Hello
hot air convection towers have been built for a few years and turbines powered by the ascending air velocity provide power from 50 MW up to 500 MW.
energy free no waste, the tower of Manzanares (190 m of height) in Spain has provided 50 MW (of memory) since 7 years.
Other achievements are in court in Israel, Australia, etc ...
The principle is simple: to capture warm air on the ground (5km² greenhouse) which is then sucked into the tower.
See the site indicated above.
In my opinion the obstacle to overcome is to store hydrogen for use as fuel; it seems that this obstacle is rather financial than technical.
http://resosol.org/SolPass/Futur/toursolaires.html
Regards
Energy towers
Energy towers
0 x
we know how to produce plasma; the problem is to make the box to contain it.
the expert engineers to make this box have 100% chances of being hired to cadarache.
According to a senior CEA leader, the energy of the future is hydrogen produced with electricity. But the problem is still to contain it.
the expert engineers to make this box have 100% chances of being hired to cadarache.
According to a senior CEA leader, the energy of the future is hydrogen produced with electricity. But the problem is still to contain it.
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- Moderator
- posts: 79360
- Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
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These towers are very limited level performance (both technological and financial: a tower 1 km high is anything ...), so-called "vortex" models are much more interesting:
https://www.econologie.com/tour-solaire- ... -3493.html
https://www.econologie.com/tour-solaire- ... -3497.html
https://www.econologie.com/tours-solaire ... -3494.html
https://www.econologie.com/forums/tours-aero ... t3801.html
https://www.econologie.com/tour-solaire- ... -3493.html
https://www.econologie.com/tour-solaire- ... -3497.html
https://www.econologie.com/tours-solaire ... -3494.html
https://www.econologie.com/forums/tours-aero ... t3801.html
0 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum
A question comes to my mind ...
All representations of the vortex tower are sectioned. They assume that the solar energy that powers the "corolla", the base of the tower, is evenly distributed. However, this is not the case, only a small sector, that which is just in front of the sun receives a maximum of energy and this captured energy decreases rapidly as one moves away from the axis of the sun to be very weak for the part of the "corolla" located in the shadow cone of the tower.
The proposed architecture therefore inevitably generates air velocities and very heterogeneous temperatures in the gaseous veins opening into the tower.
My question is the following;
- Can it affect the operation of the tower by degrading performance?
- Did the designers think about mitigating this?
- The partitions have a helical shape which "sweeps" a certain sector of the "corolla", what is the opening of this sector (30 ° ?, 90 ° ?, 180 °?).
Having already read a lot on the subject, I do not remember that it was discussed here or elsewhere.
All representations of the vortex tower are sectioned. They assume that the solar energy that powers the "corolla", the base of the tower, is evenly distributed. However, this is not the case, only a small sector, that which is just in front of the sun receives a maximum of energy and this captured energy decreases rapidly as one moves away from the axis of the sun to be very weak for the part of the "corolla" located in the shadow cone of the tower.
The proposed architecture therefore inevitably generates air velocities and very heterogeneous temperatures in the gaseous veins opening into the tower.
My question is the following;
- Can it affect the operation of the tower by degrading performance?
- Did the designers think about mitigating this?
- The partitions have a helical shape which "sweeps" a certain sector of the "corolla", what is the opening of this sector (30 ° ?, 90 ° ?, 180 °?).
Having already read a lot on the subject, I do not remember that it was discussed here or elsewhere.
0 x
Hello Citro
Not sure I understood what you said, for me the sun is not a punctual lighting (it is rather gigantic) and is at (7 minutes light?) Of us and therefore the light rays that come on earth are nearly parallel. So all the points of the corolla that are not directly in the shadow of the tower receive the same energy.
A+
citro wrote::?: A question comes to my mind ...
All representations of the vortex tower are sectioned. They assume that the solar energy that powers the "corolla", the base of the tower, is evenly distributed. However, this is not the case, only a small sector, that which is just in front of the sun receives a maximum of energy and this captured energy decreases rapidly as one moves away from the axis of the sun to be very weak for the part of the "corolla" located in the shadow cone of the tower.
Not sure I understood what you said, for me the sun is not a punctual lighting (it is rather gigantic) and is at (7 minutes light?) Of us and therefore the light rays that come on earth are nearly parallel. So all the points of the corolla that are not directly in the shadow of the tower receive the same energy.
A+
0 x
Reason is the madness of the strongest. The reason for the less strong it is madness.
[Eugène Ionesco]
http://www.editions-harmattan.fr/index. ... te&no=4132
[Eugène Ionesco]
http://www.editions-harmattan.fr/index. ... te&no=4132
Hello Flytox
it is a serious mistake, The angle formed by the solar rays with the surface of the sensors is primordial.
If this angle is 90 ° the sensor will absorb most of the energy.
The further this angle is from 90 ° the more solar energy will be reflected.
it is for this reason that the most efficient solar collectors are those who follow the course of the sun ...
Flytox wrote:Not sure I understood what you said, for me the sun is not a punctual lighting (it is rather gigantic) and is at (7 minutes light?) Of us and therefore the light rays that come on earth are nearly parallel. So all the points of the corolla that are not directly in the shadow of the tower receive the same energy.
it is a serious mistake, The angle formed by the solar rays with the surface of the sensors is primordial.
If this angle is 90 ° the sensor will absorb most of the energy.
The further this angle is from 90 ° the more solar energy will be reflected.
it is for this reason that the most efficient solar collectors are those who follow the course of the sun ...
0 x
Hello Citro
We are certainly not talking about the same system, from what I understood is that the solar energy "collector" is a very large surface. Of soil all around the tower and in the shape of a flat corolla, not oriented mechanized, covered or not with a fleet basin (for the accumulation of calories) and therefore regardless of the location of the "sensor" from where you look , it makes the same angle with the sun. (there was a photo or an explicit diagram in Sciences et Vie .. still holds them!?)
You also have here the 3 functioning:
https://www.econologie.com/forums/tours-aero ... t3801.html
A+
We are certainly not talking about the same system, from what I understood is that the solar energy "collector" is a very large surface. Of soil all around the tower and in the shape of a flat corolla, not oriented mechanized, covered or not with a fleet basin (for the accumulation of calories) and therefore regardless of the location of the "sensor" from where you look , it makes the same angle with the sun. (there was a photo or an explicit diagram in Sciences et Vie .. still holds them!?)
You also have here the 3 functioning:
https://www.econologie.com/forums/tours-aero ... t3801.html
A+
0 x
Reason is the madness of the strongest. The reason for the less strong it is madness.
[Eugène Ionesco]
http://www.editions-harmattan.fr/index. ... te&no=4132
[Eugène Ionesco]
http://www.editions-harmattan.fr/index. ... te&no=4132
If yes, we are talking about the same system.
All the diagrams are in section, try to visualize this reversed corolla in 3D and you will understand better. Finally below the corolla helical partitions channel air flows to accelerate the flow in the gas stream and amplify the effects of Coriolis forces.
In my opinion, the further away from the optical axis the lower the efficiency of the sensor and the operation of the tower.
It therefore seems that the "corolla" architecture is not optimal from this point of view.
I would like to have the opinion of experts like Mr. COUSTOU ...
All the diagrams are in section, try to visualize this reversed corolla in 3D and you will understand better. Finally below the corolla helical partitions channel air flows to accelerate the flow in the gas stream and amplify the effects of Coriolis forces.
In my opinion, the further away from the optical axis the lower the efficiency of the sensor and the operation of the tower.
It therefore seems that the "corolla" architecture is not optimal from this point of view.
I would like to have the opinion of experts like Mr. COUSTOU ...
0 x
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- I learn econologic
- posts: 15
- Registration: 29/01/05, 16:55
- x 2
Do not forget that aerogenerating towers are not conventional solar towers.
They combine all the possible strengths and natural effects (plus, if possible, low recovery calories) in a unique structure optimized for this purpose.
In addition, the peripheral flaps open to the eventual wind (even light) provide both a slight overpressure at the base and the guarantee that the heated air will not cross the greenhouses to get lost unnecessarily around.
The vortex symmetry is further guaranteed by the vertical central axis.
For more information, visit:
http://groups.msn.com/ToursAerogeneratrices2/
There is a detailed description and many drawings and photos of models.
Currently, negotiations are underway for the development of an experimental prototype, but no construction has yet been decided.
On the other hand, an important article about them is announced in a US scientific journal, to be published early 2008. I will leave a message and the French translation on the site mentioned above when it will be done.
Alain Coustou
They combine all the possible strengths and natural effects (plus, if possible, low recovery calories) in a unique structure optimized for this purpose.
In addition, the peripheral flaps open to the eventual wind (even light) provide both a slight overpressure at the base and the guarantee that the heated air will not cross the greenhouses to get lost unnecessarily around.
The vortex symmetry is further guaranteed by the vertical central axis.
For more information, visit:
http://groups.msn.com/ToursAerogeneratrices2/
There is a detailed description and many drawings and photos of models.
Currently, negotiations are underway for the development of an experimental prototype, but no construction has yet been decided.
On the other hand, an important article about them is announced in a US scientific journal, to be published early 2008. I will leave a message and the French translation on the site mentioned above when it will be done.
Alain Coustou
0 x
- Capt_Maloche
- Moderator
- posts: 4559
- Registration: 29/07/06, 11:14
- Location: Ile-de-France
- x 42
Hey! say! I just found this post on the wind turbine towers
With the envisaged climbing velocities of the order of 60 m / s in a tower of 1000m surroundings,
imagine the trip: to be placed at the base with a parachute on the back and a bristle in the hand to be ejected to more than 1000m
It's super green and really fun
Where is this article?
With the envisaged climbing velocities of the order of 60 m / s in a tower of 1000m surroundings,
imagine the trip: to be placed at the base with a parachute on the back and a bristle in the hand to be ejected to more than 1000m
It's super green and really fun
On the other hand, an important article about them is announced in a US scientific journal, to be published early 2008. I will leave a message and the French translation on the site mentioned above when it will be done.
Where is this article?
0 x
"Consumption is similar to a search consolation, a way to fill a growing existential void. With, the key, a lot of frustration and a little guilt, increasing the environmental awareness." (Gérard Mermet)
OUCH, OUILLE, OUCH, AAHH! ^ _ ^
OUCH, OUILLE, OUCH, AAHH! ^ _ ^
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