The Grenelle Environment Forum in October !!

Books, television programs, films, magazines or music to share, counselor to discover ... Talk to news affecting in any way the econology, environment, energy, society, consumption (new laws or standards) ...
Rulian
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The Grenelle Environment Forum in October !!




by Rulian » 23/08/07, 09:51

Hello,

As you probably know, the Grenelle Environment Forum promised by the new president will be held in October 2007.

The hour of truth is near for environment, health, energy, agriculture policy ... of the current presidential mandate, I propose here to gather info, rumors, dispatches.

In short, a thread of news to follow the preparation and the progress of this great deadline.

One last thing: NO POLEMIQUE. This thread is not intended to exchange opinions but just to gather information. Create another topic for debates please.

Thank you and you enrich the trick!
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by Rulian » 23/08/07, 09:54

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Christophe
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by Christophe » 23/08/07, 11:11

The 1st link also gives a surprising page: http://rebellyon.info/article4109.html

What is a "real green"?

ps: I expect very little from this meeting ...
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by jean63 » 23/08/07, 23:16

I don't see why Sarko, boyfriend of Bush, would be pro-organic, anti-GMO, anti-multinationals-who pollute ..... etc ... when everything proves the contrary.

If he can put N.Hulot in his pocket he is very talented or N.Hulot is bought by multinationals .........

We will see what will come out of this masquerade.

OK, I may have slipped, but nobody is expressing themselves: the tongue of wood is getting Boring.
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by Rulian » 24/08/07, 15:13

I don't think anyone is fooled.
However, the event is important. It is interesting to follow it.
Let's try not to go on a troll. Just info, press articles ... Anyway, it's a little too early to judge the result : Lol:
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by Christophe » 24/08/07, 15:17

jean63 wrote:or N.Hulot is bought by multinationals .........


Answer here: http://www.fondation-nicolas-hulot.org/ ... ateurs.php
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by zac » 24/08/07, 15:44

there is even stronger than total which we offered its solvents to clean the piafs after the erika : Evil:

@+
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by jean63 » 24/08/07, 16:10

Christophe wrote:
jean63 wrote:or N.Hulot is bought by multinationals .........


Answer here: http://www.fondation-nicolas-hulot.org/ ... ateurs.php


A single quack: TF1 = Bouygues = godfather of Nico's son ("Good luck mon papa").

A good point: Bouygues bought the share of the French state in Alstom (train and turbines) at the request of Nico. Trains are the least polluting as a means of transport reported to the person being transported .....

We could continue, but that will not change the story: let's wait for the famous Grenelle and we'll see what comes out of it (in my opinion CO2 taxes which will increase the price of a liter of gasoline = soon 1,50 euros or 10 Francs !!!). I remember a time when "leaded" gasoline cost 1 franc.

Taxes will not change CO2 emissions: it is not by paying taxes that the CO2 that has already been emitted into the atmosphere is brought back to earth, it is too late the damage is done.
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by Christophe » 24/08/07, 16:33

jean63 wrote:Trains are the least polluting as a means of transport reported to the person being transported .....


Pollutant on what? If it's CO2, your remark is only true in France and in "nuclear" countries ...

In Germany it is much worse (average emissions: 600 g of CO2 / kWh electric while an hdi car rejects, with 35% efficiency, 750 g / kwh but these are mechanical kwh used directly ... without losses on the network therefore ... unlike electricity)

Line losses are therefore an important element to take into account ...

In addition, in France, many trains run on diesel ... see the new TER of Alsthom precisely ...
Image

http://bb67405.ifrance.com/x73500.html

By cons in comparison to a car there is no photo:

Power: 514KW (i.e. 695 hp)
Mass in service order: 50t
Capacity: 164 places

At best (filling rate = 100%) we therefore obtain:
a) 4,23 hp per passenger, so you have to find a 5-seater car with 21 hp to compete with the train: it no longer exists
b) 300 kg to move / passenger, it is in the same condition as a car filled with 5 seats.

In reality, the average filling rate must fluctuate between 30 and 40%. So we end up with:
a) 10,0 hp / passenger, we are in the same order of magnitude as small cars (micra, twingo ...)
b) 750 kg / passenger: we are worse than small cars ...


Too bad we do not have the exact consumption of the train per km and according to the average speed.

ps: for information, in 2006, an internal engineer of the scnf tried to pass the idea of ​​doping to water, he ran into something harder than walls ... too bad for them...
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by jean63 » 24/08/07, 17:27

Bravo for all these details !!!

You can copy and paste and send your email to JM Jancovici because I think it is for traveling by train ..... it will refine his appreciation of the subject.

I love this kind of treatment of a subject ... with precision ... which was not my case.
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