Eva Joly campaign 2012. Candidate and President ... one day?

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phil53
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by phil53 » 28/04/12, 20:46

Sen-no-sen, a tree depends on where it grows!
In a private property, it is even right can be extreme right.
In an Amazonian forest it is left.
Like men do.
And like most men, there is not much thought behind this commitment.
For, frankly, if we were truly intelligent, we have plenty to live on and flourish without starving or killing our fellow creatures.
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by Ahmed » 28/04/12, 22:08

Sen-no-sen wrote:
Sorry to break your idealism, but in the current system people vote primarily for telegenic people ...
If Hulot had appeared, EELV would have made 10% without much difficulty.

Do not worry! My idealism does not prevent me from being lucid and to recognize that you have, alas, perfectly right ... :frown:
What I claim is that "making numbers" with a media buffoon (whatever it is) can only push back the cause of ecology by scrambling the message.

If ecology can be heard one day, it will be on the ground and at the base and not by the grace of an electoral message spreading in profusion a light as sudden as miraculous on all citizens!
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sen-no-sen
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by sen-no-sen » 30/04/12, 15:34

phil53 wrote:Sen-no-sen, a tree depends on where it grows!
In a private property, it is even right can be extreme right.
In an Amazonian forest it is left.


:?:
Though on the left of a planisphere, I do not see how the Amazon Forest would be left? :frown:

Ahmed wrote:

If ecology can be heard one day, it will be on the ground and at the base and not by the grace of an electoral message spreading in profusion a light as sudden as miraculous on all citizens!


In the end, I strongly agree, nevertheless, politics - like so many areas of our society - are based on the manipulation of individuals.

In a system governed by lies, it is not good to tell the truth, hence the same methods should be used to convert the system, otherwise we risk waiting a long time ... a very long time for a " change "(which could, if we delay too long, take the form of a global cataclysm).
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by Ahmed » 30/04/12, 18:52

To fight with the same weapons as your enemy, you will become like him.
Nietzsche
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sen-no-sen
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by sen-no-sen » 30/04/12, 19:12

Ahmed wrote:
To fight with the same weapons as your enemy, you will become like him.
Nietzsche


And this is the goal, once it is possible to destroy it from within.

"The secret of combat is maneuver between the true and the false"
(Niju-karate-jutsu-Kyokun).
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by Ahmed » 30/04/12, 20:34

Ben, once like him, he won !?
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by gegyx » 01/05/12, 10:34

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by sen-no-sen » 01/05/12, 11:49

Ahmed wrote:Ben, once like him, he won !?


I'd rather say he started losing!
The use of stratagems of manipulation does not mean sharing the same ideology as the adversary.
Do you know the story of the Trojan horse?
Melting into one's environment to defeat one's prey is one of the most effective methods that one can do.
The balance of power of the "arm wrestling" type (but idea against yours) is not a guarantee of success.
Better - in appearance only - reassure your world and then take your opponent "little by little" on his ground.

If the "greens" suffer failure after failure, it is because they have sorely lacked strategy, and although they represent "benevolent" ideas, they are not left out in matters of internal strife and rotten blows within. even from their party.
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by Ahmed » 01/05/12, 14:15

If you want to use the same weapons as your opponent, so it's good that you want to locate you on his field :frown: ; If you manage to beat him that way, you will become the new representative of the same ideas.
This is what the left has done for a long time, confining itself to the economic terrain (that of the right) where it is sure to lose, or the elections, or its ideals ...
As for manipulation, it will only win the most manipulative ... by what miracle the best in this field would be the most "virtuous"?

Applied to the current election, J. Ellul said "The qualities required to become President of the Republic are incompatible with the exercise of this function".

Here, since we are in the quotations, this one of Nietzsche which is also relevant: " The state is the coldest cold monster. He lies coldly; and here is the lie that escapes from his mouth: 'I the state, I am the people'. ". *

* In "Thus Spake Zarathustra"
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by Obamot » 01/05/12, 14:44

On several occasions I have seen - even if it is only me - a very small circle of people working in the shadows (if indeed their aim is to support some virtuous values : Lol:) are capable of great things for the common good. And this, without necessarily constituting a majority (we can call this "collegiality") Because in general, this type of attitude for the good of the community, exceeds the understanding of those who are imbued with power, who having found that they do not "take" in such a 'universe' tear each other apart from each other ...

Only to make it work (it does not always work not all the time ...) it takes solidarity and a minimum of ambient lucidity. If the evil that gangrare a social environment is everywhere, because impossible compromises appeared (the game of the left for a long time) then it becomes too heavy.
The only hope of influencing the current situation is somewhat effective:
- a leverage by the legislative, and it must start with a serious awakening this first May ...!
- but before, must the other apple still be released.

Image

As Euronews says "Nothing is»
http://fr.euronews.com/2012/04/22/elect ... ollande-l/
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