires a lot of energy expenditure thereafter to stabilize the temperature of the house at a "habitable" temperature. Question of inertia ... each house being different ... so it's case by case ... Believing to save money, ultimately we spend more we have to see if the game is worth the effort.

It is better to study the insulation, to put windows with double glazing etc bring much more savings, than to think of controlling the expenses as well.
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by kumkat » 09/02/11, 15:30

Christophe wrote:Rolala is spinning the kumkat right now! :) 8)


for once I am in the company of people more knowledgeable than me on these subjects I take full advantage! :-)
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by kumkat » 09/02/11, 15:31

Obamot wrote:Exactly. I have already noticed for old buildings, that thinking of saving at the start of the season requires a lot of energy expenditure thereafter to stabilize the temperature of the house at a "habitable" temperature. Question of inertia ... each house being different ... so it's case by case ... Believing to save money, ultimately we spend more we have to see if the game is worth the effort.

It is better to study the insulation, to put windows with double glazing etc bring much more savings, than to think of controlling the expenses as well.


So basically I will have to do the gas consumption readings every day by testing the two settings to see what is happening ...
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by dedeleco » 09/02/11, 15:45

Savings at the end of the candle compared to what is possible by insulating, with the summer solar stored for the winter, and by reducing especially the taxes and taxes of dwellings and property, approaching at home the triple of my heating of house of almost 40 years !!

And scientifically, the gas consumption statement is the only credible way to know the economy (with identical external T conditions between the two cases !!)
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by Obamot » 09/02/11, 15:50

kumkat wrote:
Obamot wrote:Exactly. I have already noticed for old buildings, that thinking of saving at the start of the season requires a lot of energy expenditure thereafter to stabilize the temperature of the house at a "habitable" temperature. Question of inertia ... each house being different ... so it's case by case ... Believing to save money, ultimately we spend more we have to see if the game is worth the effort.

It is better to study the insulation, to put windows with double glazing etc bring much more savings, than to think of controlling the expenses as well.


So basically I will have to do the gas consumption readings every day by testing the two settings to see what is happening ...
... excellent, you got it all!
It is therefore necessary to make two readings ... and compare them over periods of similar temperatures, as Dédé says, and if possible with the same rate of humidity ... (already harder ... question of not being fooled for a question of "comfort") it is not an easy task!

There is better to do, as Dedelco says!
Last edited by Obamot the 09 / 02 / 11, 15: 52, 1 edited once.
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by kumkat » 09/02/11, 15:51

mouai except that the thermostat of sarko is called karlita and that i don't want to tackle this big sausage there ...
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by Did67 » 09/02/11, 17:35

kumkat wrote:So basically I will have to do the gas consumption readings every day by testing the two settings to see what is happening ...


1) I share the opinion that lowering is only an economy at the margins. You can scrape two or three calories, but that's not where the savings will come from.

This is of course through insulation, possibly the "neutralization" of poorly used parts of our homes. Windows, if they are airtight, and unless they have enormous surfaces, are not a sinkhole; replacement by double glazing is then not a jackpot (which does not mean that it should not be done - but TRI of the order of magnitude of 15 years)

2) To have the hope of measuring "something" representative, as there will never be two sufficiently long periods strictly identical, I think that it is appropriate:

- record the outdoor temp, with a step of half an hour for example

- likewise to record the interior temp

(so have two identical USB recording thermometers - calibrate them: in the same place, check that there is no significant difference!)

- all for example during a week with lowering and a week without lowering

- with an Excel, calculate the internal temp - outdoor temp difference (in absolute value) for each half hour and each of smodes

- sum these differences for each of the two modes

In the absence of sun (warms the walls, contributions by berries), wind (increases losses) and other sources of heat in the house (stove, but also a party at 15 = 15 x 100 W!) , we will have an index of "climate need".

By dividing the consumption recorded for each of the periods by this index, we will know which system is the most efficient and which is the idea of ​​economy.
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Re: Heat well or just heat ...




by swift2540 » 09/02/11, 19:15

kumkat wrote:A question bothers me about the heating temperature of the house
is it better to heat permanently to 18,5 ° c day and night
or at 19 ° c when we are present and 17 ° c absent and at night?
what will consume the least?

Since the 70s and the 1st oil crisis, engineers have determined that the strongest economy is a nighttime decrease (nighttime = night + unmanned) from 4 ° to 5 ° compared to daytime temp.
I don't see why insulating a house would change anything?
Now, I would distinguish 2 cases:
- mid-season
-the great cold.
I think that in mid-season, no discussion, 8h of night = 8h without boiler AND 8h without circulator (its consumption is marked above)
For the extreme cold, several parameters must be seen, on a case-by-case basis
kumkat wrote: I find that my boiler is rowing a lot in case 1, it takes almost 2 hours to gain the 2 ° c ...

What do you mean by "rowing"?
-The boiler works continuously for 2 hours? In this case, it is really just ... Or did you enlarge and leave the old boiler?
-The boiler works intermittently for 2 hours BUT it takes 2 hours for the house to heat up? In that case:
-or the radiators are too small (poorly dimensioned)
-or the boiler temp is too low (eg 60 ° while the boiler can operate at 80 °)
-or the pipes are too small
-or the circulator is rubbish.
2examples:
1) at my place, ordinary boiler, mid-season setting 50 ° c, this winter 75 ° (-5 to -10 ° c ext), current 65 ° (frost limit at night, 8 ° during the day, but it is at early in the morning it is the coldest). Switching on the thermostat 1 / 4H + early.
2) With a girlfriend, condensing boiler, setting between 40 ° and 55 ° as long as possible to benefit from the condensation. In very cold in the evening she puts the boiler "to full" (85 °) for the 1st hour of heating in the morning, then goes down (int temp obtained in 1 hour) to 55 ° for the day, sufficient to keep the desired temperature and condensation still works. No change to the thermostat.
NB: the temperatures are to be understood from the boiler, the returns being + or- 10 ° lower
Here are 2 installations, 2 solutions ... There are many others!
Tell us more about your installation, we can help you more effectively
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