Note2be.com, those teachers who do not support their notes

[Flytox]

Hello Marcel

I'm laughing. I'm a teacher too!
What are you going to do with these notes?
1) To fire the teacher badly noted?
And who will you wear instead? How will you select it? How will you train it? Already that it is difficult to recruit in certain subjects or certain regions!
2) Block the teacher's salary?
And do you think he will teach better? Naive !!!
3) Harass him, put pressure on him? What interest? Perhaps you hope to raise the suicide rate!

The teachers are like the others , they have strengths and weaknesses. The problem is that they are often quite proud and reluctant to listen to even constructive criticism. The "It's me who knows" syndrome. There is no feedback and too often little attempt to improve.

Feedback intelligent would greatly improve the performance of the less pedagogical teachers with the students. What is done in companies, we "measure" through "indicators" and "objectives" the "real" performance of employees. Behind, we do not seek "necessarily" to fail but to improve the service, to move on the right side by redefining the objectives for the year for example. But that necessarily involves changing habits and accepting performance measurement ...

In national education, it is not affecting my "privileges", we will see later, even if during this time, all this is done on the backs of the students .... but in the meantime, it is urgent to do nothing make.

[gegyx]

Is there a doctor in the room

Now it's

http://www.not2bib.com/

[marcel]

Flytox, how do you make it fit pedagogy in the curriculum and in the skull of the teacher? Do you think he decided alone in his little corner to be a bad pedagogue? At what moment of his training did you put in your hands and in the head something to be a good teacher? And what's a good teacher by the way? The one who pleases, the one who locks, the one who advances the weakest to the detriment of the best, the one who makes elitism at the expense of the less gifted? You are very great philosophers to have such a definite opinion! (Fashionable expression on the thread)
And then it is not enough to arrive on the stadium by claiming that the psg plays like manchester so that the players start to tease correctly the balloon! We have only what we deserve. The teachers are not good, should not select them, had to train them, must train them, give them tools, a better working environment (and I do not say that for you to turn it illico in more sub and less students, more staff and fewer hours). Even putting a lot of money on the table and training centers galore, we leave a zidane every 20 years. And you want 100% of teachers above the melee. The teachers are men and women like the others: they were children, they work, they are parents, or big, parents, they come from all the circles and were not selected in I do not know what imaginary breeding of fumitists budding.
Privilege of what? Privilege of having bad students in front of the muzzle? Me, I work 50 hours a week (that's not a complaint), I do the bullshit of the whole planet too. My training comes down to a collection of nonsense. I am finally like most of my peers a self made teacher! The administration (it was an inspector who had entrusted it to me) feels very hard to assess staff to whom it has not transmitted anything. If a teacher teaches a lesson, he knows what to expect from his students: the marking is legitimate. But the inspector who comes to note me while he has not transmitted anything to me (apart from three examples which follow each other), he cannot verify that I am applying his "no training" ... paradoxical (then the student's note in there !!!?). In the corporate world, it's different: you know what you have to do. The teacher, he has to find on his own how he has to deal with all different people, and if it was so easy, we wouldn't talk about problems in EN for a long time.
That said, if you have great friends, super-motivated, super-efficient, genetically selected super-pedagogues around, then bring them! I will be the first to be delighted to have very good ones around me.

What is your intelligent feedback? If you have a good method, write to the ministry. The teacher, he does not have the power to change the rating systems, recruitment, training.
Again feedback for what ???? You can give as many bad grades as you want to a student, it will not become good anyway ... it may even worsen. Why take this unfair and stupid system to charge the prof.

If you find that the last laguna is stew, are you going to bump into the worker of the assembly line or the seller of garge around? You only know about education from the teacher: the fuse, the interface. There are also other officials, more diffuse, less palpable.

I am not afraid of being evaluated, on the contrary. But let it be done with rigor, clarity and not according to rumor. I am the first to find it silly to be inspected 10 minutes every three years to receive a lump sum bill. But it was not me who created this system. If unions (which I sometimes disapprove of) tend to overlook other methods, it is simply because none is fairly impartial. So we prefer not to decide and put everyone on an equal footing. It is not a privilege: many teachers bear the brunt.

So, if you want, yes there are bad teachers. The problem is not only to detect it, it is mainly to remedy it.

[louphil]

I think everything is said, Marcel, I tried to get the message across in a softer way, but apparently, I must be a bad teacher, because it had not been well understood

[Remundo]

Ah ah! Marcel shows some authority ... particularly educational . He speaks truth and without concession.

Marcel, you would have 2/20 on the Not2be site ... because your communication mode is not suitable. In our modern society, you have to be demagogic, hypochrite and pet the audience in the direction of the hair which is not always oriented towards efficiency and pragmatism ...

[renaud67]

Maybe when you are born in it you do not realize the advantages that you have ...
I knew someone whose training and career were as follows:
agricultural engineer (70s)
then vine grower, trade unionist trainer,
then early 80s for lack of results in his vineyard and a family to support passes the teacher competition (at the time): he had then made me a remark that there was a good quality of life (it is true that it was in villages)
then another ten years later after a year off to prepare the math capes, he became a math teacher:
I ask him why this evolution: answer (except qulequechose): "I never supported the null annotations or other underlined in red without explanation".
I think that the most important for a teacher is to be a pedagogue more than a very good technician, pedagogy must be (if this is not the case) the preponderant subject of their training ...

[marcel]

Must see beyond the tip of his nose, his neighborhood, his school and his high school. Teachers, it takes hundreds of thousands. Finding so many educational geniuses is utterly utopian. It will especially be necessary to take care of accompanying the troop. This does not mean that some lost sheep should not be put in the closet. However, just because you're going to explode the teacher who bothers you doesn't mean that the national EN will get better. Are you sure that his successor, if you find one, will be up to the task?

To resume my parallel with football. We can judge that some (teachers) are void. But in the EN unfortunately, we have no one on the bench. Must turn with the team in place. So let's be modern and progressive, let's evolve the system rather than always looking for scapegoats.

Yes, remundo, I have my frank talk. I have a little bottle now in the middle. I look at the problems in the face and I try to have a synthetic (and not fragmented) vision of the
problems.

A small appendix: read the latest book by Pennac (school grief).

[renaud67]

We can be nuanced, right? do you have to be a pedagogical genius ... to teach?

[Remundo]

he becomes a math teacher:
I ask him why this evolution: answer (except qulequechose): "I never supported the null annotations or other underlined in red without explanation".
I think that the most important for a teacher is to be a pedagogue more than a very good technician, pedagogy must be (if this is not the case) the preponderant subject of their training ...

Hi Renaud67,

I am fairly fresh out of the competitions, I had my Agreg in July 2004. In September 2004, directly in preparatory class in Lyon (Lycée aux Lazaristes for Lyonnais). Afterwards, I moved to Paris, the Créteil academy being the "Dyson" vacuum cleaner for all young teachers ... yet another educational aberration in passing ...

I did my CAPES Agreg preparation year in Clermont and I thoroughly immersed in the anteroom of future teachers ...

In general, all of these contests are hyperselective on a purely scientific level.

Even orally, the lessons are explicitly written and exposed according to the following criteria:
- make a lesson as complete and thorough as possible after having underlined the prerequisites
- in 1 hour assuming an audience of "very good students", cad having mastered all the prerequisites of the lesson instantly including any normally structured presentation.

This approach has its logic: limited time, see what the teacher has in his stomach on a scientific level.

But, paradoxically, she absolutely does not measure her teaching abilities, i.e. explain to a student who does not understand much, who does not learn the lesson before, etc ...

So why doesn't pedagogy take up more space in training? This is a personal opinion which is only mine, but I let myself believe that pedagogy is a gift and it is very difficult to learn.

Pedagogy is also the state of a teacher completely dominating his subject. Even very complex things can then be well structured and clearly stated to students.

With the assumptions and validity limits! Students always tend to believe that a formula is "always true". Sign that they generally did not understand anything ...

In short, pedagogy, in my opinion, is an excessively demanding job of the teacher on himself, both scientific and psychological, because in a way, pedagogy is a schizophrenia of the teacher between:
- a specialist (scientific, literary, geo hist ...) hyper sharp and competent
- who puts himself in the place of a mediocre pupil to find the words and concepts necessary for the transmission of knowledge which is often (too?) complex for the "average" pupils.

A long work on oneself therefore... Under these conditions it is very difficult to teach pedagogy apart from some tips and tricks or "pedagogical theories" being the subject of sometimes well-thought-out theses within the IUFM ...

@+

[renaud67]

In my schooling (quite long) it was necessary to wait for a glue in mathsup for the teacher of the moment to tell us: what is in your mind what do you think this can be used for? and to develop a small example of the use in econometrics ... it's easier to learn (well, I think) when there is a tangible application behind (of course it's not always possible) ...
OK too, pedagogy is not easy but then what a return for the teacher to know if this knowledge passes well at the level of the students: he cannot be judge and party at the same time and I do not think either that an annual inspection is sufficient (my sister instit when she had CM2, took all these courses if she had a repeater).