Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?

General scientific debates. Presentations of new technologies (not directly related to renewable energies or biofuels or other themes developed in other sub-sectors) forums).
User avatar
GuyGadeboisTheBack
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 11828
Registration: 10/12/20, 20:52
Location: 04
x 3048

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by GuyGadeboisTheBack » 14/09/21, 15:19

Macro wrote:Guy ... I said that because there is a motorcycle, equipped with a "tank cover" which uses LHM for its clutch .... Given the ultra confidential distribution of the machine and the type of machine…. It would have given me one more reason to come for a motorcycle ride with you… (that said, I no longer have this motorcycle)

It was what ? A Honda?
0 x
Obamot wrote: Apologize for all the wrong you've done! Apologize here right away — especially to Christophe — and try not to do it again. It's not a “gag”. It's your only chance. If you wait too long you will pay a very, very high price later, a price you don't even suspect.

phil59
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 1507
Registration: 09/02/20, 10:42
x 291

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by phil59 » 14/09/21, 18:06

Suppose you lose the total annual loss in one day in the middle of winter.

What would that represent in terms of liquid, calories?

In € value, on something that is still going quite well as it is?
0 x
hmmmmm, hmmmmmmmmmmmmm, hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmm, huh, hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

: Oops: : Cry: :( : Shock:
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 72663
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8087

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by Christophe » 14/09/21, 18:38

Calculated and noted above: science-and-technology / thermal-buffer-to-prevent-surface-evaporation-of-hot-water-with-oil-or-another-blocker-t16964-70. html # p461871

500L evaporated at 40 ° C it is in the 330 kWh per year if the losses are 100% in evaporation at the level of the buffer ...

Okay, it's not huge (still the fuel oil equivalent of a full tank and over 10 years it starts to weigh!) Moreover the system works better when it is full ...
0 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping
phil59
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 1507
Registration: 09/02/20, 10:42
x 291

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by phil59 » 14/09/21, 19:03

And you want to take a risk for 500L per year, and again, 500L to really see ...

Of course, if the exchangers are fully submerged, it will be better.

But why not fill up every 2 months in the summer, and leave it like that for the colder season.

I wonder if the idea of ​​a food coloring would not make it possible to detect "aerial" leaks ...
0 x
hmmmmm, hmmmmmmmmmmmmm, hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmm, huh, hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

: Oops: : Cry: :( : Shock:
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 72663
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8087

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by Christophe » 30/09/21, 10:12

As soon as the dew has risen ... I will redo a weighing of the bottles today because it will be 40 days that the experience lasts (not 40 days of sun I specify ...) and bottles were opened when there was sunny and closed on rainy nights and days.

The bottle with the beads seems almost empty and the lightest ...

The rest in a few hours
0 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping

Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 72663
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8087

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by Christophe » 30/09/21, 15:27

Here it is weighed: LHM still largely in the head even if it lost 1g (measurement error?)

evap_day_40.gif
evap_jour_40.gif (43.79 KiB) Viewed 1177 times


20210930_144938.jpg


We can now conclude that the LHM is by far the most efficient (I continue the experiment, it does not cost much), if I left the bottle of LHM under the same conditions and if the 1g lost is not a measurement error. , it would take more than 5000 days to empty it, or more than 13 years!

5W40 engine oil blocks evaporation fairly well .... factor of 6 compared to the indicator.
The other oils are between 2 and 3 reduction factor, i.e. 2 times less than 5W40.

The 3 oils made emulsions + or - degeux with water except ISO 46 and especially LHM ...

The balls stop almost nothing (but slow down a little anyway: -20% daily evaporation) ...
2 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping
Obamot
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 25601
Registration: 22/08/09, 22:38
Location: regio genevesis
x 4555

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by Obamot » 18/10/21, 07:48

Christophe wrote:Nothing is decided yet ... I just know that the LHM is the only product of this basic test to have really blocked evaporation with 1 mm thickness ...

I remind you that it was at room temperature in a plastic bottle with a greenhouse effect under the solar radiation of this period ... we must now confirm that it works in a water bath at 60 ° C or more ...

After finding out about chemical incompatibilities: steel, aluminum, copper and cased concrete ... for metals I think they are found in Citroën's hydraulic circuits (to be checked) ... but for concrete ...

The LHM is 8 € per liter ... best price I found in a 1 L can ...

If I decide to make a layer of 2 mm I will therefore need 50L ... or 400 € ... so you have to be sure that it works and that it will not do any damage (even in the long term) ...

A lot of info on the LHM (it's less harmless than you might think ...)

https://www.hella-pagid.com/hellapagid/ ... HM_ENG.pdf
You will eventually have to redo the tests 1x during the fall and 1x in the coldest winter, to see if with different temperature, hygrometry and pressure variables, to see if the results are comparable, right?
0 x
humus
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 1951
Registration: 20/12/20, 09:55
x 660

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by humus » 18/10/21, 08:10

Christophe wrote:Here it is weighed: LHM still largely in the head even if it lost 1g (measurement error?)

evap_day_40.gif

20210930_144938.jpg

We can now conclude that the LHM is by far the most efficient (I continue the experiment, it does not cost much), if I left the bottle of LHM under the same conditions and if the 1g lost is not a measurement error. , it would take more than 5000 days to empty it, or more than 13 years!

5W40 engine oil blocks evaporation fairly well .... factor of 6 compared to the indicator.
The other oils are between 2 and 3 reduction factor, i.e. 2 times less than 5W40.

The 3 oils made emulsions + or - degeux with water except ISO 46 and especially LHM ...

The balls stop almost nothing (but slow down a little anyway: -20% daily evaporation) ...

Small more general question related to your solar system, it is the feedback that interests me, I am considering such a system for a new construction.
Did you put somewhere on the forum the sizing of your installation and the balance sheet?
Sensor surface, buffer volume, buffer insulation (?), Wall insulation, house surface, additional heating?
0 x
User avatar
Flytox
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 14089
Registration: 13/02/07, 22:38
Location: Bayonne
x 774

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by Flytox » 18/10/21, 23:34

LHM degrades with very little condensation water in the hydraulic circuit of cars (at least for Citroen suspension brake use). What will be the level of degradation / evaporation in a few months with direct contact with the fleet?
In addition it smells bad, I'm not sure that it is very good to breathe in the long run .... : Wink:

Have you studied the trail of the small polystyrene balls that float on the surface?
2 x
Reason is the madness of the strongest. The reason for the less strong it is madness.
[Eugène Ionesco]
http://www.editions-harmattan.fr/index. ... te&no=4132
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 72663
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8087

Re: Thermal buffer: avoid surface evaporation of hot water with oil or other blocking product?




by Christophe » 18/05/22, 23:24

You know what ?

The bottles have remained open outside for months, that is to say all winter and spring!

So they took on the one hand the humidity and on the other hand were able to evaporate...

And the only one that is still "heavy"...is the LHM...

I was not wrong !

Pictures tomorrow if you're good! : Mrgreen:
0 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping


Back to "Science and Technology"

Who is online ?

Users browsing this forum : No registered users and 63 guests