Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(

Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ... short thermal comfort. Insulation, wood energy, heat pumps but also electricity, gas or oil, VMC ... Help in choosing and implementation, problem solving, optimization, tips and tricks ...
Pilpoill
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by Pilpoill » 17/01/22, 20:03

bengal77 wrote:If I check my gas consumption since I bought the house: 4100€ over the first year, so much more than what I had announced.


Propane in a tank is overpriced (2800€ per ton for me), would you have the equivalent in quantity of gas consumed?

Check your private messages
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sicetaitsimple
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by sicetaitsimple » 17/01/22, 20:13

bengal77 wrote:If I check my gas consumption since I bought the house: 4100€ over the first year, so much more than what I had announced.

And in kWh? The tariffs vary month by month, what is important in terms of analysis is the energy consumption.

Edit following Pilpoill's post: I withdraw everything I said about gas, I had completely zapped in the first message that it was gas in a tank, everything I said referred to prices "networked natural gas".
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Pilpoill
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by Pilpoill » 17/01/22, 20:42

Price to date, I do not regret having stopped this fuel! (Propane contract at A……Z in 1,1T tank)

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GuyGadeboisTheBack
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by GuyGadeboisTheBack » 17/01/22, 20:49

Oh well then... NGV (natural gas for vehicles) was around one euro per kilo in France last year. It is 1.12 euros in Germany, 1.40 in Switzerland and I pay it... 2.45 euros at the pump in France...
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Bengal77
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by Bengal77 » 17/01/22, 21:11

Pilpoill wrote:
bengal77 wrote:If I check my gas consumption since I bought the house: 4100€ over the first year, so much more than what I had announced.


Propane in a tank is overpriced (2800€ per ton for me), would you have the equivalent in quantity of gas consumed?

Check your private messages


I was at 1400€/tonne. But don't follow up like I did with the electrical consumption.
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by sicetaitsimple » 17/01/22, 21:25

GuyGadeboisLeRetour wrote:Oh well then... NGV (natural gas for vehicles) was around one euro per kilo in France last year. It is 1.12 euros in Germany, 1.40 in Switzerland and I pay it... 2.45 euros at the pump in France...


This is absolutely outrageous! Yet you only supply yourself with "biogas", right? A French biogas, produced locally with our pee and our poo, which should not be subject to the excesses of globalization.....There is a petition? (just a reminder on your first post on this forum....)
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by Bengal77 » 18/01/22, 09:13

Hello,

FYI, my escalation to Okofen France has paid off, the installer and the reseller have come today to analyze the situation.

Yesterday, I still received an email that didn't really appeal to me, pointing out a possible mishandling on my part to clear myself of the over consumption of pellets that I brought up....

In full transparency, my answer:

"I am aware of the various emails that you have exchanged in recent days and I am surprised by certain remarks and / or questions that you formulate concerning the consumption of pellets.
During each "study" after visiting a project, the calculation of the losses makes it possible to choose the power of the boiler.
Once this power is known, this makes it possible to estimate consumption for the year.
Various parameters are then entered into the actual consumption.
Comfort temperature, outdoor temperature, and especially the level of insulation of the house.
In the event of "so-called excessive" consumption by the end customer, we may have abnormally low temperatures, which is not really the case at the moment, even if it is not very hot, or losses directly induced to the insulation of the building(s).
The boiler consumes pellets only if it burns them, and it only burns them if the demand is present.
With a ladle, with 25kW of nominal power, heating and hot water, this makes it possible to estimate around 9 tons/year.

According to the cycle times of your machine, these are long enough to conclude that the 25kW machine is correct.

How many pellets did you actually put in the silo and on what date??
6920Kg on 03/08/21. I'm lucky, the company was able to deliver an additional 6360 Kg to me today. (The gap with the capacity of the silo corresponding to the bags that I put manually)

On this date, does the boiler have hot water right away??
We switched to hot water as soon as you went into service, also on 03/08/21 it seems to me. Afterwards, official commissioning of Okofen on 09/09/21 and from 10/09/21, Boiler in error. You came on 11/09 and detected an out of order part, following the intervention of the person from Okofen who allegedly let liquid flow over it. You came back on 20/09 to change the HS part. Until the first cold weather at the end of November, no worries. Then start of my climbing from 03/12.

Do you use the sanitary closure, which remains a greedy subject??
No idea, but I have a box that pushes hot water when I ask for it.

Don't you have pipes that circulate in the ground of the garden with...maybe random insulation??
Yes, there is a pipe in the garden that brings hot water to the kitchen. The rest goes directly from the boiler room to the house.
Is the insulation of your house as efficient as the former owner described it to you (see sold!!)

It is certain that the insulation is not at the top, it is an old house with exposed stones. Nevertheless, I still don't understand why I can't get a pleasant temperature. That there is loss, I am sure; That the boiler does not know how to stop there is another subject. Especially since I didn't have this problem with Gas previously. And this does not explain the excessive consumption of pellets in 2,5 months of heating + 2,5 months just for hot water. There is also my question about perpetual hot water flow temperature differentials. How can the house stay warm if the heating temperature drops significantly several times a day? The radiators go from hot (far from being hot) to lukewarm.

In short, many parameters that are always very difficult to affirm or confirm, but which can affect consumption.
My first emergency is the well-being of my family, and therefore to obtain the desired temperature in the house. Then, it will be necessary, in fact, to conclude the actual consumption of pellets VS the energy losses of my house. However, it is just impossible that the consumption of 7 tons in a few months will be the future standard of my house. (Especially since it has only been cold, per episode, for less than 2 months). We are very far from what I was told, while you (and Ardente) had made it clear to me that the configuration of my house explained your "important" calculation of 8 tons/year max)

Other possible subjects also, have you not "touched" parameters, other than those usually recommended and which could cause problems in the proper functioning of the machine??
No, I did not make any other changes than those that we exchanged via email or SMS. (Manual Mode and Feet/Slope/Temperature Limits)

I'll let you think about these different points so that I can talk about them tomorrow."
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Pilpoill
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by Pilpoill » 18/01/22, 09:31

Hello,

Do you have a room sensor?

EDIT:
There is no room sensor connected to your boiler, so the boiler only knows the outside temperature.
For me this climatic system is incomplete and in the case of your house it is an aberration!

Your boiler does not know the interior temperature, it works H24!
It does not matter to configure a reduced range, it is useless in this case since your boiler is partly blind...

The health priority is activated, suddenly it disturbs even more the regularity of temperature in your network of radiator.
Following this priority, cutting off the heating circulator causes your v3v to yo-yo each time your DHW tank heats up, and its 47/52 setpoint only makes multiple refills throughout the days...
Parameters (at least DHW post-circulation) do not comply with the recommendations.

A very good point, your boiler works perfectly according to the information it receives!
For example last night, it modulates between 60 and 70% while maintaining the 70 setpoint without any problem, a real metronome.

F48D09DA-3B46-42F0-B5C3-6F829554A534.jpeg
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Pilpoill
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by Pilpoill » 18/01/22, 10:05

For information, in the non-insulated building around Metz mentioned in a few previous posts with its curves, the water law is 2/37, while at Bengale77 it is 1,6/36.

At an equivalent outdoor temperature in your home Bengale77, your radiator water is 6 degrees lower than in his home to obtain the same indoor temperature.
You still have room : Wink:
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Pilpoill
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Re: Okofen...It's freezing in the house :(




by Pilpoill » 18/01/22, 11:30

On the day of 16/01, there were 18 interruptions of the heating circulator for times ranging from 4 to 39 minutes!

The cause ? The health priority which leads to the closure of the v3v and then its reopening between 4 and 39 minutes later.
The later the reopening, the more calories the heating circuit needs, the more it causes the internal temperature of the boiler to drop, which therefore drops below 60°C minimum and wreaks havoc on the cat's tail for too long minutes!

Apart from this option that I recommend deactivating as a priority, you must check:
- the correct position/speed of the heating and DHW circulators
- correct positioning/insulation of the flow temperature sensor

Then, they will have to explain to you this choice not to use a room thermostat which is the only thing (with the external sensor and the better adjusted water law) which will allow you to have an indoor temperature almost constant regardless of calorie intake or loss.
Especially since it seems to me that this thermostat is mandatory to benefit from any installation aid and that it only costs around 120€ excluding installation.

To be continued, I feel like I'm going to get annoyed with their usual answers… : roll:
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