Hello,
I signed up and want more information.
A Facebook video of a journalist Auto moto had put me on the subject a year ago, having since heard about the pantone engine.
After I had never thought of a kit to do on my car, thinking that there was a dimensional and more important work extremely long and expensive. Not having my own house and garage to tinker with, I had never lingered there.
Now I came across the film of the water in the diesel, and I watched the videos of ecopra etc.
I'm coming to a point where I need more people on the subject.
That's my question:
On the existing kit sold in the state we assemble, which are reliable because when I see ecopra has 750 + 500 € and kits H4ALL promo 249 € econokit 269 €, and I have the impression there is 3000 ...?
Now I do not have a garage I have trouble to start making a kit myself that would save me without taking risks because I am not equipped at once for a manufacture myself made myself. The research begins to last on the subject. Hence the idea that I prefer to buy a kit - 300 € that I install myself and that will do the job properly.
After I'm listening to your advice
Thank you in advance for your help.
Cdlt,
Which Water Injection Kit to buy?
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Re: Which Existing Kit help you
Hello and welcome,
There is no evidence of effectiveness of these kits, scientifically speaking.
There is no evidence of effectiveness of these kits, scientifically speaking.
0 x
Re: Which Existing Kit help you
shotrop hello
do not worry about ominous birds who think they know everything about what they do not know. Science is not an exact science, but more or less verifiable convergences of facts.
The ecopra or other economisers have proven themselves with varying results depending on the vehicles, the positions of the kits in question and with failures as for all things. For example, cancers are half failures and half successes. So the reduction of consumption is less important in itself than the reduction of the pollution that it generates.
do not worry about ominous birds who think they know everything about what they do not know. Science is not an exact science, but more or less verifiable convergences of facts.
The ecopra or other economisers have proven themselves with varying results depending on the vehicles, the positions of the kits in question and with failures as for all things. For example, cancers are half failures and half successes. So the reduction of consumption is less important in itself than the reduction of the pollution that it generates.
0 x
"We make science with facts, like making a house with stones: but an accumulation of facts is no more a science than a pile of stones is a house" Henri Poincaré
Re: Which Water Injection Kit to buy?
shotrop hello and welcome
Research on Econo, there is plenty of post on Pantonisation etc .... You will have clearer ideas after some healthy non-commercial readings.
Here kits are not much studied / compared (nobody has the means to do it a little seriously). In these kits, the best mixes the worst (price and achievement), and to sort, you will have to make your own idea by deepening your knowledge, especially in the post where André participates / distils a true knowledge.
A+
Research on Econo, there is plenty of post on Pantonisation etc .... You will have clearer ideas after some healthy non-commercial readings.
Here kits are not much studied / compared (nobody has the means to do it a little seriously). In these kits, the best mixes the worst (price and achievement), and to sort, you will have to make your own idea by deepening your knowledge, especially in the post where André participates / distils a true knowledge.
A+
0 x
Reason is the madness of the strongest. The reason for the less strong it is madness.
[Eugène Ionesco]
http://www.editions-harmattan.fr/index. ... te&no=4132
[Eugène Ionesco]
http://www.editions-harmattan.fr/index. ... te&no=4132
Re: Which Water Injection Kit to buy?
Hello and thank you all,
Flyfox I admit I was hoping to have a more detailed answer from you when I saw your post and the system you created, which proves that you still have a mastery of the subject .
In addition digging a little I feel that we spoke more kits etc in 2010-2013 in the press and that since 4 years there is nothing on the subject, as it finally nothing had Advanced, that Mr tardy stops directing the company Hypnow, while in the report it seemed to advance. The fact that the press completely loses interest when we are at a level of absolute scam or we sell the electric polluting more than diesel, and for us sell it increases fuel prices. This stagnation while the BMW engine with water injection should have opened the valves.
But okay I will read and document myself to try to make my own expertise
Flyfox I admit I was hoping to have a more detailed answer from you when I saw your post and the system you created, which proves that you still have a mastery of the subject .
In addition digging a little I feel that we spoke more kits etc in 2010-2013 in the press and that since 4 years there is nothing on the subject, as it finally nothing had Advanced, that Mr tardy stops directing the company Hypnow, while in the report it seemed to advance. The fact that the press completely loses interest when we are at a level of absolute scam or we sell the electric polluting more than diesel, and for us sell it increases fuel prices. This stagnation while the BMW engine with water injection should have opened the valves.
But okay I will read and document myself to try to make my own expertise
0 x
Re: Which Water Injection Kit to buy?
It would be nice to tell us on which vehicle you intend to install a kit.
The results of different experimenters seem to show much greater efficiency on older (design) engines than on newer models.
The results of different experimenters seem to show much greater efficiency on older (design) engines than on newer models.
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Re: Which Water Injection Kit to buy?
Welcome here, you are on the right site, away from daydreams and infox ...
Indeed it does not move quickly but do not forget that it is more than 100 years that we know that it works and no major industrial does it ???
See works of Clerget and Sabatier (the engineer who gave a name to a thermodynamic cycle, so certainly not a fun !!): https://www.econologie.com/historique-injection-eau/
But considering the price of diesel (fuel) I think that the injection of water will do again talk about it ... here or there ...
Maybe I should have started myself in the development and marketing of a water injection kit (so the answer to your question would have been easy! ) ...
The various homologations and psychological blockages have slowed me down this path.
But it's never too late ... but alone in his corner we do not do much, I always wanted to do things well but I never had access to analysis tools that the system would have deserved !!
In short I preferred to manage this site and disseminate information (with the help of all those who gave it) to democratize the principle ...
Stagnation yes but apparently (maybe?): The manufacturers pose dozens of patents on the injection of water ... but nothing comes out on the market! Not even for trucks ... It's hopeless!
For those who wonder why BMW is mentioned here is the answer:
understanding water injection / BMW-patents-on-the-injection-of-water-in-a-motor-t13760.html
https://www.econologie.com/injection-ea ... e-bientot/
https://www.econologie.com/brevets-bmw- ... -analyses/
And then BMW has been injecting water for over 40 years: Water-injection engine pantone / bmw-megatron-turbo petrol-1450ch-and-a-injection of water-t14238.html
This allows ... 1000 Cv / L
Finally, here is a summary article on water injection that I co-governed with another member of forums: everything is there to understand how it works! Water injection-motor-pantone / article-econologic-autobio-on-doping-al-water-t9612.html
See also the MAN HAM system: consume less-car / ham-and-water-injection-man anti-nox-in-the-motor-marine-t14241.html
Sohtrop_7 wrote:that since 4 years there is nothing more on the subject, as ci finally nothing had advanced,
Indeed it does not move quickly but do not forget that it is more than 100 years that we know that it works and no major industrial does it ???
See works of Clerget and Sabatier (the engineer who gave a name to a thermodynamic cycle, so certainly not a fun !!): https://www.econologie.com/historique-injection-eau/
But considering the price of diesel (fuel) I think that the injection of water will do again talk about it ... here or there ...
Maybe I should have started myself in the development and marketing of a water injection kit (so the answer to your question would have been easy! ) ...
The various homologations and psychological blockages have slowed me down this path.
But it's never too late ... but alone in his corner we do not do much, I always wanted to do things well but I never had access to analysis tools that the system would have deserved !!
In short I preferred to manage this site and disseminate information (with the help of all those who gave it) to democratize the principle ...
Sohtrop_7 wrote:stagnation while the BMW engine with water injection should have opened the valves.
Stagnation yes but apparently (maybe?): The manufacturers pose dozens of patents on the injection of water ... but nothing comes out on the market! Not even for trucks ... It's hopeless!
For those who wonder why BMW is mentioned here is the answer:
understanding water injection / BMW-patents-on-the-injection-of-water-in-a-motor-t13760.html
https://www.econologie.com/injection-ea ... e-bientot/
https://www.econologie.com/brevets-bmw- ... -analyses/
And then BMW has been injecting water for over 40 years: Water-injection engine pantone / bmw-megatron-turbo petrol-1450ch-and-a-injection of water-t14238.html
This allows ... 1000 Cv / L
Finally, here is a summary article on water injection that I co-governed with another member of forums: everything is there to understand how it works! Water injection-motor-pantone / article-econologic-autobio-on-doping-al-water-t9612.html
See also the MAN HAM system: consume less-car / ham-and-water-injection-man anti-nox-in-the-motor-marine-t14241.html
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Re: Which Water Injection Kit to buy?
@Gaston,
I plan to install it on a 1,5 85 clio III 5ch, current consumption has 100l / 110 but I do a lot of highway / national 8Km / h on my daily journey.The idea is especially to extend the life of the car, to reduce the pollution, to reduce a little still the consumption (XNUMX% would already be something of exceptional for me)
@Christophe,
Thank you I will read that. After, as I said, I find it odd that C.tardy stopped Hypnow if he was convinced by the systems.
I plan to install it on a 1,5 85 clio III 5ch, current consumption has 100l / 110 but I do a lot of highway / national 8Km / h on my daily journey.The idea is especially to extend the life of the car, to reduce the pollution, to reduce a little still the consumption (XNUMX% would already be something of exceptional for me)
@Christophe,
Thank you I will read that. After, as I said, I find it odd that C.tardy stopped Hypnow if he was convinced by the systems.
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Re: Which Water Injection Kit to buy?
Sohtrop_7 wrote:After, as I said, I find it odd that C.tardy stopped Hypnow if he was convinced by the systems.
You should ask him directly ... when someone leaves a company or business it can be for non-economic reasons.
Hypnow still exists?
ps: if I have never started in kits it's because, too, the lack of regulation of those on the market ...
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Re: Which Water Injection Kit to buy?
Gaston wrote:The results of different experimenters seem to show much greater efficiency on older (design) engines than on newer models.
Seem to show it's the right word ... To summarize in 3 points:
a) A recent engine (diesel) has an EGR: it is an "indirect" water injection since when it is in operation, the engine swallows a lot of water. As a reminder, 1 L of burnt fossil fuel rejects about 1 L of water (obviously vapor) ... hey yes, that's not nothing!
b) There is also the "engine cleaning / cleaning" effect: which necessarily works better with an engine that has hours in the connecting rods ... it will be more clogged. Recent engines are still getting dirty ...
Attention I speak about the fouling of the combustion chamber, not of the pipe of admission or the EGR itself which are often clogged strongly and sometimes very quickly according to the use of the engine which one makes (urban or peri urban ... it's a horror for that)
c) The thermodynamic effect of water during combustion, it is identical, see better with the latest engines (following technologies and injection mapping), the problem is that no one (except BMW ...) knows how to correctly dose the water at the right time (= in the right conditions) ... so the effect can be both negative and positive and the gains cancel out (the BMW patent cited above explains when and how they inject, plus they have 2 types of water injection a direct and an indirect)
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