Car: interests of electronics in vehicles

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Leo Maximus
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View Leo Maximus » 01/06/10, 15:23

zorglub wrote: on the other hand, electronics is very good on the sole condition that the components are of quality (toyota) but not low-end as at renault (lifetime from simple to fivefold)


Macro wrote:Is it irony or what Zorglub ???
The toyota rav4 is the nightmare of its users because of the failure of the electronic management of its anti skating which burns the transmissions ..And the scandal of the accelerator knob of the aigo ???.


Japanese manufacturers in Europe use the same equipment manufacturers as European manufacturers.

There is no reason that the window regulators for Honda last longer than those for Renault or VW, they blow up at roughly the same mileage, there is nothing surprising, it is the same supplier, the German Bosch. Ditto for Lucas brakes, air conditioning, starter, Valéo alternator, etc ...

The reliability of Japanese cars is not a legend, but it concerns only a very small part of Japanese women in Europe, and again, especially older models.

Leo.
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Christophe
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View Christophe » 01/06/10, 15:53

Macro wrote:+1 with oiseautempete ....
For example
Many smart people have tried to pass atmo blocks in turbo on the XUD pigeot, the J8S rinault and the 2.5citroen of the cx j5 ext ... They have tried..You've had problems : Mrgreen:

A lot of invisible things without disassembly are different ...


There I agree but it does not really answer the problem. It's customization by the customer + or - random ... nothing to do with the work of a BE!

What I'm saying is this: for a current manufacturer who wants to maximize profits (even more than before), making a single electronically flanged motor will cost less than making 1 motor with specific mechanical parts for each power!

By finding the weights of each engine / power, one could confirm or deny this.

Question customize, there are some who do it even on motorcycles, the famous ghost rider for example: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5qcr_ ... busa-turbo but zon more problem with the law than with mechanics! : Cheesy:

But often we perfere a mechanical turbo (supercharger) easier to mount on motorcycles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11SfeOim1xM pov beast ...

And apparently : Cheesy:
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zorglub
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View zorglub » 01/06/10, 16:06

Japanese manufacturers in Europe use the same equipment manufacturers as European manufacturers.


okay, but the manufacturer can impose different quality of components
on the other hand, the faults appeared on certain models come from a defect of design and not from the quality of a component, which is different - not to confuse origin of the defect and result generated by the defect
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every morning you look naked in a large ice after 3 minutes you will see that your home and your worst picture ......
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Macro
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View Macro » 01/06/10, 16:18

Christophe wrote:
There I agree but it does not really answer the problem. It's customization by the customer + or - random ... nothing to do with the work of a BE!

What I'm saying is this: for a current manufacturer who wants to maximize profits (even more than before), making a single electronically flanged motor will cost less than making 1 motor with specific mechanical parts for each power!


A standard block of mobile assemblies with different adapted external equipment (cooling, lubrication, etc.)

It is a technique resulting from the industrial motorization where one could see 20 years ago of celar the same engine passing from 160 to 235cv in two or three stages by the addition of a bigger turbo then of an intercooler ... At each stage the quantity of lubricant and the area of ​​the radiators were doubled ...
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oiseautempete
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View oiseautempete » 01/06/10, 19:50

Christophe wrote:[A lot of invisible things without disassembly are different ...
************


What I'm saying is this: for a current manufacturer who wants to maximize profits (even more than before), making a single electronically flanged motor will cost less than making 1 motor with specific mechanical parts for each power!

But often we perfere a mechanical turbo (supercharger) easier to mount on motorcycles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11SfeOim1xM pov beast ...

And apparently : Cheesy:


If you carefully read the file to which I sent you the link, you will see that a lot of parameters change and in this case not just software hacks, but parts (ex: 1 simple turbo, variable geometry turbo, 2 turbos (double-stage supercharging), which implies a lot of things and a considerable difference in price ex-factory between the versions, which the manufacturer would have to be crazy to tie to make an ultra sophisticated engine bridled to death because the margins of subcontractors are very weak ... and in reality there are about as many groups of different constituents as there are engine versions, even between the BMW 118D and the 120D the cooling system and the turbo are different. ..
A "supercharger" is a positive-displacement compressor, most often of the roots type (with lobes), very power-hungry (up to 1/3 of hp absorbed!), Nothing to do with a turbo which operates almost "for free. "... but the advantage is that a compressor supercharges from idle: no" hole "...
On an original "kite" engine with a compressor (or an injection of nitrogen peroxide or hydrogen), the duration of use of the overpower (50% more power) is limited to 30 ... seconds because the overheating is violent ... there was this kind of system for Citroën DS (Constantin or Bertin compressor), in this case the compressor only engaged when you crushed the accelerator pedal fully ... and the supercharging was moderate so as not to break the engine ... the advantage is that by driving "normally" it did not consume more, but when you wanted to exceed it was 30hp more under the foot ... and an unspeakable consumption : Cheesy:
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I Citro
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View I Citro » 01/06/10, 23:54

Macro wrote:...
Many smart people have tried to pass atmo blocks in turbo on the XUD pigeot, the J8S rinault and the 2.5citroen of the cx j5 ext ... They have tried..You've had problems : Mrgreen:

A lot of invisible things without disassembly are different ...
Well yes, starting with the distribution diagrams, so the camshafts ...

In the same order of ideas but by modifying only the electronics ... many TDI 90hp have been "chipped" to go to 110, even 130hp ...
Those whose engines did not break had surprises a few years later, being rejected by anti pollution controls.
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gildas
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View gildas » 02/06/10, 00:08

deleted text
Last edited by gildas the 22 / 06 / 10, 23: 15, 1 edited once.
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Christophe
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View Christophe » 02/06/10, 00:16

oiseautempete wrote:If you read carefully the file of which I sent you the link


Well, where is this link? :?:

Edit, I think I saw it: http://www.auto-innovations.com/site/do ... print.html
Last edited by Christophe the 02 / 06 / 10, 12: 58, 1 edited once.
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Macro
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View Macro » 02/06/10, 10:14

: Cheesy: Nostalgia for the good old days or we did anything ...
The 1400Z Godier Knee turbo ... From 175 to 235hp according to the turbo setting a delirious power curve in 1000rpm it took 100hp (between 6500 and 7500) .. The kick in the ass of death
Image : Cheesy: : Cheesy:
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oiseautempete
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View oiseautempete » 02/06/10, 12:53

citro wrote:Well yes, starting with the distribution diagrams, so the camshafts ...

In the same order of ideas but by modifying only the electronics ... many TDI 90hp have been "chipped" to go to 110, even 130hp ...
Those whose engines did not break had surprises a few years later, being rejected by anti pollution controls.


The distribution diagrams are still nothing, the changes go much further than that (see the link on BMW engines in a previous message that some seem to have "skipped" ...) ... The hacks on TDI at chip base play in particular on the excess air of the diesel: this results in abundant black smoke during acceleration and monstrous pollution ... 130hp but not for long because the pistons break down by overheating, although these engines endured from the point of mechanical view better than others an increase in power (= proportionally more heat and mechanical stress) at the level of the mobile crew because they are very oversized because of the brutality of the TDI (knocking which causes the sound "tacatacataca" very characteristic of these engines and which does not exist on the HDI thanks to the mini multiple injections which attenuate the clicks and are in the process much more effective level pollution (no TDI pump injector passes the euro 4) ... and allowto use simpler and less expensive design techniques (abandonment of expensive brass ringed pistons for example), moreover VW / Audi adopted them (like all other car manufacturers) as soon as the old TDI "pump injector" had been abandoned in favor of the common rail ...
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