Water injection Caravelle VW combi, also called Van-Transporter

Edits and changes to engines, experiences, findings and ideas.
fredlegentil
I discovered econologic
I discovered econologic
posts: 3
Registration: 06/05/05, 23:55

Water injection Caravelle VW combi, also called Van-Transporter




by fredlegentil » 02/02/07, 18:05

Concerning the "Water doping of an old VW Caravelle", by pantone process, reviewed and corrected ... I will try to present my work.

(Other achievements here http://perso.orange.fr/quanthommesuite)

So there will be a little thirty photo, and the text that goes with it, this is my first post here, be indulgent!

Let's go : Arrowd: : Arrowd: : Arrowd: it starts here.


Hello everyone,


I am a mechanical teacher (28 years old, Paris region) and have been learning for a few years about the Pantone process.

This idea of ​​adding water vapor at very high temperature (because in the liquid state, HS engine ...) has existed for many years for particular applications, car competition, motorcycle ... (And even, during the second world war, the German aviation thus enriched its engines in oxygen, if not there were big problems in altitude ...).

This summer 2006, I therefore finally took action on a VW caravel (a 1,9-liter petrol unit), because I had a vehicle on hand which was rather suitable for "retrofitting", with the engine running on it. 'rear, with room ...

What does an old caravel look like?
Image

The "normal" engine
Image

Exhaust just under the engine, practical ...
Image


Context:

So I went to Israel as part of the construction of an orphanage, and on the spot, with a friend *, we took care of equipping his vehicle. (* My friend worked in air conditioning before, he therefore perfectly masters heat transfers, impressive!)

Installation plan
(There are 2 versions: with dip tube and without dip tube)
This is why on the following photos, the heating box will have 3 or 2 orifices, depending on where the realization was ...

First idea:
Image
Here the heating box therefore has 3 holes.

With the previous plan, water came out through the dip tube which was to supply air to the gearbox ... And the system therefore did not work!

Assembly adopted: now, without a dip tube, we do have steam at the reactor outlet, we saw it very clearly.
Image



Technique:
(Mm)

Central rod of the reactor (stretched): diam 20 - long 505 (we did it big)

Tube: inside diameter 21 - outside diameter 23 - length 600

Images related to the reactor:

Preparation: we do with what we have
Image

So we weld together 2 ends of stretched for the central rod
Image

It's finish
Image

Rod assembly in the reactor
Image

Internal game (I know it's fuzzy ...)
Image

For the positioning of the central rod, we did as many, 3 welding points at each end: adjustment of said points with the grinder!

Hold in position: a small hole, then a small self-tapping screw that is penetrated as much as possible, then cut with a razor and welded on the tube
Image

Well, we should take care of the pot now
Image

Jar opening
Image

This is a big hole ...
Image

Presentation of the reactor, it's not so bad
Image

Come on, let's close it all: fitted pot
Image

After all these welds, we approach the famous "bubbler", which (after reflection) we could have done without!
The bubbler was made using the core of an old "Vaporetto" type steam generator.

Again and again recovery ...
Image

Fire test, so gas?
Image

Box preparation
Image

Box connections
Image
Finally, we removed the central pipe (air intake) which created more problems (leaks) than anything else, and it's going very well without ...

With a base for fixing
Image

This bubbler is then installed just above the exhaust, we almost put it in contact, but we don't need to make an explosive pressure cooker in a VW ...

It's ready to be fixed on the VW
Image

It's ready to be connected
Image

Equipped pot ready for assembly
Image

It's all funny plumbing ...
Oh the beautiful collar beaten below. (No, no leaks are needed)
Image

For reheating, the water admitted into the "bubbler" (which is here rather a simple hermetic box withstanding heat well) previously circulates in a very small copper duct which surrounds the exhaust by a few spirals ... heated!

Image

Image


Water is stored and distributed from a windshield washer tank (~ 5 liters). We also thought of an expansion tank ...
Image

We are almost there, we still have to connect all of this to the fuel system.
Image

The assembly therefore comes to an end (disassembly of the upper part of the carburetion), the steam will arrive just above the intake.
Image

Here is roughly the assembly seen from above.
Image

Image


In short, before the consumption of this VW caravel was between 11 and 12 liters (1,9 L petrol engine of displacement, power = 57 kW / 78hp), and here we are between 8 and 10 liters (depending on the load) but in any case the engine responds much better than before and "pushes" the vehicle more powerfully, that is felt quite well when the system is hot.
Idling is not really the same, everything is much more "regular" now, things are going very smoothly.
The interest of such a system is therefore most certainly in the first place at the level of pollution, and by putting your hand behind the exit of the pot, you do not feel a dry, suffocating and stale air, but rather a kind of gas hot and almost humid, which is much less unpleasant than before! (In any case, it smells less of unburnt gases)


So that's all I can say today. If I have to redo or advise someone for water doping, here in France, I have other ideas in mind to simplify the problem!


Hello.

Fred
Last edited by fredlegentil the 15 / 02 / 07, 11: 39, 4 edited once.
0 x
User avatar
lio74
Éconologue good!
Éconologue good!
posts: 333
Registration: 15/03/06, 23:16
Location: Haute-Vienne and SAVOY

Re: Doping water Caravelle VW, also called combi-Van-Transpo




by lio74 » 02/02/07, 19:16

fredlegentil wrote:So there will be a little thirty photo, and the text that goes with it, this is my first post here, be indulgent!

Let's go : Arrowd: : Arrowd: : Arrowd:


let's go ... where I don't know ... you forgot to put the link rrrr :x

to be corrected quickly ... I want to see that : Lol: : Wink:

@ ++
0 x
"To do something is expensive, to do nothing will cost much more." Koffie Annan
next species endangered: Man ... and it will be good for him !!!
MAN IS A VERY DANGEROUS POLLUTION NATURAL!
User avatar
PITMIX
Pantone engine Researcher
Pantone engine Researcher
posts: 2028
Registration: 17/09/05, 10:29
x 17




by PITMIX » 02/02/07, 22:42

Hi fred
Okay, you're my neighbor, we're going to have to meet.
On the one hand to share with you my experience (if we can call it that,), and on the other hand so that you teach me things.
"The crazier we are, the less rice there is" Oh no, that's Coluche : Cheesy: .
"The more we are crazy, the more we laugh"

NB: small suggestion, your photos are a bit too big, you need a 42 "" screen : Lol:
0 x
User avatar
lio74
Éconologue good!
Éconologue good!
posts: 333
Registration: 15/03/06, 23:16
Location: Haute-Vienne and SAVOY




by lio74 » 03/02/07, 16:27

PITMIX wrote:NB: small suggestion, your photos are a bit too big, you need a 42 "" screen : Lol:


: Lol: yeah! it made a smile to read the end of the line ... but the photos are there !!!

thank you Fred!
I have a friend who has a combi ... it's a little jewel for him ... and he doesn't want to touch the engine ... with these photos I hope it will convince him a little ...

@+
0 x
"To do something is expensive, to do nothing will cost much more." Koffie Annan

next species endangered: Man ... and it will be good for him !!!

MAN IS A VERY DANGEROUS POLLUTION NATURAL!
denis
Grand Econologue
Grand Econologue
posts: 944
Registration: 15/12/05, 17:26
Location: rhone alps
x 2




by denis » 03/02/07, 17:46

hi, well done! Are your consumables really reliable? because the result was the first blow: + bravo!
the system is hot enough after how many km?
the pot is heating enough ??? (far from the valve outlet)
on my deuch I arrive at 8l5, I won, but I can do better, I just lowered the constant levels of the gv, it swallowed 1.5l / 100 of water : Shock: is too much, restarting was difficult, especially by removing the oil breather from the circuit.
it's nice to see a new car in doped service :D
0 x
White would not exist without the dark, but anyway!


http://maison-en-paille.blogspot.fr/
User avatar
PITMIX
Pantone engine Researcher
Pantone engine Researcher
posts: 2028
Registration: 17/09/05, 10:29
x 17




by PITMIX » 03/02/07, 18:30

So what you did is a bit the idea I gave in my last private message.
You make the water boil in the copper tube, you send this water naturally into the bubbler and the steam which emerges is sucked by the reactor.
Can you give us a diagram. Your system interests me a lot.
I have the impression that it is the quantity of vapor which is the main difference compared to all the assemblies that I made.
0 x
denis
Grand Econologue
Grand Econologue
posts: 944
Registration: 15/12/05, 17:26
Location: rhone alps
x 2




by denis » 03/02/07, 18:39

hi pit, on my mounting I regret not having put a valve, to measure the amount of steam, compared to the outside air.
0 x
White would not exist without the dark, but anyway!





http://maison-en-paille.blogspot.fr/
denis
Grand Econologue
Grand Econologue
posts: 944
Registration: 15/12/05, 17:26
Location: rhone alps
x 2




by denis » 03/02/07, 18:44

ww, I'm interested because the air system looks like the deuch

the gas is injected before the air filter, right?
is there enough suction?
0 x
White would not exist without the dark, but anyway!





http://maison-en-paille.blogspot.fr/
User avatar
PITMIX
Pantone engine Researcher
Pantone engine Researcher
posts: 2028
Registration: 17/09/05, 10:29
x 17




by PITMIX » 03/02/07, 18:52

Yes it is true that there should not be too much steam either because when there is too much it recondenses and that causes carburetion problems.
I had this problem there was not too much steam but too much condensation, it's not great.
The good thing I think about Fred's VW is that the vapor produced by the coil is somehow relaxed in the bubbler, so I guess this is where it condenses a max. The air drawn in by the reactor is charged with vapor but remains relatively dry.
Finally all this is only supposition it would take a scheme to capture it well.
I'm pretty sure that all of the fixtures I tried didn't produce enough steam. The blow of the coil I already tried but to directly feed the reactor.
0 x
Other
Pantone engine Researcher
Pantone engine Researcher
posts: 3787
Registration: 17/03/05, 02:35
x 12




by Other » 03/02/07, 18:58

Hello,
Welcome to the pantoneux
mounting well described in image, (the bosch alternator was recently changed)
Several questions would be interesting to describe on the forum
the entry above the carburetor how is it done exactly to maintain a vacuum that sucks through the bubbler?

The reactor is simply placed in the exhaust or it is surrounded by a narrow duct before the expansion of the exhaust gases.
Does the bubbler have an air inlet? the level should not be high, because the vacuum with carburetor input is complicated on a merchant gasoline engine at low speed (idle)
Approximately water consumption?
I did not understand how the bubbler is heated.
Have you noticed your oil and candles, how it stays clean!

As it is rare to see water doping assemblies on petrol engine, on this forum we will be able to talk about the problems is improvements

Andre
0 x

 


  • Similar topics
    Replies
    views
    Last message

Back to "Water injection in the engines: the assembly and experimentation"

Who is online ?

Users browsing this forum : No registered users and 149 guests