Solar thermal: solar collectors CESI, heating, hot water, stoves and solar cookersOverproduction for swimming pools ... What mounting?

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epfyffer
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Overproduction for swimming pools ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby epfyffer » 01/04/20, 11:17

Bonjour à tous

I have a conventional thermal solar installation, 18m2 of self-building collectors, a 1000l boiler (too small) including 300 for DHW, all with Resol regulation. I have a cap that takes over in winter.

As the children grew up, we installed an above-ground swimming pool in front of the house, around 15m3. On the other hand, as we are at altitude (nearly 900m), the water struggles to heat except during a heat wave and it is sometimes difficult to motivate children to go for a swim.

I thought of using my solar installation to heat my swimming pool.

I found a pool exchanger, simple and that seems effective, sold second-hand for a bite of bread. It worked with a 40m3 installation, so it should be OK with my 15m3 pool.

As a reminder, my solar field is in a slope in front of the house (lower than the house), I have about 40m of pipe up to my boiler, on which the hydraulic group is fixed. The pool is against the house where the pipes from the solar field pass.

However, I would like to know how to plan the modification of my current installation for this assembly?

Here is the schematic diagram of my assembly:
Image

I think the idea will be to add a 3-way valve which will send the water from the collectors to my boiler as long as the water is not hot enough in the latter, then to divert the water into the heat exchanger. pool once the boiler water is warm enough. So I will need gear:
- a 3-way valve controllable by my regulation
- a T for return to the circuit (or do you need a 2nd piloted valve?)
- a pump for this new circuit, because my pump is now glued to my boiler (and therefore about 10m linear farther than the exchanger)
- a few meters of stainless steel tube and crimp fittings.

The idea would then be to create a "short circuit" which passes from the solar field to the pool exchanger, then returns to the solar field. And when the water in the boiler is too cool then it closes the short circuit and goes as usual in the long circuit to my boiler. And it would be necessary to regulate the regul on a double circuit, the normal one like today, then a 2nd which is activated (by modifying the circuit on the short), cuts the pump of the long circuit and activates that of the short circuit, and turns until the temperature is not X degrees in the pool?

Am I right or am I missing the plate?

Thank you for your help and your invaluable advice, in this period of confinement it is saving to have some projects!
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ENERC
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby ENERC » 01/04/20, 12:15

Hello,

it will not pass just with a 3-way upstream of the boiler: ie have two circuits in parallel: one for the boiler, the other for the pool exchanger? And pass the two returns with a Y to the same pump?
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epfyffer
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby epfyffer » 01/04/20, 12:23

the problem I have is that, to schematize, I have the solar field at point 0, the swimming pool at 5m from this point, then the pump and the boiler at 30m from there ... so I thought to avoid do a huge extra circuit.
FYI I have a pump available (I had to change mine in my heat pump when moving it ...)
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epfyffer
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby epfyffer » 06/04/20, 16:37

Well, well ... glad that it arouses such enthusiasm! ... : Cry: : Cry: : Cry:
: Cheesy: : Cheesy:
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Philippe Schutt
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby Philippe Schutt » 06/04/20, 21:28

I would put an ECS 300L boiler apart. no need to heat 1000L in summer. Unless you need the inertia of 1000L to compensate for rotten days?
Then:
if you put the pumps in the branches of your circuit, do not bother to put the V3V. 2 tees and check valves will do the trick. when your boiler is hot you turn off this pump and turn on the other.
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby AD 44 » 07/04/20, 06:24

Hello,

Can you make a diagram with the future modifications that you envisage?

Because I too can hardly understand why a V3V with an installation with two circulators ???

Otherwise, my opinion differs a little from that of Philippe concerning the ECS boiler. I find that your 1000L buffer with DHW in a bain marie is very good as well, at least you can better enjoy your 18m2 outside the heating period.
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epfyffer
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby epfyffer » 07/04/20, 12:43

Hello,

Thank you for your feedback.

The 1000l water-boiler has been in place for 10 years, it works well. So I'm not going to change it. I would just like to take advantage of the summer overproduction to heat a swimming pool via a water-water exchanger that I already have.

Here is what I have now (in simplified terms, just the simplified solar circuit). Note that the boil is close to 35m from the thermal sensor.
2020-04-07_12h37_08.png
2020-04-07_12h37_08.png (23.92 KIO) Accessed 692 times


And what I imagine having to do:
2020-04-07_12h37_18.png
2020-04-07_12h37_18.png (42.29 KIO) Accessed 692 times


The idea would be to use the regulation of my solar to manage the 2 bypass valves and the pump of the "short" circuit because I will not be there every day to open and close valves. So let the sun as now heat a little in the morning if necessary, and as soon as the water bath is at 60 or 65 degrees then we cut the pump of the large circuit (the one that goes to the boiler) and we activate that of the small circuit, and we move the valves so that the long circuit turns into a short product. Thus, the water will circulate in a short circuit from the sensor to the water-water exchanger, then return to the sensor.

Do not forget: between the water-water exchanger and the hydraulic unit connected to the boiler there are 15 linear meters, and it goes in 3 different rooms ... So the idea of ​​circulating everything and using the main pump seems unlikely ...

Thank you 8)
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby sicetaitsimple » 07/04/20, 13:34

A suggestion to advance (maybe?) Advancing the schmilblik:

why don't you put your exchanger on the "cold" part (therefore cumulus outlet to panels) by controlling the start of the pool side circulation pump to a temperature of the cumulus outlet fluid representative of the fact that it is thermally full?
You no longer need an additional pump and 3-way valves, your circuit works as usual, but once your cumulus is "full", you draw heat from the return circuit to the panels.
To see.
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby Philippe Schutt » 07/04/20, 13:47

in this diagram, the pool water / water exchanger always receives hot water from the panels. As soon as the filtration pump turns, it bites heat. However, it seemed to me that it turned continuously ... suddenly, nothing in the DHW tank. If you make your pretty drawings in openoffice, can you put the file and arrange it.
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epfyffer
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Location: Switzerland
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Re: Overproduction for swimming pool ... What mounting?

Unread Messageby epfyffer » 07/04/20, 14:59

sicetaitsimple wrote:A suggestion to advance (maybe?) Advancing the schmilblik:

why don't you put your exchanger on the "cold" part (therefore cumulus outlet to panels) by controlling the start of the pool side circulation pump to a temperature of the cumulus outlet fluid representative of the fact that it is thermally full?
You no longer need an additional pump and 3-way valves, your circuit works as usual, but once your cumulus is "full", you draw heat from the return circuit to the panels.
To see.


As I am sure to understand, you suggest that I mount the exchanger on the cold line without any modification, and that I activate the pump automatically by my regulation when the temperature of my cumulus is sufficient? And indeed, no more big modification needed ...? If that's the idea, will the passage of the solar cricuit in the pool exchanger lower the temperature enough so that the cumulus does not continue to heat? And if it cools down really very much, are we not going to cool the cumulus if at the sensor outlet then we are less hot than the temperature of the balloon? This is where I see a possible problem with this solution right?

Philippe Schutt wrote:in this diagram, the pool water / water exchanger always receives hot water from the panels. As soon as the filtration pump turns, it bites heat. However, it seemed to me that it turned continuously ... suddenly, nothing in the DHW tank. If you make your pretty drawings in openoffice, can you put the file and arrange it.

I am on Powerpoint I put the file in attachment.
I see what you mean Philippe. So we should do the same diagram but with the exchanger on the cold line?
Attachments
Schema_solaire_piscine.pptx
(40.84 KB) Downloaded times 1
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