Energiestro (store energy by inertia in concrete)

[A.D. 44]

Thanks for this point.

[Eric DUPONT]

... only cold can be stored for long periods without significant loss. while the heat is lost by radiation ...

??? !!! Oh good ??? A delta equivalent the cold keeps better (for example a difference of -150 ° K or + 150 ° K for an ambient temperature of 0 ° c)?!?!?!

So ... if I cut my congelo, its indoor temperature will not move (or very little) because it's cold? I will try this today ... it will save energy.

Thank you so much!

even if I do not understand all the obscurities of Eric Dupont,

on this point he is a little right.

Regarding losses by thermal conduction, it is indeed the DeltaT that makes the law, whether in the hot or cold.

As for the exchanges by radiation, they are proportional to T ^ 4 in Kelvin (T power 4), and it is better to be in small temperatures than large ones.

But we can anyway create an adiabatic enclosure of good quality if we put a little means: insulation, vacuum, reflective aluminum film ...

it is very difficult to keep heat beyond several weeks. With equal insulation, liquid nitrogen will keep for years. In addition if you want to produce electric energy from heat, the efficiency will be modest 30 or 40% maximum, unless you have cold next to you, moreover it is the new project of bil gate, keep cold and heat to store large quantities and energy and restore it with a heat pump.

[Remundo]

by the way Eric, where are you with your cryogenic machine?

[Eric DUPONT]

I note a great ignorance concerning the storage of cryogenic energy. Associations like greenpeace complain that governments do nothing but at the same time are not interested in solutions ... which I am alone to implement.

[Remundo]

there would undoubtedly be something to do in the matter, indeed.

But the subject is still complex.

giants like Liquid air have everything to get down to business.

we could use excess electrical energy to produce liquid air, then relax this air by heating it.

around -200 ° C, we normally have oxygen AND nitrogen in liquid form. from 218 ° C, the oxygen solidifies, it is a defect in our objective.

to heat it, we can of course use the atmosphere, but we could go further: using fatal heat in industrial processes, or renewable fuels.

It would thus be possible to have more energy returned than that necessary for storage.

[moinsdewatt]

by the way Eric, where are you with your cryogenic machine?

His project is frozen.

[Remundo]

it throws a cold!

[Remundo]

I note a great ignorance concerning the storage of cryogenic energy. Associations like greenpeace complain that governments do nothing but at the same time are not interested in solutions ... which I am alone to implement.

hold on Eric,

I found an EU funded project right in your theme
https://cryohub.eu/fr/

[Eric DUPONT]

yes but after?

[Christophe]

... only cold can be stored for long periods without significant loss. while the heat is lost by radiation ...

??? !!! Oh good ??? A delta equivalent the cold keeps better (for example a difference of -150 ° K or + 150 ° K for an ambient temperature of 0 ° c)?!?!?!

So ... if I cut my congelo, its indoor temperature will not move (or very little) because it's cold? I will try this today ... it will save energy.

Thank you so much!

even if I do not understand all the obscurities of Eric Dupont,

on this point he is a little right.

Regarding losses by thermal conduction, it is indeed the DeltaT that makes the law, whether in the hot or cold.

As for the exchanges by radiation, they are proportional to T ^ 4 in Kelvin (T power 4), and it is better to be in small temperatures than large ones.

But we can anyway create an adiabatic enclosure of good quality if we put a little means: insulation, vacuum, reflective aluminum film ...

A little ... as you say and I will add a bit from afar !!

And I too have a hard time understanding this kind of reasoning distorted dark !!

Any body that is not at absolute ZERO will radiate !!

Radiation is the easiest heat loss to limit: just ask NASA, despite the extreme temperatures in space, spacecraft do not have a very large thickness of insulation! !

Conduction and convection are more difficult to limit .... over time!

In short, limiting losses by conduction / convection is exactly the same whether it is a positive or negative delta ... What defines thermal losses is the delta T ° between the body to be maintained at temperature and the average temperature of the medium and the quality of the insulation ...

Wanting to make a revolutionary cryogenic engine without understanding this basic thermal rule seems very ... uh ... daring ...