Renault presents the mobility of tomorrow - A video of 5 '

[Macro]

Yes ... A gasoline tank ... The roof is that the caculator (charge discharge) is cooled by cooling liduide and an energy-consuming pump ... That said it would be insufficient to heat the passenger compartment. ..

[Woodcutter]

Thank you Elec for the link, this little film is interesting!


However, that:

[...] A key innovation:
"A business model close to that of mobile telephony"[...]

it's overly scary!

When we see the excess CON-summation to which this "model" leads, if we multiply that by the mass of the VE, I don't see how we can hope to get out ...

But in fact, in the explanation that follows, there is a clue: Renault has found a solution not to implode its structure and to continue to make the motorist a regular source of income, not only linked (feet & fists ... .) to the sale of the object of displacement, but also (and especially) to its use.
The state must also have put a grain of salt (the gabelle?) In there, for compensation of TIPP, I suppose.

[Christophe]

it's overly scary!

Toutafé, this classifies EV in the same category of "consumable" as mobile telephony.

In addition, we pay less attention to a vehicle that we rent (even on leasing or renting) than to a vehicle that we actually own and that we want (hope) to keep for 10 or 15 years ...

The state must also have put a grain of salt (the gabelle?) In there, for compensation of TIPP, I suppose.

+1, that's why the 1 € / 100km is completely idealistic ... not to say lying! Or it will be the case at the very beginning ... to attract the customer!

Citro pays only in electricity, that is to say excluding vehicle depreciation, almost € 3 / 100km with its 106 electrics...and nobody will make me believe that "techno" has evolved so much in 10 years to have been able to divide the costs by 10 to 20 and allow to charge only 1 € / 100km especially given the infrastructure investment !!

Now if Renault and BP (bPlace ... not the tanker) can really guarantee a VERITE price at 1 € / 100km I would sign my eyes (almost) closed ... like 90% of the French!

[I Citro]

+1, that's why the 1 € / 100km is completely idealistic ... not to say lying! Or it will be the case at the very beginning ... to attract the customer!

Citro pays only in electricity, that is to say excluding vehicle depreciation, almost € 3 / 100km with its 106 electrics...and nobody will make me believe that "techno" has evolved so much in 10 years to have been able to divide the costs by 10 to 20 and allow to charge only 1 € / 100km especially given the infrastructure investment !!

Well already, just by charging just the night rate and despite the additional cost of the double rate subscription, we must be able to reduce the budget by 30% easily ...
FYI, my employer buys electricity at 0.02 € HT at reduced rate and 0.03 € HT at full rate ...
Me it's 0.08 € HT full price ...

So with a well negotiated supply and a well managed network,
for example with charging stations equipped with PV ... It's playable.

By the way, EDF's news of the day: They are asking to be able to increase the price of electricity by 20% to "reduce their debt" (or rather increase the remuneration of their executives and shareholders).
Who said that privatization would benefit the consumer ...

[Woodcutter]

[...] In addition, we pay less attention to a vehicle that we rent (even on leasing or renting) than to a vehicle that we actually own and that we want (hope) to keep for 10 or 15 years. . [...]

Yes, but there it is only the battery and the current which one puts in which is "fixed".

[Elec]

Robot Station, demonstration (it will be demonstrated at the next Frankfurt auto show): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_w3dGjds7ek
Exchange (made more than 1000 times in public in Yokohama, Japan) in 1 minute 20, which will be optimized for a reduction to 50 seconds. The robot adapts to ten types of batteries.

Infrastructure for long distance journeys (less than 10% of journeys):

For France, 1000 robot stations along the main roads would be sufficient, “Which amounts to around 350 million euros of investment. However, 350 million euros is the price of petrol consumed in France for approximately three days. If I told you that you can get rid of oil for the price of three days of consumption, the question is: why didn't we think about it earlier? ”

NB - The fastest charging stations currently available allow recharging a 24kWh battery in around 30 minutes. It is too long, impractical for the motorist when recharging on long journeys along major traffic axes (motorway, national road etc.). The fast terminals are suitable for recharging at supermarket parking lots etc. And the slow charging stations (ordinary socket at home) are suitable for nighttime charging at home.

[Woodcutter]

You are nice to come and teach us Elec, but I see that your reasoning still does not take into account the criticisms that we may have made a few weeks ago ...

[...]
For France, 1000 robot stations along the main roads would be sufficient, “Which amounts to around 350 million euros of investment. However, 350 million euros is the price of petrol consumed in France for approximately three days. If I told you that you can get rid of oil for the price of three days of consumption, the question is: why didn't we think about it earlier? ”

To "get rid of oil"as you say (very demagogic shortcut, I think that a politician would not do better ...) the whole fleet (automobile at least, the lie would already be less rude ...) should be electric.

Renault plans to sell 20% of its vehicles in 2020 in electric. OKAY.

Renault currently achieves, on a market that fluctuates around 2 million units per year, around 30% of sales, or 600 vehicles / year. 000% is 20 vehicles / year. Certainly.

The total French market is around 36 million passenger vehicles. Ouch! It is currently increasing by around 1 million vehicles / year ... Ouch!

How do we "get rid of oil"by replacing (?) 0.25% of the thermal park by electricity per year ???

Then, how do we manage, during major departures for example, the fact of having to be able to exchange batteries (how many different models?) Several million times?
Take it into account, a 3-lane highway saturates at more than 5000 vehicles / hour (more than 100 vehicles / day), and during major departures, there are several dozen points in France where the 000-lane motorways are saturated several times per day ...) and you will have to change batteries 3 times to do Paris-Marseille ...

I don't see how "only 1000 stations" would be able to do this ...

I dare to hope that this time, I would have the right to a real clear and precise explanation, and not to this haughty arrogance of "the one who knows" as during our last exchanges ...

The ball is in your court !

[Elec]

5000 cars / hour (on major roads, during peak periods) = 84 robots (exchange in 50 seconds rounded to 1 minute).

Divided into 4 stations (one every 50 or 100 km), this makes 21 robots per station (5 lines with 4 or 5 robots in a row).



Vehicle range:> 150km, much more in the years to come. The growth of the electric vehicle fleet from year to year will be accompanied by an increase in battery performance (more autonomy). Important technological breakthroughs have occurred in recent months with regard to batteries. With greater autonomy, fewer exchange stations will be needed. This temporal dynamic should be integrated at the prospective level.

At first, 1000 stations will be perfectly suitable during normal periods (i.e. 360 days out of 365).

If it were then necessary to go to 5000 stations to manage the peaks of departures on vacation, that would, at the investment level, only 15 days of national gas bill instead of the 3 indicated.

The question still remains:

"Why didn't we think of that sooner?"

NB - The petrol stations are sized to cope with peak periods. Most of the time, they are not 100% full. There is no reason why you cannot manage an electric service station in the same way.

Note that refueling easily takes 10 minutes between filling the tank and then paying. In an electric service station, no need to get out of the vehicle, refueling is done in a minute, and payment is automatic (no need for a bank card).

[dirk pitt]

and above all, why suppose that the peaks of departures on vacation by car will last ???

out of habit, we always assume that what we have today remains true forever.

maybe in 20 years, the mobility will be completely different and especially so expensive individually that there will be no problem of peak departure by car.

Were there problems with peaks on the roads in 1936 or 1937 for the first paid holidays?

[Christophe]

and above all, why suppose that the peaks of departures on vacation by car will last ???

Uh ... Maybe because the "astral movements" are unlikely (fortunately) to change so soon .... in other words: people go on vacation when the weather is nice! ...

Now it's true that with global warming ... we're sure of nothing ...

Otherwise Elec, I'm happy to see that there is something "concrete" at BP: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_w3dGjds7ek

But with these robot stations is there not a great risk of taking a monopole with the consequences that we can guess?

If I buy a mitshubishi e-Miev tomorrow, will it be compatible in 2011 with these betterplace stations?

And I still don't know how they can keep the figure of € 1 per 100km ...

ps: if not for image uploads, Elec, you don't have to use the postage stamp format (avatar upload) ... use the other page, because here we don't see much.