The energy transition law or the cart before the horse.

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Janic
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by Janic » 23/04/18, 20:53

The idea of ​​Salvation still constitutes a sacred (sic!) Metaphysical carrot ...

A religious carrot, not metaphysical whatever the two seem confused by who ignores it.
This concept has also found its translation in materialism which is more spiritual than it seems (although of a very mediocre spirituality). Salvation now goes through the abstract accumulation of value, via the transitional period of Protestantism, during which eschatological salvation and terrestrial salvation experienced an unexpected and complex cohabitation.

Except, there again that these notions of salvation have been manipulated by these religious systems to ensure adherence to their discourse. It would take a bit long to define what the meaning of salvation really means in biblical discourse, but over the centuries the meaning has been deviated from it. But grossomodo this term is equivalent to the meaning of health when a seriously ill individual returns to a normal state and for which he is said to be saved. However the doctor intervenes only for little thing, this return to health dependent on the internal forces favorable to the recovery when an external intervention does not come to screw up the mess! hence these contradictory notions of "salvation" by works or without works (generally misunderstood and interpreted!)
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by Ahmed » 24/04/18, 13:26

A religious carrot, not metaphysical, although the two seem confused by who ignores it.

I'm ignorant, educate me ... :?
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by Janic » 24/04/18, 18:28

I'm ignorant, educate me ...
Well it's funny, Sen no sen did the same at some point! I replied that the answer was to be found in the in-depth study of the subject and not in a simple superficial reading and even less in the cultures that have succeeded over the centuries.
So, I do not intervene to dogmatize, but only to remind that one should not confuse between a creative principle and the cultures and traditions which will seize it, not always for a true spiritual dimension, but more frequently by caste interest and it is this latter situation which is most frequently retained unfortunately.

By automobile comparison again! What is retained by some (like SEN NO SEN) is the observation that a vehicle bought new and even guaranteed for hidden defects (representing the ideal as an automobile), has become a heap of scrap after having been used for many years (2000 years since the beginning of "Christianity" and as many more for Judaism and less for the young trio that is Islam) with the inevitable degradation that accompanies it: perforating rust, kneecaps taking play, clutch slipping, worn liner and piston, etc ... and make it become the new benchmark when the two are not comparable or reconcilable.
The reformers attempted a start to backtrack, with multiple reparations, their " writing, all writing, nothing but writing"never realized, Islam tried it too, with so few results, because one does not make new with old, even if tinkering is better than letting the object deteriorate.
And I know what I'm talking about since I've been patching up my scrap heaps for decades! : Cheesy: : Cheesy:

My apologies for accentuating the deviation from the original subject! : Oops:
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by Ahmed » 24/04/18, 21:44

I fully understand your answer, but my question was more specific: how could Salvation of the Soul not be of a metaphysical nature? That the promise of Salvation in exchange for this or that advantage for the benefit of any caste exists, I am well aware of it, this does not however remove the metaphysical nature of this concept (and it is all the more practical for those who play it!).
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by moinsdewatt » 24/04/18, 21:44

[Energy] The first (good) surprises of the public debate on PEP, according to Jacques Archimbaud

Aurélie Barbaux Factory New the 23 / 04 / 2018

One month after the launch of the public debate on the multiannual energy programming (PPE), which must extend until June 28, Jacques Archimbaud, the chairman of the special committee, does not hide his surprises.

"It is going well, or even better than what many predicted. The debates are not polarized on the subjects which annoy. The assemblies are not stormy", tells Jacques Archimbaud, president of the particular committee of the public debate PPE of the National Commission for Public Debate (CNDP). Clearly, during the first ten public meetings that have already been held in France since March 19, the pro and anti-nuclear did not come to confiscate the debate and to lose themselves in public. The subject was however well approached "in particular in Grenoble and Graveline", but the rest of the time "they are not there", summarizes the conductor of the debate.

Nuclear remains discreet.

This is his first, and good, surprise. It is not the only one. According to him, all the questions are on the table and the audience is numerous, "without empty room" until then. "And there is interest in the subjects," observed Jacques Archimbaud. Or even more than interest. The French who took part in the first debates would show a fairly great maturity on energy transition issues. "Of course there are people who are skeptical" about the effect of debates on political decision-making, but those who come want "something wise to come out".

Given the number of subjects to be tackled, the debates each cover a thematic: methanation in Angers, financing local initiatives in Besançon… And to avoid overly technical discussions, CNDP teams encourage participants to define the messages that 'They want to see it carried at the national level, just like the priority level of the subjects. By not disputing any controversy.

Great awareness of the issues

Contrary to what one might have feared, the debates do not all revolve around the electricity mix, even if electricity remains a central subject in defining how we must decarbonise the French energy mix. Even before the publication of the Court of Auditors' report on aid for renewable energies, "the question of the imbalance in thermal and electrical energies had already been raised and debated", remarks the chairman of the special committee for the PPE debate.

Another good surprise, the participants seem to have understood "that it is necessary to start from the questions of consumption, of what our fellow citizens want, to then ask the question of the production", and not the reverse, welcomes Jacques Archimbaud. For example, it seems clear that the French do not want to get out of nuclear power, but are in favor of reducing it in order to regain freedom of choice. There would even be "a sort of popular wisdom" in favor of a balanced mix.

The carbon tax and governance poorly understood

The chairman of the special commission also admits to being surprised at the "seriousness, the seriousness in the way participants ask the questions". And it is already drawing two lessons for policy makers. The first concerns the carbon tax: "The red light is on on tax issues. The increase in the carbon tax voted by the Assembly does not pass." Jacques Archimbaud notes a weariness vis-à-vis the fiscal pressure, which increases the price of the fuel tank.

The second subject of alert concerns the vagueness in the governance of national energy policy. The dissonant speeches between RTE and EDF, between EDF and Minister Nicolas Hulot, relations between State and territories on these subjects… "There is a lack of understanding on who decides", notes Jacques Archimbaud. To the best of my mind!

https://www.usinenouvelle.com/article/l ... pe.N683584
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Janic
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by Janic » 25/04/18, 09:44

once again sorry that there is no specific subject on metaphysics, hence these dotted interventions. but I still answer the question.
I fully understand your answer, but my question was more specific: how could Salvation of the Soul not be of a metaphysical nature? That the promise of Salvation in exchange for this or that advantage for the benefit of any caste exists, I am well aware of it, this does not however remove the metaphysical nature of this concept (and it is all the more practical for those who play it!).

It's a little clearer! But the subject is delicate, very delicate even and requires to advance on tiptoe so much the points of view on what can be the soul already, that in which it can be the object of some salvation (the who, where, when, how, why that is part of the possible answer), and which has been debated since the origin of the concept.
The reference book for our Judeo-Christian, and Islamic culture in addition: the bible, already brings many nuances, very distinct, on this famous soul and what it may or may not be… that's the question : Cheesy: ! and there is something to get lost in, so simplifying the concept to provide an answer, a semblance of an answer, is an exercise in high theological aerobatics.
I then express this extreme simplification by a parable, an automotive mechanical analogy always (because almost everyone has one with the advantages and disadvantages that it brings, but a mixer or a television would also do the trick.)
So we have on my right a pile of scrap called auto-mobile (which does not move) on my left a driver (who for the moment does not drive anything) and in the center (nothing for the moment).
The driver then settles down behind the wheel, heaps of scrap metal, presses a button and this is this heap of scrap metal which, starts purring like a kitten, or like a baby who has just been born, to live (assuming that it only lives from this moment when it begins to breathe) by sucking in air and sucking on the breast of its fuel tank. This pretty little cabbage is nothing else for now than a heap of junk becoming a racing car or a cart, to start moving, to move according to his desire to travel the world, to roar , honking, accelerating, braking, paying for a plane tree or a precipice too, that's life! And that brings us back to what the soul can be, that is to say any object acquiring its personality, its status of being, unique, which is not only to be animated (therefore to be an animal), but let this animation forge a unique entity: the me! But, and this is where it gets thicker, when the driver cuts the contact that becomes this personality? Does it survive in the limbo of the automobile of any breakage before being recast? Is there a paradise or a hell for these heaps of junk? Can they be saved? Back on the road for new adventures? Will the soul of this car be reincarnated in another object? It is a question of faith, of belief in this possibility which depends only on its designer who will have foreseen it or not from its creation, physical as metaphysical.
For those who have done a little bit of theology, the car is only an object, a product having no life in itself, even with a high potential to have it, the driver is the spirit called of god which makes live or die, the soul it is the result of two aspects so different in their Being, precisely, and which thus gives existence to the soul of the Being or more simply to the fact of being .
Where is metaphysics in all of this? Everywhere and nowhere at the same time because everything depends on the experience that everyone has. The atheistic rationalist thinks, or rather believes, in the definitive end of being at his carnal death: " dust you are, dust you will become again And this is not materially false. The believer hopes that beyond the appearances of total annihilation that represents the degradation of the matter of which we are composed, there is possibility of survival of the Being, beyond this same matter and which we find in the concept of reincarnation in the East (resurrection in the West) and therefore that the individual can be saved from this total annihilation, by firmly believing in metaphysical recycling. It's all a question of faith! In other words, what God has built, he can destroy and what he has destroyed he can reconstruct by a kind of metaphysical recycling, death being only a concept which cannot be limited to one appearance. (it's a bit like the meaning of quantum physics it seems to me!)
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by Ahmed » 25/04/18, 10:51

I understand that well, but my question did not suppose to know beforehand if the word "soul" had a reality, nor its salvation: there is unanimity on their existence as a concept; as such, it seems fairly obvious to me to deduce that the salvation of the soul constitutes a "carrot" whose nature can only relate to metaphysics, which you seem to dispute.
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by Janic » 25/04/18, 13:21

I hear that well, but my question did not suppose to know beforehand if the word "soul" had a reality, nor its salvation:
Your idea becomes clearer!
there is unanimity on their existence as a concept;
Unanimity of whom: religions? this is not the case for all! Believers of certain religions, the most widespread of which in our regions is Catholicism, for example? Most likely, but since I hardly know this one, if at all, I cannot give an "enlightened" opinion and here again what meaning does each one give to this term?
as such, it seems fairly obvious to me to deduce that the salvation of the soul constitutes a "carrot" whose nature can only relate to metaphysics, which you seem to dispute.
I remind you, once again, that I am ONLY a biblist, not religious, and therefore without competence with regard to dogma and doctrines discourses of the various religions. This clarified:
Within the framework of these religions in question, historically and for our regions, this was a heavy argument and was even sold, minted, with indulgences, hence the conflict between Protestantism preaching that salvation was free and given by " thanks ”and not by a juicy business. (This is the old end-of-life car that costs a lot in repairs). But it is not metaphysics, it is the exploitation of the gullibility of uncultivated populations who were led by the nose, wedged between the terror of an eternal hell (the stick) and paradise (the carrot). It is and I repeat myself maybe? (yes I repeat myself well! :D ), the same discourse as that of the medical scientist religion held vis-à-vis the vaccine myth that manipulates crowds with the terror of falling into the hell of disease, devoured by nasty viruses, bacteria and microbes of all kinds and the salvation of the bodies which is ensured by the miraculous vaccine, kind host, which is going (from hard cash and stumbling too) to bring them this long-awaited salvation, this paradise of health in question. (nothing metaphysical here either!) It's always the old stuff that works best!
And the crowds, all as gullible and ignorant as before, end up, after a constant rehashing by interposed media [*] (the new chairs replacing that of the churches) by believing it! " Nothing new under the sun Said King Solomon.

PS: the words salut, comme dieu, which are common names in French language and grammar, did not need to be written with a capital letter.
[*] it is the week of vaccination (ridiculous concept since it has become compulsory in defiance of freedom of conscience) which will harp on its mantra on all the chains under orders.
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by Ahmed » 25/04/18, 19:07

There is unanimity on the concept of salvation, as is the case with that of the unicorn; afterwards, the content that everyone relates to it is actually subject to variations.
The metaphysical aspect does not imply a particular knowledge of religion since it is a simple question of definition: whatever the possible instrumentalizations or interpretations of which it can be the object, the salvation of the soul cannot raise that of the metaphysical domain ...
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Re: The Energy Transition Law or the cart before the horse.




by moinsdewatt » 25/04/18, 19:44

Janic pisses off posting messages about religion in a thread on the energy transition. : Evil:

We beat the believers of liquid nitrogen, we also have to hit the religious believers.
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