The car of the future

Transport and new transport: energy, pollution, engine innovations, concept car, hybrid vehicles, prototypes, pollution control, emission standards, tax. not individual transport modes: transport, organization, carsharing or carpooling. Transport without or with less oil.
Leo Maximus
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Re: The car of the future




by Leo Maximus » 28/02/19, 15:01

According to sprintmonitor, the BMW-powered Isetta has an average consumption of 5,23 l / 100:

Isetta.jpg
Isetta.jpg (21.42 KB) Viewed 4732 times


It's 1/2 liter Furthermore that the Yaris hybrid ...

Link : https://www.spritmonitor.de/fr/detail/402496.html
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Christophe
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Re: The car of the future




by Christophe » 28/02/19, 15:36

Uh yes Leo, but you compare 2 cars with 50 years of difference in engine technology ... you would have to compare the original iseta with cars of its time ...

5.2L at 100 is a lot, it was a 2 stroke engine?

The 100% electric Microlino only takes up the concept (questionable see my previous message) of the Iseta,
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Re: The car of the future




by Christophe » 28/02/19, 15:41

Christophe wrote:5.2L at 100 is a lot, it was a 2 stroke engine?


Answer: yes and no : Cheesy: it depends on the country and the production period! And the 2 cc 236-stroke version was equipped with an unconventional 2-stroke engine ...

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isetta

Originally, the 198 cm3 two-stroke engine was fitted with a semi-automatic mixer to supply ordinary gasoline, which developed 9,5 hp at 4 rpm.

In France and Italy, the two-stroke engine used is a 236cc Puch original twin-cylinder,

It has a fairly rare characteristic: The U-shaped sweep, which is found on Puch motorcycles.

Indeed, two pistons with clearly different diameters perform the traditional functions of the two-stroke engine (intake, compression, sweep-transfer, explosion and exhaust) by working in two very distinct parallel cylinders, but capped by a single cylinder head, and journalling on a single crankshaft via a “forked” connecting rod


For its part BMW will choose a 245cc four-stroke derived from the excellent 3-stroke motorcycle engine fitted to the BMW R4 (which is a kind of half flat-twin) using many common parts of the 27 twin-cylinders.


1959 a priori it is the 245cc BMW ... so 5,2 L for a (even old) 4 stroke 245cc is a lot ...

BMW Germany: 136 from 567 to 1954
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dede2002
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Re: The car of the future




by dede2002 » 01/03/19, 14:49

Christophe wrote:We talked about it here new-transport / car-the-future-of-t6803-3010.html few months ago...

Personally I'm not a fan of the "Microlino" concept at all and I think many drivers will think like me:
- the entrance to the car is too original (opening hood)
- little room (comfort ??)
- no or very little protection before occupants in case of accident (I even wonder how she was able to pass the homologation)
- very average aerodynamics

At the time of the original there was no SUV in town at almost all crossings, in 2019 yes ...

I would like to see the Microlino crash test results ...

I much prefer (in all respects) the Lumeneo Smera presented here: new-transport / car-the-future-of-t6803-2990.html # p333139 (project unfortunately entered)


Well if you think like that, you should especially not ride a motorcycle or even a bike ...

Otherwise, aerodynamics in town has very little influence, resistance increases squared by speed. I already had the opportunity to try a Isetta BMW and it was pleasant, amazing handling and impression of guaranteed speed from 60 km / h :)
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Leo Maximus
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Re: The car of the future




by Leo Maximus » 03/03/19, 11:24

Christophe wrote:... there were no SUVs in town at almost all crossings, in 2019 yes ...
I much prefer (from all points of view) the Lumeneo Smera ...

A vehicle like the Lumeneo Smera costs as much (or even more) than an SUV, without having the versatility. It is guaranteed failure.

In an SUV, you can drive 5 on the highway, tow a trailer to move friends over the weekend, transport bikes ... :) And what is called "SUV" is nothing more than a body style, so are most so called "4x4s".

A vehicle like the Lumeneo Smera would be interesting if it were sold as a kit, at 10000 ~ 15000 €. But which company would go into it? And the state would make no effort because it would gain nothing.
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Leo Maximus
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Re:




by Leo Maximus » 22/03/19, 11:15

Michel Kieffer wrote:Maximus

Useful energy on combined ECE15-OA cycle:
- for a RENAULT VESTA “hybrid and spiral” type vehicle: 17,0 MJ per cent
- for a Prius: 39,3 MJ per cent

In other words, with equivalent technology, a RENAULT VESTA type vehicle "hybridized and spiraled" consumes 57% less than a Prius!

This also illustrates that the figures that we find often lack rigor and / or do not specify their contexts of obtaining. That is to say that the calculations are ultimately more rigorous, especially during comparative studies.

Note:
- the method of calculating the performance of the Prius, proposed in the document “hybrid vehicles” http://www.hkw-aero.fr/energies.html is inherently reliable;
- the consumer data are also reliable given their origin (INRETS tests).

Michel


Renault has completely dropped the famous Vesta and is preparing to market the Clio hybrid (non-rechargeable):



The basic principle is that of Toyota where the electric traction motor is connected to the drive wheels, without clutch, with a fixed and unique ratio. The electric motor therefore always runs and the thermal intervenes when there is a need for power. At the thermal level, the transmission is different because there is a gearbox with fixed ratios while at Toyota there is no gearbox.

Reverse gear is obtained by reversing the direction of rotation of the electric traction motor, as in Toyota.

Renault announces that the electric mode of the Clio hybrid will allow a range of 4 km, so it would be much better than Toyota (2 km). But you should know that, in the non-rechargeable hybrid, it is in the interest of keeping the battery charged to the maximum otherwise the hybridization becomes inoperative which leads to overconsumption. In any case, the motorization puts itself in all-electric mode by stopping the heat engine on 50% of the journey. It is clearly written in the Toyota user manual and we will necessarily find this in the manual of the Clio hybrid.

The Clio Hybrid should not benefit from the bonus ... : Shock: (normal ... it will consume less energy : Lol:). The engine is largely of Nissan origin.
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Christophe
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Re: The car of the future




by Christophe » 02/04/19, 09:28

Seat has just presented the Twizy clone: ​​the Minimo seat, everything is good according to me ... except the name: Transportation-electric / seat-minimo-la-renault-twizy-finally-over-all-is-good-but-the-name-t15986.html
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Christophe
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Re: Re:




by Christophe » 02/04/19, 09:31

Leo Maximus wrote:Renault has completely dropped the famous Vesta and is preparing to market the Clio hybrid (non-rechargeable)


Twenty years behind the Prius?

In short, Renault has doubly everything wrong: instead of making a simple, light and aerodynamically optimized vehicle like the Vesta, they continue the bullshit ... since I bet the hybrid is heavier than the equivalent thermal ...

4 km of autonomy in full electric ... terrible!

Then 150 patents for a concept already marketed 20 years ago? Uh it's April 1st? : Cheesy:
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Leo Maximus
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Re: Re:




by Leo Maximus » 16/04/19, 10:49

Christophe wrote:... 4 km of autonomy in full electric ... terrible! ...

This remark makes no sense regarding a NON-rechargeable hybrid.

By forcing the "full electric" mode with the manual EV mode (button on the central console), the battery is drained (!), Suddenly the hybrid system becomes ... ineffective ! : The thermal starts to turn fully to recharge the battery even when stopped or downhill, a shame! Consumption increases by 50%.

Hybridization (not rechargeable) is only effective when the battery is fully charged. In practice, you should always have 6 bars out of 8 on the bargraph. This is where I commonly make less than 4 l / 100 of E10 in the city.

During the takeover of Nissan, Carlos Ghosn had blocked all research on the hybrid because he had not understood the principle. It will have taken 20 years.
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thibr
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Re: The car of the future




by thibr » 18/01/20, 09:49



do not throw yourself into the chair otherwise you fold the car in half : Mrgreen:
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