The hydrogen house

[BaudouinLabrique]

Well seen, on the other hand I wonder if the batteries would not be more "profitable" than the hydrogen. Let us assume a daily use with equal power of "restitution" between the two systems:
Battery life: 10ene years before the membrane shows signs of weakness.
Lifepo4 battery: 3000 to 5000 cycles (also about 10 years also)

The huge problem is the poor durability of the batteries: a few days at most.

From November to March, the photovoltaic production is insufficient to cover the needs (even if it is only a domestic use without heating, which is not my case, since I have a geothermal heat pump which consumes between 35 and 65 kWh during this period).
Reminder: currently, in French-speaking Belgium we are not yet faced with the problem of battery since it is the network which does it and at no cost. In my case, given the end of this system (even if it is an act of legal retroactivity prohibited - appeals will be brought as currently seen other decisions of this type on the part of the public authorities)

However I think that the investment for hydrogen is much more consequent for a lower return. After the advantage is that once all the stuff, only the battery represents an element of wear; where the batteries would be HS and require a change of the assembly.

Well seen !

[xboxman4]

I understand your situation better.

In my case, electricity is not my big source of expenses, on the contrary: I have low-energy household appliances (PAC dryer, low-consumption washing machine, ditto the fridge and a pleolite dishwasher), all the LED lighting, gas heating and there are only two of us at home.
Good me it is more the heating which interests me and the hydrogen could be useful for this purpose: storage of H2 in summer, burning it in winter with a small modified gas stove. So of course I do not think that this is enough for continuous heating, but only on very cold days (like lately) to relieve the boiler.

I looked at Leroy Merlin: a 1kw stove consumes 110g / h of butane. I would have to compare the power delivered by hydrogen + the capacity of a compressed bottle at 200 bar to estimate what I need based on my consumption.

[PVresistif]

I pointed out that hydrogen would a priori be the "worst fuel" in terms of NOx, which is the main pollutant as everyone does not seem to know (see the Volkswagen scandal, and other manufacturers who in some countries - but not in France well sur - will pay billions for cheating on NOx). Indeed the H2 burning at high temperature, it makes a lot of NOx (but no CO2 of course since it contains no carbon).
It's not to burn oil, coal or gas that produces CO2 in the atmosphere but the fact of reject the products of combustion in the atmosphere ; it is simple, it is enough to prohibit it - in the medium term - and to capture the CO2 to reject it in the ground (from where comes from Carbon)
We must still wait for the results of research from advanced countries (India, China, Germany, which are investing massively in this area in order to be able to burn without pollution all the oil and gas still available for thousands of years? Or more)
there would be no more bp ......... except if of course: what to do with the nucleocrats?
I remind you that France is one of the worst countries in terms of the environment: 80% of diesel vehicles and 80% of nuclear electricity, so why not switch to H2 and in 50 years we will ban it in town for bp of NOX ..... well known today !!!!!!
Note: despite all the taxes on oil and gasoline in France, none of these taxes are used to finance research against pollution, but the "rich" countries do it because they know that nuclear power is a dead end and they do thermal insulation too.
note: burning H2 in pure oxygen would be ideal (zero NOx), if I decide that day, we will have to invest in Air Liquide ....
cordially

[BaudouinLabrique]

I looked at Leroy Merlin: a 1kw stove consumes 110g / h of butane. I would have to compare the power delivered by hydrogen + the capacity of a compressed bottle at 200 bar to estimate what I need based on my consumption.

You should know that a bobonne of 200 bar as reproduced and evaluated here contains approximately 1,21 kgH² and corresponds to approximately 40 kWh.
NB H² can mix with gas (and this is one of the ways to store it in a network)

[BaudouinLabrique]

I pointed out that hydrogen would a priori be the "worst fuel" in terms of NOx, which is the main pollutant as everyone does not seem to know (see the Volkswagen scandal, and other manufacturers who in some countries - but not in France well on - will pay billions to have cheated on NOx). Indeed the H2 burning at high temperature, it makes a lot of NOx (but no CO2 of course since it contains no carbon). (...)

PVresistive, "NOx undoubtedly come from the action of dinitrogen on the oxygen of the air, this reaction occurs weakly at high temperature (in the gasoline engine as in the hydrogen engine). It will probably not not in a hydrogen fuel cell that doesn't work at a very high temperature ”
Indeed, the fuel cell that I selected works at low temperature (80 °): it is of the PEM type. Other types of batteries that work at a much higher temperature produce NOX (nitrogen oxide) (Futura Sciences)

[BaudouinLabrique]

I pointed out that hydrogen would a priori be the "worst fuel" in terms of NOx, which is the main pollutant as everyone does not seem to know (see the Volkswagen scandal, and other manufacturers who in some countries - but not in France well on - will pay billions to have cheated on NOx). Indeed the H2 burning at high temperature, it makes a lot of NOx (but no CO2 of course since it contains no carbon). (...)

PVresistive, " NOx probably comes from the action of nitrogen on the oxygen in the air, this reaction occurs weakly at high temperature (in the gasoline engine as in the hydrogen engine). It will probably not take place in a hydrogen cell that does not work at a very high temperature »
Indeed, the fuel cell that I selected (Solenco Power Box) and for this reason (no pollution) works at low temperature (80 °): it is of the PEM type. The other types of batteries which work at much higher temperature indeed produce NOX (Nitrogen Oxide) (Futura Sciences)

Solenco Power Box documentation
"What makes hydrogen the perfect alternative for fossil fuels
Hydrogen clearly has many advantages over fossil fuels. But even when compared to electric vehicles, hydrogen comes out superior in most aspects.
To start with, 'the only exhaust of a hydrogen car is water, either as water vapor ordroplets, so you have no CO2, no NOx, no particles,'as quoted by Robin Hayles, manager of sustainable fuel development at Hyundai.
Fuel cells operate like batteries tocreate electricity through routing reaction, there is no combustion, and therefore no emissions."

[xboxman4]

I looked at Leroy Merlin: a 1kw stove consumes 110g / h of butane. I would have to compare the power delivered by hydrogen + the capacity of a compressed bottle at 200 bar to estimate what I need based on my consumption.

You should know that a bobonne of 200 bar as reproduced and evaluated here contains approximately 1,21 kgH² and corresponds to approximately 40 kWh.
NB H² can mix with gas (and this is one of the ways to store it in a network)

What type of bottle too?
Here is the info I have for H2:
b10 1,8 m3 - 10 l 200 bar
B20 3,6 m3 - 20 l 200 bar
B50 8,9 m3 - 50 l 200 bar

Knowing that b20 and 50 not available for sale (at least in France), that rental.

[xboxman4]

I pointed out that hydrogen would a priori be the "worst fuel" in terms of NOx, which is the main pollutant as everyone does not seem to know (see the Volkswagen scandal, and other manufacturers who in some countries - but not in France well sur - will pay billions for cheating on NOx). Indeed the H2 burning at high temperature, it makes a lot of NOx (but no CO2 of course since it contains no carbon).
It's not to burn oil, coal or gas that produces CO2 in the atmosphere but the fact of reject the products of combustion in the atmosphere ; it is simple, it is enough to prohibit it - in the medium term - and to capture the CO2 to reject it in the ground (from where comes from Carbon)
We must still wait for the results of research from advanced countries (India, China, Germany, which are investing massively in this area in order to be able to burn without pollution all the oil and gas still available for thousands of years? Or more)
there would be no more bp ......... except if of course: what to do with the nucleocrats?
I remind you that France is one of the worst countries in terms of the environment: 80% of diesel vehicles and 80% of nuclear electricity, so why not switch to H2 and in 50 years we will ban it in town for bp of NOX ..... well known today !!!!!!
Note: despite all the taxes on oil and gasoline in France, none of these taxes are used to finance research against pollution, but the "rich" countries do it because they know that nuclear power is a dead end and they do thermal insulation too.
note: burning H2 in pure oxygen would be ideal (zero NOx), if I decide that day, we will have to invest in Air Liquide ....
cordially

Like all combustion in the end: biomass via stoves too, yet we value wood for heating for its "green" aspect.

In the end, the only solution for the future to avoid any atmospheric chemical pollution in this case is:
For electricity, storage in new types of more efficient and easily recyclable battery (graphene, ultracapacitor ...)
For heating: positive energy house + solar heating and additional electricity.

[BaudouinLabrique]

I looked at Leroy Merlin: a 1kw stove consumes 110g / h of butane. I would have to compare the power delivered by hydrogen + the capacity of a compressed bottle at 200 bar to estimate what I need based on my consumption.

You should know that a bobonne of 200 bar as reproduced and evaluated here contains approximately 1,21 kgH² and corresponds to approximately 40 kWh.
NB H² can mix with gas (and this is one of the ways to store it in a network)

What type of bottle too?
Here is the info I have for H2:
b10 1,8 m3 - 10 l 200 bar
B20 3,6 m3 - 20 l 200 bar
B50 8,9 m3 - 50 l 200 bar

Knowing that b20 and 50 not available for sale (at least in France), that rental.

I have no details other than what is calculated from the transmitted photo, the set of twelve bobonnes has only 0,9m² of capacity and therefore 75 liters of capacity per bobonne.
On the other hand, under 200 bars it therefore makes it possible to store 1,21 kg H³ and therefore 15m³ of Nm³H

[sicetaitsimple]

I pointed out that hydrogen would a priori be the "worst fuel" in terms of NOx, which is the main pollutant as everyone does not seem to know (see the Volkswagen scandal, and other manufacturers who in some countries - but not in France well sur - will pay billions for cheating on NOx). Indeed the H2 burning at high temperature, it makes a lot of NOx (but no CO2 of course since it contains no carbon).

It is obvious that the future of hydrogen from electrolysis is linked to the development and lower costs of fuel cells. These do not produce NOx (but this is not the reason that pushes them).

Otherwise, it will at best remain a substitute for reforming hydrogen in its industrial uses (petrochemicals, etc.), which would already be good, or a make-up gas for injection into natural gas networks, in limited quantities (today maximum 5% in volume, or about 2% in energy).