My kitchen garden of the least effort

Agriculture and soil. Pollution control, soil remediation, humus and new agricultural techniques.
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pi-r
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by pi-r » 30/07/21, 14:38

Moindreffor wrote:I have other practices to use, to invent, Didier allowed me to return to the vegetable garden, he then opened my mind, now it's time for me to stand on my own feet

is not this the definition of the subtitle of his 2nd opus .... anti-guide for free gardener?
Moindreffor wrote:I only have a small 40m2 of vegetable garden and therefore, I am far from Didier's 1000m and to think that it is enough to do the same by planting just less is a great mistake, and when you really have time to analyze your errors we can see further and therefore, I will continue to follow Didier, and his explanations, but I would pass this through my personal filter, filter that I still have to improve

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I have more or less the same vegetable area as you (plus a "Mediterranean" zone and a "red fruit" zone). my personal filters are:
- my agricultural training and my experience as a breeder which gave me the taste to try to understand and observe,
- the contributions that I can have free of charge, excluding seeds and plants
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Biobomb » 30/07/21, 23:16

Did67 wrote:Find you with significant leftovers in the fall, which, if you do not sponge, slip into the water tables.

I think that for your autumn-winter, you have to think more and more about "nitrophilous plants": chickweed, plantains, phacelia ...


Yeah, but how can you be sure of a remainder in N, how to measure / evaluate it?
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Did67 » 30/07/21, 23:55

Biobombe wrote:
Yeah, but how can you be sure of a remainder in N, how to measure / evaluate it?


There always is. No plant can grow with 0 N (zero nitrogen). So inevitably, when we harvest, there is still N in mineral form, including nitrates ... It is a serious error to think that nitrates only come from ammonitrates! And so that it is enough to garden "organic", with compost, or organic matter with urine, etc ...

But there are more or less left.

It's pretty easy to dose with kits. But I don't have one either.

It is enough to observe the color of the vegetables - their more or less dark greens, drawing on the bluish. For a given species and variety (because leaf color is a genetic trait) it is quite easy to put some sort of scale in your head: light green (in the range of greens of this species) and the balances are low; medium green is medium and dark green is high.

At home, it's almost always dark green around September / October. The decomposition of the hay is quite advanced. The ground is warm. And it becomes quite wet again. The conditions are met for an acceleration of mineralization and nitrification ...

[NB: the farmers - and the institutes which "advise" them - rather measure the remainders at the end of winter; it is in a way the "starting stock" for the growing season; then knowing what the needs of the envisaged crop are, they can deduce the manuring plan = the contributions to be made. These residues are what remains after the winter washes! The remainders at the end of cultivation in the fall are much higher !!!

As an indication:
https://marne.chambre-agriculture.fr/ac ... visionnel/
https://www.arvalis-infos.fr/ajuster-la ... ticle.html
https://draaf.bretagne.agriculture.gouv ... 87df-1.pdf
]
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Did67 » 30/07/21, 23:56

pi-r wrote:
Moindreffor wrote:I have other practices to use, to invent, Didier allowed me to return to the vegetable garden, he then opened my mind, now it's time for me to stand on my own feet

Isn't that the definition of the subtitle of his 2nd opus .... anti-guide for free gardener? .... / ....



This is indeed it. I take it all for a big compliment, anyway ...
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Biobomb » 31/07/21, 11:56

Did67 wrote:
It is a serious mistake to think that nitrates only come from ammonitrates! And so that it is enough to garden "organic", with compost, or organic matter with urine, etc ...

color of vegetables - their more or less dark greens, tending to bluish. For a given species and variety (because leaf color is a genetic trait) it is quite easy to put some sort of scale in your head: light green (in the range of greens of this species) and the balances are low; medium green is medium and dark green is high.

At home, it's almost always dark green around September / October. The decomposition of the hay is quite advanced. The ground is warm. And it becomes quite wet again. The conditions are met for an acceleration of mineralization and nitrification ...


Thanks for the colors, I don't think you've written this before?
For nitrates, nitrification, during cultivation and others, on the other hand, you wrote a great article that appeared in the press a few years ago, I must find it. But as I distribute my magazines after having read them and that they return to me but not always ...
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Moindreffor » 31/07/21, 14:08

Did67 wrote:
Biobombe wrote:Yeah, but how can you be sure of a remainder in N, how to measure / evaluate it?

There always is. No plant can grow with 0 N (zero nitrogen). So inevitably, when we harvest, there is still N in mineral form, including nitrates ... It is a serious error to think that nitrates only come from ammo-nitrates! And so that it is enough to garden "organic", with compost, or organic matter with urine, etc ...

But there are more or less left.

I think we have to stop tying knots in the brain, if we want to be careful, we start from the assumption that there are some left and we set up a winter crop of vegetables or other, or even nice weeds to pump the maximum in the soil before winter and recover it either in the form of vegetables that we eat, or green manure for the beginning of the following season

we can dose everything, and it is currently the fashion, and therefore we will always find "THE" thing that is wrong

this year, I will have seeds of red onions those which went up to seeds that I had sown last year and transplanted, those that I transplanted in bulbils are also mounted in seeds, I will test 2 things: harvest the seeds and sowing in the wake to see if I can have bulbils before winter for a classic planting in bulbils, and spring sowing for transplanting

My trials of sown yellow onion bulbils is a mixed success, mixed is not really the word, because no significant rise in seeds, good emergence, harvest on the other hand very average in soil in the least fertile part of the vegetable garden , but that was to be expected, and therefore it works, and therefore there also a harvest of seeds to set up for these onions

otherwise, nice harvest of winter garlic planted in spring, 2 heads of garlic bought 2 years ago to try, I now have 32 heads of garlic of different sizes, I just finished today my production of last year, and so I did the welding, consuming little, there I will be able to be more greedy and plan something to replant and maybe buy a head or two, in any case, this year it will be half winter garlic planted in autumn and the other half planted in spring, because even if Didier tried, I have to try at home, because not the same climate and maybe a spring garlic planted in spring : Mrgreen:

I have some great leek plant that I have to transplant for at least a month, I need to find the strength, but also my attempt at transplanting endive which has also been waiting for the same period and all the seedlings for the winter who should have started

good if not at the moment i am making jams and zucchini sachets in the freezer for this winter's soups, and for this winter again pumpkins and pumpkins are growing, like sweet potatoes, foliage covers the ground, j 'may have tubers, in any case, on the sweet potato, I have progressed : Mrgreen: I only have 2 steps left to go through harvesting what to eat and what to make cuttings for the following year
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Doris » 31/07/21, 16:55

Moindreffor wrote:
Did67 wrote:
Biobombe wrote:Yeah, but how can you be sure of a remainder in N, how to measure / evaluate it?

There always is. No plant can grow with 0 N (zero nitrogen). So inevitably, when we harvest, there is still N in mineral form, including nitrates ... It is a serious error to think that nitrates only come from ammo-nitrates! And so that it is enough to garden "organic", with compost, or organic matter with urine, etc ...

But there are more or less left.

I think we have to stop tying knots in the brain, if we want to be careful, we start from the assumption that there are some left and we set up a winter crop of vegetables or other, or even nice weeds to pump the maximum in the soil before winter and recover it either in the form of vegetables that we eat, or green manure for the beginning of the following season

That's it for my part, the seedlings of residual pumps have been launched: I am actually taking advantage of the fact that in the Landes it is an exceptional year for cabbages, it's been a long time since we had this, so at me it is cabbage galore, plus a lot of other things too.
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Did67 » 01/08/21, 10:43

Biobombe wrote:For nitrates, nitrification, during cultivation and others, on the other hand, you wrote a great article that appeared in the press a few years ago, I must find it. But as I distribute my magazines after having read them and that they return to me but not always ...


To add insult to injury: I don't remember, otherwise I could look for the pdf!
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Biobomb » 01/08/21, 13:58

Did67 wrote:
Biobombe wrote:For nitrates, nitrification, during cultivation and others, on the other hand, you wrote a great article that appeared in the press a few years ago, I must find it. But as I distribute my magazines after having read them and that they return to me but not always ...


To add insult to injury: I don't remember, otherwise I could look for the pdf!


Non-serious fashion. How can you remember it, you were young once !.

That rainy day here, and at your place? I'll look in my mess to find him.
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Re: My kitchen garden of the least effort




by Did67 » 01/08/21, 17:03

Biobombe wrote:
Thanks for the colors, I don't think you've written this before?



I do not think so.

This is the very example of such obvious evidence that I do not think of formulating it! And this is also why the PP is a "scientific" vegetable garden and not a recipe vegetable garden - the kind of thing that I "automatically" take into account without even thinking, without even formalizing it in my head.

It is also there that, sometimes, when I see the videos of some, I say to myself "the unfortunate ones, they do not see that they are reproducing the failings of intensive agriculture that they denounce, just in another form? "
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