Power supply Gazpar (and consumption?)

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chatelot16
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by chatelot16 » 11/03/16, 10:05

in a country that has too much money and not enough workers available it is necessary to automate everything and copy the meter reading!

it's absurd, we're in a country where there is too much unemployment and not enough money! it seems to me easier to use the old counter in place and continue to work people to meet them

but we are always in the same absurdity: in the account of grdf the labor costs more expensive than the material ...

when the state decides to move the social load of the work to the material one will stop perhaps to waste material! we will only automatize what deserves to be

Another note: a communicating meter seems useful when it allows a pricing according to the real time situation of the network ... linky and gaspar do not make real real time since transmitted one or 2 times per day: so it will not be enough not to make a real smart grid

the real smart grid will be very useful to reduce the need for storage of electricity, informing consumers of the abundance of electricity with lower prices to automatically turn on the device ... or put out when it is too expensive ... linky and gaspar are unable to do so since only communicating with the supplier but not with the customer

the solution seems simpler: keep simple meter for everyone, and add more powerful counter communicating with the box adsl customer for those who want to take advantage of smart grid variable rate ... in a first term is only the big energy consumers who will find a profitability to this system

linky and gaspart are bastard: too expensive for the ordinary customer and unsuccessful to do what it would take
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by chatelot16 » 11/03/16, 10:11

usually next to each gas meter there is a pressure regulator: this regulator could contain a turbine capable of powering the meter or meters that are next ... a battery that lasts 20ans seems to me expensive: it is possible but it will have to be big ... with a micro turbine in the regulator there is enough to recharge a battery
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by izentrop » 11/03/16, 10:19

chatelot16 wrote:linky and gaspart are bastard: too expensive for the ordinary customer and unsuccessful to do what it would take
+1
In addition, because of their communicating side, the smart ones will quickly bypass them and electricity suppliers will lose a lot in "scrambling" to carry out updates or unforeseen modifications.

It seems that it has already happened abroad http://forums.futura-sciences.com/habit ... ost5525191
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by moinsdewatt » 12/03/16, 14:02

GRDF deploys Gazpar and confirms the rise of biomethane

By PP, the 10 / 03 / 2016

..................

Deploying the Gazpar smart meter


But also, in four pilot areas *, the deployment of the Gazpar smart meter, of which 11 million will have to be installed throughout the territory between 2017 and 2022. After the first disputes concerning his counterpart Linky for electricity, the deputy director of GRDF has required to reassure on the weak emission of waves by Gazpar: "a radio emission equivalent to a garage beep to send the index of the day (...) and the equivalent of the deployment of 10 to 15.000 more mobile phones installed on the building roof, "said Jean Lemaistre. And to insist on "transparency" and the difference with the deployment of Linky: "The functions of the new meter have been defined in consultation with local authorities and consumer associations (...) the four pilot operations will be used to continue this consultation. "


* The four pilot zones Gazpar: 18 communes of the Pays de Saint-Brieuc, Le Havre, Nanterre / Puteaux, Rueil-Malmaison, 4e and 9e arrondissements of Lyon and Caluire-et-Cuire.

http://www.batiactu.com/edito/grdf-depl ... -44043.php
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by Christophe » 12/03/16, 14:17

chatelot16 wrote:linky and gaspart are bastard: too expensive for the ordinary customer and unsuccessful to do what it would take


Why is it too expensive since it is fully supported by the suppliers?

Suppliers will make the installation profitable in the medium term via:

to one better management of "smart gird" ... or "smart pipe" rather for gas!
Indeed: as industrial energy prices are quoted in real time, better knowing the needs will be an advantage in the management of the offer!

b) the invoices will be monthlyized in a more precise way, therefore more cash flow in times of high consumption.
What could affect the energy consumption but also overall of the most modest households ... we can hope that people will pay more attention to their consumption the least coldest?

c) Finally, another part of the profitability will be the end of cheating at disc counters or meter bypasses (you can be sure that some who are grumbling against smart meters are that kind of people ...)

And probably other reasons (am not an engineer at EDF nor ENGIE) ... because it is not with 2 3 € annual increase on the customer's bill that makes a meter that costs at least 200 € and whose life is 20 years ...
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by izentrop » 12/03/16, 15:02

Christophe wrote:c) Finally, another part of the profitability will be the end of cheating at disc counters or meter bypasses (you can be sure that some who are grumbling against smart meters are that kind of people ...)

Assumption fortuitous because no stats (known to the general public) about it and I think they have the means to notice it by comparing with a counter upstream (the hub for example) :?:
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by Christophe » 12/03/16, 15:20

I think that EDF has very good internal statistics on cheating ... but to speak about it publicly would admit flaws in their system and that would give ideas "to others". So they prefer to be silent ... logical!

From personal experience, I can tell you that they are more numerous than we think ...

And those who cheat, I can tell you that they cheat A LOT ... they are thousands or even tens of thousands of kWh per year erased or bridged, necessarily once the meter is open, you might as well "go there" ...

How to assume a cheater: one who heats up with electricity without thermostat ...
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by f6gia_88 » 12/03/16, 19:16

Yes, what is certain is that the Linky is powered by the 220 or EDF sorting network, so the no worry, for the gaspar, yes, it is an integrated battery that feeds and like many say it, the certainty that it lasts 15 or 20 years is not one.
For Linky's transmission levels, the first level is CPL OR VHF on 169 MHz or another in the band. The latter would only be mounted in place of the PLC module to connect the meters too far to have a reliable PLC link, I seem to have read beyond 400 M and if other CPL meters can not provide the necessary relay . This will involve a VHF antenna on the EDF transformer stations if meters must use VHF because of their distance, and this in addition to a GSM antenna ...

For Izentrop, the link is very difficult I do not always put my favorite book pages ...
Well, I found 1
https://www.labenergie-gdfsuez.com/fr/e ... nicant-gaz
Greetings to all
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chatelot16
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by chatelot16 » 12/03/16, 20:02

cheat with the old wheel counter I saw: a small hole above the meter to put a wire that touches the wheel, and prevents it from turning ... the one who did that thought it did not see each other because the meter was higher than him ... but for me, who was bigger, it was obvious like a kick in the ass

this kind of chaos can be done when the meter is in the house: edf can not enter before it is opened, so we can remove the wire before ... to find the fraud he must notice the hole

other possible means of fraud in a certain place: unscrew the fixing of the electric board to the wall and bend it: beyond a certain angle the wheel of the meter goes out of its normal position and hangs ... therefore free electricity: if the edf arrives it must be put back in place before letting them in

those who do this kind of shuffle do not do it full time to leave a reasonable consumption

there is no need for the linky to avoid these fraud: the electronic counters are enough

with the current electronic counter or the linky the only frande possible is the hacker connection upstream of the meter ... the linky will reveal the one that connects upstream upstream sometimes in normal to make a reasonable consumption ... but it does not will do nothing against the one that only plugs certain device upstream and the rest in normal

the only real way to detect hacker fraud is neighborhood counterfeit compared to the sum of the counter of customers ... but as the fraud is low it is possible that the accuracy is not sufficient ... the linky will not change much

the best way to detect fraud is competent agents who come to the meter ... the goal of the linky is to automate the survey and avoid visits ... so hacker connections will remain even longer invisible if no one come to see them
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Re: Gaspar power supply (and consumption?)




by Christophe » 12/03/16, 21:13

chatelot16 wrote:there is no need for the linky to avoid these fraud: the electronic counters are enough


An electronic meter does not prevent a bypass ... and some dare to do it!

Of course, they prevent the index from being hacked ... but they do not allow the smart gird / pipe, which makes electronic AND communicating meters "free" for the consumer!

In other words: EDF could not "offer" the change of electronic meter if they were not communicating ...
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