New Peugeot hybrid gasoline / air: 3l / 100Km

[BobFuck]

Asynchronous motors are not necessarily well suited to traction.
Their efficiency is (a little) lower, their driving is much more complex and their starting current is very important (or if we limit the starting current, the torque is lower).

In fact, it's the most suitable type of engine (with the SRM starting to arrive), which is why we can not find more than that in recent trains, trams, subways, boats, etc.

The steering is complex but it is not a problem for modern electronics. For the SRM, the steering is even more complex, but the engine is smaller, cheaper and more efficient, which largely offsets. The complexity is mostly code ... which costs nothing in production costs, only in development. If you replace a kilo of copper with code, you make money. A more powerful DSP to drive the engine costs less than copper 500gr ...

So, for traction, what is interesting is the efficiency, power and torque of the engine over the entire range of useful speeds, and over a wide range of load. And the ratio of all this to price and weight.

This is very different from an application like a pump where the motor will always run with a speed and a load almost constant.

So, the brushless has an excellent performance on a small range of speeds, outside this range, it is to shit (really). But the couple is good. Extraction of rare earths (neodymium) generates an apocalyptic pollution, in addition it is expensive.

The asynchronous has a maximum yield a little worse, but it remains good over a wide range of speeds, is cheap, but is heavier and has less torque. Raising the frequency requires more gears output, but the engine becomes more efficient.

The SRM is a bit like asynchronous, better: the rotor is a piece of scrap that costs nothing, it is lighter, more output and more torque over a wider range of speeds, etc. But it's new, it's going to be democratized.

The worst of all is of course the direct wheel motor without gearbox.

> asynchronous motors are much heavier than universal motors!

The universal motor (ie, series without magnet):
- very good power / weight ratio (for the portable power is essential)
- very cheap
- very good starting torque (useful for a drill)
- yield more than le (50-60% under optimum conditions)
- short life
- fast overheating (when you have a 0.8kW motor in your drill and it has 60% of losses, it is a lot of watts to evacuate, so must blow on very strong ...)

Otherwise + 1 chatelot.

[BobFuck]

Horizontal axis, speed, vertical axis, etc.

Series universal motor (typical): peak efficiency at 60%, it's ugly.



Typical bruslhess, the output peak is very narrow, to have more 85% it's 2500 to 3500 rpm! This style of engine can not be used in a wide speed range (which is why electric bicycles with legal hub motors do not climb the rim ...)



Asynchronous motor: it becomes more respectable. We are above 85% from 2000 to 1000 rpm, and above 90% within a good range.



The, an asynchronous and its controller combined,> 85% from 3000 to 10000 revolutions and over a fairly large load range too.



But, it moves: there is research.

For example, Swiss have glued permanent magnets in the stator of an SRM. Impressive result, but too clean curve, maybe a simulation:



Et the Chinese are also on the spot. They have added a field coil on the rotor (they may have enough lunar landscapes neodymium mines! ...). Performance includes the controller!

More than 90% of 2000 to 4000 rpm on 80% of the torque range ...
The area at 80% is huge ... in fact it covers just about every speed of a car. And even at ridiculous speeds the yield is decent.

It looks like the asynchronous engine, but a bit better, and lighter.

[/ Url]

Short. The coming years will be interesting.

After that, it will be enough to build a few hundred coal power plants to power all these electric cars. Finally, the Germans have expertise in the field now: we can buy from them.

[I Citro]

Yes, Leroy Somer engines mounted on the 106 / Saxo and Berlingo / Parter are dinosaurs.

This was confirmed to me by an engineer from Leroy somer in Angouleme who told me that this engine was made with parts of generarice whose initial performance was not ideal.

its particularity is the separate excitation of the stator which makes it possible to deliver a high torque from the start.

[Alain G]

The worst of all is of course the direct wheel motor without gearbox.

I hope you're kidding !!!


Either you lack knowledge or have missed something!


I invite you to visualize the hydro-québec wheel motor that is found on the forum.

[BobFuck]

According to the patent is a brushless with lots of permanent magnets.

So, post a performance curve like the ones I put, where we see the performance depending on the conditions ...

Well, of course, with several kilos of rare earth magnets in each wheel, the price of the car will be gold plated, not to mention the very very non-renewable and ultra polluting resource ...

It's been decades that technology exists and manufacturers are looking for ways to not use it: there is a reason ...

A trick that works, however:

Trolleybus Cristalis
The Irisbus Cristalis is a trolleybus available in two versions of 12 and 18 meters called ETB 12 and ETB 18. The difficulty of installing an 80KW traction motor in the hub of the wheel made it necessary to design an ultra-compact motor running at very high speed (9 000 rpm), cooled by water. It is a three-phase asynchronous motor chosen for its excellent weight / power ratio. This motor is coupled to a gearbox on which is fixed the rim. To achieve the most compact package possible, Michelin has developed a double-width tire that replaces conventional twin tires. An oil bath brake completes the whole. The noise of the gearbox rotating at high speed is the main noise source of Cristalis.

[Remundo]

motor Nature specifies HybridAir technology in his new article



Here is the conclusion

So it will not work on the highway, nor hardly even at 90 km / h, but in town, this HybridAir system could prove to be effective, and not only during the homologation tests.

[I Citro]

this HybridAir system could prove to be effective, and not only during certification tests.

They express themselves in the conditional ...

On paper, the storage capacity is so ridiculous that it barely corresponds to the energy required to restart the engine after a stop ...

That's a hell of a lot of money, an exorbitant price, and an unnecessary technological debauchery for a stop & start system ...

It should come as no surprise that the Toyota Yaris hybrid order book is full for several months and if our "national" manufacturers who manufacture abroad see their sales collapse.

[Janic]

the weight of the bottles is only a handicap if they are made of scrap metal, moreover these bottles can be larger, more numerous, with high pressure. But it goes without saying that this is not a system that operates on its own like for batteries.
However, unlike batteries, there are no pollution problems during manufacturing or recycling.

[Remundo]

this HybridAir system could prove to be effective, and not only during certification tests.

They express themselves in the conditional ...

On paper, the storage capacity is so ridiculous that it barely corresponds to the energy required to restart the engine after a stop ...

That's a hell of a lot of money, an exorbitant price, and an unnecessary technological debauchery for a stop & start system ...

It should come as no surprise that the Toyota Yaris hybrid order book is full for several months and if our "national" manufacturers who manufacture abroad see their sales collapse.

There are probably deeper reasons for total sales.

But technologically, this HybridAir seems to me too fear.

[moinsdewatt]

Peugeot rolls its 2008 with Hybrid Air technology

THE WORLD | 03.07.2014

She rolls ! Hybrid Air technology, developed by PSA Peugeot-Citroën, is now almost ready. Wednesday, July 2, the manufacturer had invited a handful of journalists to drive two prototypes of 2008 with this alternative to classic hybrid cars, which combine a heat engine and a battery…

With Hybrid Air, PSA associates a gasoline engine with an energy storage device in the form of compressed air and a hydraulic pump… With each deceleration and braking, an accumulator stores energy before injecting it back into the propulsion system. Verdict, after twenty-five minutes of driving in the heart of a congested Paris, the heat engine was only used 30% to 40% of the time.

FIND A PARTNER

“With this system, we arrive at an approved consumption of 2,9 l per 100 km, or 72 g of CO2. Or 1 km with a full tank in the city, ”says Karim Mokaddem, who has been following this project since its conception in 300. At the Paris Motor Show, the car equipped with Hybrid Air should, thanks to the addition of other technologies , go under 2010 l per 2 km.

However, the group is still not sure whether to industrialize this car. "The economic conditions are still not met," agrees Karim Mokaddem, 46, who again defended the project in late June before the PSA executive committee. “We must find a partner in order to share the costs of industrialization and obtain a reasonable deployment from 2017”
(continuation not available)

http://www.lemonde.fr/economie/article/ ... 3234.html#