Food, fasting: possibilities and limits on Health

[Janic]

Used for millennia, fasting has fallen into disuse and returns to the front of the media and medical scene only during protest fasts, intended to exert pressure, and considered as a slow form of suicide.
However, fasting according to an expression often used, it is "a total purification" and whose initial destination is on the contrary the reverse of a slow suicide.
Natural medicines often called hygienists have restored this important role of deep cleaning almost impossible by other means or in any case over a much longer period and without identical results elsewhere.
Internet is full of information on fasting (I say because according to the philosophies on this one the approaches can be different even contradictory) therefore for people interested in the subject, see already the opinions expressed on the forums and possibly, within the limits of my knowledge, I am prepared for some additional and perhaps contradictory explanations as well.

[antoinet111]

Personally, I do not know, according to you, how long, how often and are we allowed to drink?

Is Ramadan a form of fasting?

and when you have a physical job, should you wait to be on vacation?

[stipe]

Personally, I do not know, according to you, how long, how often and are we allowed to drink?

Is Ramadan a form of fasting?

and when you have a physical job, should you wait to be on vacation?

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Je%C3%BBne

yes, during Ramadan we fast, sometimes (for some) during Lent or, Yom Kippur for the Jews too.

In my opinion, it is advisable to adapt your physical activity a little when you are young.

[Janic]

Antoine hello

Personally, I do not know, according to you, how long, how often and are we allowed to drink?

A real fast is a total abstinence from solid and liquid food, but only accessible to a few rare people or in a state of impossibility of absorption like after having swallowed an acid or a coma (although this defect of hydration is currently compensated by probes) So what is called fasting is actually a water fast. The amount of liquid to be absorbed is intimately dependent on the need for elimination and therefore important at the start of the fast and decreases with the duration of the fast (taking also into account physical expenses, heat or cold, etc.). when we do not eat there is an incessant need to drink which can range from one liter to 3 or 4 liters per day of plain mineral water or infusions more pleasant to take.

Is Ramadan a form of fasting?

Ramadan in two directions:
a) Religious, so I cannot speak on this subject
b) Physiological.
Physiologically, Ramadan is a false fast in the sense that it only displaces food consumption from day to night. Then, it causes a disturbance of the biological clock during this period and suppresses the most important part of the nervous recovery which is done at the beginning of the night. Plus the fatty and sugary overconsumption that crowns it all.
But that would only be serious if this mode were definitively adopted for the rest of the year; so we can consider this as a festive moment comparable to other festive moments from other cultures.

and when you have a physical job, should you wait to be on vacation?

It all depends on the duration of the fast and the importance of this physical activity. On a day even with a very physical job this water fast can hardly be felt. On the contrary, even this activity promotes elimination by the emunctories (urine, sweat) and the energy ordinarily used for digestion becomes available for this activity.
On 2 to 3 days it is the same except that it is necessary to take care of the regular eliminations by the stools if necessary with a laxative or a saline purge (so it is necessary to be documented beforehand on the subject). On the other hand the holidays are favorable since no professional obligation can come to oppose this plan fasting and the spirit is more concentrated there, it is obvious.
for what is Lent (I know nothing about religion) I think it's a diet, a simple food reduction and probably the same for Kippur !?

[sen-no-sen]

Ramadan fasting, as it is practiced in our industrialized countries, can have harmful effects on health.
Indeed, the younger generations tend to adopt diets that are too fatty and especially too sweet.
The body is put on a diet during the day, is when the evening arrives the hunger is calmed down with soda (coke etc.) and fatty product (fast food), which produces carbohydrate peaks which can have significant consequences in the long run on health, like diabetes for example.

[antoinet111]

ok, however, regarding the duration and frequency in the year?

Thank you for your answers.
Tony.

[Janic]

ok, however, regarding the duration and frequency in the year?

Thank you for your answers.
Tony.

difficult to say because it depends on the objective and the duration of the fast itself! if it is a day it can be repeated every week. If it is 3 days for example once a month and if it is more than once per quarter, per semester or per year; as an interview. But we are more in the feeling than in a rational logic.
If it is for therapeutic reasons, it depends on what you want to "treat": it depends on the reactions of the organism which can sometimes be unpleasant or even impressive (this is why it is necessary to be accompanied by an experienced faster. in these cases) and this is what scares neophytes and medics who know nothing about it.

[dedeleco]

Used for millennia, fasting has fallen into disuse and returns to the front of the media and medical scene only during protest fasts, intended to exert pressure, and considered as a slow form of suicide.
However, fasting according to an expression often used, it is "a total purification" and whose initial destination is on the contrary the reverse of a slow suicide.
Natural medicines often called hygienists have restored this important role of deep cleaning almost impossible by other means or in any case over a much longer period and without identical results elsewhere.
Internet is full of information on fasting (I say because according to the philosophies on this one the approaches can be different even contradictory) therefore for people interested in the subject, see already the opinions expressed on the forums and possibly, within the limits of my knowledge, I am prepared for some additional and perhaps contradictory explanations as well.

As usual, janic makes no reference to scientific studies, , promising prove the advantage of not eating too much, like the one I put yesterday very recent which shows that fasting on mice is as effective as chemotherapy on certain cancers !!!! [/ b]
This study gave Janic the idea for this post, who thinks of instinct absolutely in a non-scientific way.

http://medicalxpress.com/news/2012-02-s ... -mice.html

Short fasting cycles work as well as chemotherapy in mice
February 8, 2012 in Cancer

Man may not live by bread alone, but cancer in animals appears less resilient, judging by a study that found chemotherapy drugs work better when combined with cycles of short, severe fasting.
Even fasting on its own effectively treated a majority of cancers tested in animals, including cancers from human cells.

The study in Science Translational Medicine, part of the Science family of journals, found that five out of eight cancer types in mice responded to fasting alone: ​​Just as with chemotherapy, fasting slowed the growth and spread of tumors.

And without exception, "the combination of fasting cycles plus chemotherapy was either more or much more effective than chemo alone,"said senior author Valter Longo, professor of gerontology and biological sciences at the University of Southern California.

For example, multiple cycles of fasting combined with chemotherapy cured 20 percent of mice with a highly aggressive type of children's cancer that had spread throughout the organism and 40 percent of mice with a more limited spread of the same cancer.

No mice survived in either case if treated only with chemotherapy.

Only a clinical trial lasting several years can demonstrate whether humans would benefit from the same treatment, Longo bailed.

Results from the first phase of a clinical trial with breast, urinary tract and ovarian cancer patients, conducted at the USC Norris Comprehensive Cancer Center and led by oncologists Tanya Dorff and David Quinn, in collaboration with Longo, have been submitted for presentation at the annual meeting of the American Society of Cancer Oncologists.

The first phase tests only the safety of a therapy, in this case whether patients can tolerate short-term fasts of two days before and one day after chemotherapy.

"We don't know whether in humans it's effective," Longo said of fasting as a cancer therapy. "It should be off limits to patients, but a patient should be able to go to their oncologist and say, 'What about fasting with chemotherapy or without if chemotherapy was not recommended or considered?"
In a case report study with self-reported data published in the journal Aging in 2010, 10 cancer patients who tried fasting cycles perceived fewer side side from chemotherapy.

Longo stressed that fasting may not be safe for everyone. The clinical trial did not enroll patients who already had lost more than 10 percent of their normal weight or who had other risk factors, such as diabetes. Fasting also can cause a drop in blood pressure and headaches, which could make driving and other activities dangerous for some patients.

In mice, the study found that fasting cycles without chemotherapy could slow the growth of breast cancer, melanoma, glioma and human neuroblastoma. In several cases, the fasting cycles were as effective as chemotherapy.

Fasting also extended survival in mice bearing a human ovarian cancer. In the case of melanoma, the cancer cells became resistant to fasting alone after a single round, but the single cycle of fasting was as effective as chemotherapy in reducing the spread of cancer to other organs.

For all cancers tested, fasting combined with chemotherapy improved survival, slowed tumor growth and / or limited the spread of tumors.

As with any potential cancer treatment, fasting has its limits. The growth of large tumor masses was reduced by multiple fasting and chemotherapy cycles, but cancer-free survival could not be achieved. Longo speculated that cells inside a large tumor may be protected in some way or that the variety of mutations in a large mass may make it more adaptable.

But he noted that in most patients, oncologists have at least one chance to attack the cancer before it grows too large.

Longo and collaborators at the National Institute on Aging studied one type of breast cancer in detail to try to understand the effects of fasting.

While normal cells deprived of nutrients enter a dormant state similar to hibernation, the researchers saw that the cancer cells tried to make new proteins and took other steps to keep growing and dividing.

The result, Longo said, was a "cascade of events" that led to the creation of damaging free radical molecules, which broke down the cancer cells' own DNA and caused their destruction.

"The cell is, in fact, committing cellular suicide. What we're seeing is that the cancer cell tries to compensate for the lack of all these things missing in the blood after fasting. It may be trying to replace them, but it can 't, "Longo said.

The new study books research published in Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences in 2008.

In that study, Longo's team showed that fasting protected normal cells against chemotherapy, but did not address the effect on cancer cells. The study also focused only on a single cancer and chemotherapy drug.

The new study on a range of cancers and common chemotherapy drugs extends the 2008 results by showing that fasting not only fails to protect cancer cells, but makes them more vulnerable.

Longo called the effect "Differential Stress Sensitization" to reflect the change in vulnerability between normal and cancerous cells.

Longo's interest in fasting and cancer grew from years of studies on the beneficial effects of fasting in yeast and other organisms. He showed 15 years ago that starved yeast cells enter a stress-resistant mode as they wait for better times.

By contrast, he said, the mutations in cancer cells come at a cost, such as a loss in adaptability to diverse environments. For example, Longo found that yeast genetically modified to resemble cancer cells become much more sensitive to several toxins.

"A way to beat cancer cells may not be to try to find drugs that kill them specifically but to confuse them by generating extreme environments, such as fasting that only normal cells can quickly respond to," Longo said.

Provided by University of Southern California

[dedeleco]

Read the basics to know:
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Je%C3%BBne
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fasting

Short fast: adaptation to the lack of food intake over a period of twelve hours to three or four days. Insulin secretion further decreases. The depletion of glycogen stores leads to a drop in blood sugar. The body's only source of glucose becomes neoglucogenesis, which makes glucose from amino acids in muscle proteins by producing urea as waste. The excretion of urea therefore increases. Ketogenesis continues.

Maximum duration In the long term, a fast causes the death of the patient if it lasts beyond certain limits. It varies according to the individual, and can reach more than 85 days

An experience of alternating fasting (a small meal every 12H or every 36H, on 8 men and 8 women who were not obese, for 22 days) showed2:

Weight loss of 4,1% and fat mass of 2,5%.
Hunger increases the first day and remains strong.
Basal metabolism RMR and respiratory quotient (RQ = CO2 produced / O2 consumed) remained stable for 21 days and the RQ decreased on day 22 with an increase in glucose oxidation of ≥15 G.
Insulin levels have dropped 57%.
The level of ghrelin has not changed significantly.
Conclusions: Persistent hunger would indicate "the improbability of continuing this diet for prolonged periods". "Adding a small meal on a fasting day may make this approach to dietary restriction more acceptable" 2.

The human body, young and healthy, can withstand a total fast, but not excluding drinking, for a fairly long period, up to three months if the person is healthy and well fed at the time of start of the fast. Physiology adapts quickly by mobilizing internal reserves, but, fairly quickly (on average after 3 to 4 weeks), the continuation of fasting involves significant risks, especially on the heart rate towards the end. A medical follow-up is vital at least from the 4th week, more or less regular depending on the state of health, the conditions of the fast and the nature of the reserves at the start.

Hibernation animals de facto fast during this period of low activity.

Although some fasting methods use juice or various amounts of food, the health of such methods is questionable, according to Dr. Joel Fuhrman. A true fast, he contends, consists of an intake solely of water, and can last (healthily) for extended periods of time when undertaken with the correct knowledge. Any fasts of such nature should be preceded and followed by a healthy diet, and should also be supervised by a knowledgeable physician to make sure that deficiencies of any nutrients do not take place and detract from the healthful benefits of such a fast. [50]

There are also recent studies on mice that show that fasting every other day while eating double the normal amount of food on non-fasting days can lead to improved insulin and blood sugar control, neuronal resistance to injury, and general health indicators. Punctuated fasting diets produced superior improvements compared with mice on 40% calorie restricted diets. Alternate-day calorie restriction may prolong lifespan [53] and attenuate diseases associated with inflammation, oxidative stress and aging. [54] Fasting has been shown to be an effective treatment for hypertension. [55]

Many fasting protocols are used by integrative medicine practitioners as part of alleged detoxification or cleansing diets.

Fasting can be dangerous when the body is not able to perform gluconeogenesis. If the body is not in ketosis, then the brain and vital organs (which can burn either glucose or ketones) need 800 calories a day to have ample glucose. If less than 800 calories a day are consumed (such as from stored and converted glucose), the brain and vital organs are deprived of necessary glucose, causing damage and, eventually, death. Ideally, therapeutic fasts should be supervised by experienced health care practitioners

[antoinet111]

Thank you for the Dede refs, and for the info on cancer, it can be useful.

Sometimes it just happened not to eat for one to two days. It is true that in the following days, I felt a feeling of well being and good health.

but nothing quantitative.
I do combat sports, and I think there is a cumulative effect, moreover, sport is known to be a strong factor in the creation of neurons.

in fact it's cool, you lose weight with sport, you eliminate with fasting, and by sticking peaches on, you become intelligent !!!