[Debunked] A liner or freighter pollutes as much as 1 million cars...and 1000 tractors? Really ?

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[Debunked] A liner or freighter pollutes as much as 1 million cars...and 1000 tractors? Really ?




by Christophe » 10/11/18, 18:56

I'm sick of seeing the news spread that 1's only big cargo ship or cruise ship would pollute as much as 1 million cars! And who is the stuff of some misinformation sites ... see even major media that relay information in a more or less clear!

I even read recently that the 20 biggest boats pollute as much as ALL the cars of the Earth !!!

Mouahahahhah, as there are more than 1 billion cars on Earth, that would mean that a boat pollutes more than 50 millions of cars, there I am joking and I laugh yellow!

This information, these infox or intox, are nevertheless widely relayed on social networks and for good reason: it makes the use of the car easier! It is well known that in terms of pollution: it is always the fault of the other! We are in it!

This subject is there to take stock and help those who believe in it to see more clearly!

a) 1er lie: there is pollution and pollution!

The people who relay and disseminate this intox assume that it concerns "all pollution" ... serious mistake!

This statement does not concern that fine particles, and why? Because modern cars do everything to minimize this kind of pollution.

Remove the particulate filter (DPF) and the catalyst and the 1 million will melt like snow in the sun !!

Note that:

a.1) the FAP, is only a particle TRAP and it must be regenerated regularly and that in this case, it is possible that a large part of the particles emerge suddenly because the regeneration (= burning in the FAP) did not work properly!

a.2) The catalyst is inactive cold (so 30% of the routes of the French ... moue moue ...)

b) 2ieme lie: the CO2. Boats are the most economical transportation in the world on energy efficiency and therefore energy consumption so the CO2

On the CO2, the big boats are the most efficient to the useful ton transported!

In other words, it is those who pollute the point in "CO2 emission / useful ton.Km"

c) And these particles compared to agricultural tractors? Huh? Come on we laugh!

Agricultural tractors are much less polluted than cars, especially the old park ... in short it smokes black!

I would not be surprised if we could therefore reduce the ratio to 1 boat to 1000 on tractors (in order of magnitude) ... Ah right away that makes less "guilt-free" ... and if we compare to lawn mowers lawn, I presume, that the figure is less than 20 ... How many lawn mowers are there in France?

Finally, some boats inject water and have efficient anti-pollution processes (more modern than on cars!), Like the MAN HAM: consume less-car / ham-and-water-injection-man anti-nox-in-the-motor-marine-t14241.html

Here I stop there for now, if you have other arguments, let's talk about it! The numbers in point c) can be easily refined ... if necessary ...

Edit important addition: sulfur oxides limit global warming (by increasing the atmospheric albedo), see: changement-climatique-co2/1-paquebot-pollue-autant-qu-1-million-de-voitures-et-1000-tracteurs-t15837-40.html#p348984

Edit on 13/08/21

The last point is confirmed, sulfur oxides largely contribute to lowering the greenhouse effect, thank you Izy: co2-climate-change / the-latest-figures-and-meteorological-consequences-of-global warming-t13878-1480.html # p460649

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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by Forhorse » 10/11/18, 19:36

As far as agricultural tractors (and other motorized agricultural machinery) are concerned, I can tell you that they are very clean, at least as much as cars, and that the French fleet is rather recent. The current standard in force is called "Tier 4 final", you can probably easily find the requirements of this standard in terms of discharges. Farmers have a lot of help and incentives to change equipment regularly.
There are far fewer "old" tractors than "old" cars.
Old tractors were often sold for export (Eastern Europe, Africa) but even in these countries the second-hand market is starting to run out (but the standards are not as demanding as in Europe. often Thirds 3)
In France the only old tractors that remain are those used by individuals or the few very small farms that have not evolved since 30 years.

The engine of an agricultural machine turns most often to its maximum efficiency (it is the maximum torque that is sought), moreover the dashboards of these machines now display almost all the load of the engine. And the current pollution control systems ensure that the temperature of the engine (and thus the exhaust gas) rises as quickly as possible so that the pollution control system can come into operation as soon as possible.

So yes, these machines that can swallow 1000 liters of diesel per day pollute, it is clear, but in the image of these ships that are accused I doubt that they can be responsible for most of the pollution.
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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by sen-no-sen » 10/11/18, 20:45

Christophe wrote:I'm sick of seeing the news spread that 1's only big cargo ship or cruise ship would pollute as much as 1 million cars! And who is the stuff of some misinformation sites ... see even major media that relay information in a more or less clear!


It all depends on what is meant by pollution.
This is not a question of greenhouse gas emissions but of sulfur emissions via the combustion of heavy fuel oil.
In this case and only in this one, and taking into account some cargo ships and container doors the information is rather correct.
In reality this rumor is based on a study of James J. Corbett indicating that if the 15's largest container ships in the world used the most sulfur-containing heavy fuel oil then it would emit as much sulfur oxide as all the particular automobiles of the earth based on a new fleet.
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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by izentrop » 11/11/18, 01:09

Christophe wrote:[b] I'm tired of seeing the news that 1's only big cargo ship or ocean liner would pollute ...
I had never heard about it until yesterday when I was waiting for the pref to take into account the demolition of my old fiesta ...

This is the ticket seller who said that to me sorry to have to raise the application 4 times over the Internet, the only possible way now of dialogue with the administration.

To come back to the freighters, I did not note, but like you, in my head, I made the calculation of weight of goods / weight of CO2 and I said to myself: "that does not stick", another rumor anti globalization and anti overpriced fuel.
Far from me the idea of ​​overwhelming this poor lady locked up and bundled up in her badly heated algeco "provisional since ... Ohhh there ..." : Cheesy:
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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by moinsdewatt » 11/11/18, 22:55

The standards of sulfur content in marine heavy fuel oil will change to 2020:

Soutes: Maersk partners with Vopak in Rotterdam for 2020

Posted on 20 / 08 / 2018 lemarin.fr

Denmark's Maersk has decided to partner with Dutch specialist Vopak storage terminals in a low-sulfur marine fuel bunkering plant.

Under the agreement between the two groups, this infrastructure will be developed at Rotterdam's Vopak Europoort terminal, Maersk announced on Monday August 20.

It will "cover about 20% of Maersk's global demand, allowing AP Møller-Maersk to deliver around 2,3 million tonnes per year" of bunkers, he said. The facility will also allow other companies to supply ships with fuel in accordance with the new IMO regulations, that will require the use of bunkers at less than 0,5% sulfur from 2020.

"We believe that our initiative will alleviate some of the industry's concerns about the availability of fuels (note: low sulfur) and will ensure our competitiveness in the market," said Niels Henrik Lindegaard, director of Maersk Oil Trading, a specialist subsidiary. bunkers of AP Møller-Maersk.

Vopak said Friday 17 August that it would adapt 500 000 m3 storage capacity in Rotterdam in view of new regulations 2020. "This investment is based on customer commitments and should be finalized in the second half of 2019," he said.

"Our Fujairah, Rotterdam and Singapore terminals will be fully ready for new market demands" in 2020, also assured Vopak.


http://www.lemarin.fr/secteurs-activite ... ue-de-2020
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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by Christophe » 12/11/18, 01:59

Forhorse wrote:As far as agricultural tractors (and other motorized agricultural machinery) are concerned, I can tell you that they are very clean, at least as much as cars, and that the French fleet is rather recent. The current standard in force is called "Tier 4 final", you can probably easily find the requirements of this standard in terms of discharges. Farmers have a lot of help and incentives to change equipment regularly.


That the modern are cleared ok ... that the park is rather recent, I do not agree, at least not in my corner (Belgian and French Ardennes): more 1 tractor on 2 that I see spend more 20 years (especially in forestry ... well it's the Christmas trees right now ...)

Not all farmers are multi-million dollar grain farmers ...

Forhorse wrote:There are far fewer "old" tractors than "old" cars.


Part of this infox by all the cars in the world ... so we can not compare it with a modern tractor park but a fleet of tractors representative of the whole world ... and here I think the average age is 25-30 years ... see even a little more.

Yes, there is no CT on agricultural tractors !! : Mrgreen:
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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by Christophe » 12/11/18, 02:01

izentrop wrote:This is the ticket seller who said that to me sorry to have to raise the application 4 times over the Internet, the only possible way now of dialogue with the administration.

To come back to the freighters, I did not note, but like you, in my head, I made the calculation of weight of goods / weight of CO2 and I said to myself: "that does not stick", another rumor anti globalization and anti overpriced fuel.


But what are the police doing? : Shock: : Mrgreen:
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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by Christophe » 12/11/18, 02:05

sen-no-sen wrote:It all depends on what is meant by pollution.
This is not a question of greenhouse gas emissions but of sulfur emissions via the combustion of heavy fuel oil.


Of course it is the object of my point a) ...

The concern is that ordinary citizens read "pollute as much" (without even clicking) and do not look any further to change their behavior ... since others pollute as much as they ...

ps: I never read sulfur in the 2 or 3 infox site that I saw but particles -all short (but not indicated in the title)?
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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by Spica.57 » 12/11/18, 09:59

Hello
According to WWF Oxfam

Boat = 10-15kg CO2 / ton / km
Train = 19-41 kg CO2 / ton / km
Heavy weight = 51-91 kg CO2 / tonne / km
Plane = 673-867 kg CO2 / ton / km

Emissions of a liner for 1 km traveled 15kg NOx 1kg PM 10 and 400g SO2

@+
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Re: [Focus] 1 liner pollutes as much as 1 million cars ... and 1000 tractors!




by Christophe » 12/11/18, 11:52

Spica.57 wrote:According to WWF Oxfam

Boat = 10-15kg CO2 / ton / km
Train = 19-41 kg CO2 / ton / km
Heavy weight = 51-91 kg CO2 / tonne / km
Plane = 673-867 kg CO2 / ton / km

Emissions of a liner for 1 km traveled 15kg NOx 1kg PM 10 and 400g SO2

@+


Thank you very much Spica (and welcome back here) for this research which confirms my argument above regarding the CO2 and the energy efficiency of the boats!

You speak well in Useful ton moved?

Because I am quite surprised of the strong consumption of the plane because a modern airplane fills (kind A380 has a passenger consumption lower than 4L / 100km.passager)

On the other hand, it misses the car, estimates quickly the emissions per useful ton displaced and per tonne displaced

a) Average car at 120-150 gr / km
b) average payload: 1,3 to 1,6 passenger + some race, take the most favorable assumption to the car: 80 * 1,6 + 20 kg of runs = 148 kg of payload = 0,148 Ton
c) We get 0,120 / 0,148 to 0,150 / 0,148 = 0,8-1 kg CO2 / Useful ton.km
e) In actual ton moved, for 1,8 Ton moved it would be 0,12 / 1,8-0,15 / 1,8 = 0,07-0,08 kg CO2 / Ton moved .km

So, if I'm not mistaken, the car is champion of the world of ecology by carbonic KO !!! : Mrgreen: : Mrgreen: : Mrgreen:

But it does not stick at all in order of magnitude, so there is a (big) beug somewhere! Like what it's always useful to rest a table corner calculation on numbers ...

So there is something wrong in the figures Oxfam, it would not be 100 km rather ???

Here it would be consistent: we would have 80-100 kg CO2 / Tonne.100 km for the car so less good than the truck, it makes sense ... (but still very good to the favor of the car: the truck should be much better than the car ...)


And I still don't agree with the plane ... or else it's for the couriers (the A380, which you necessarily know well, was "sold" as more economical than a car in km .passenger...).

In short you have the link of the study that you quote?
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