Isolate vertical walls with an air gap and lathing?

Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ... short thermal comfort. Insulation, wood energy, heat pumps but also electricity, gas or oil, VMC ... Help in choosing and implementation, problem solving, optimization, tips and tricks ...
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 74046
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8735

Isolate vertical walls with an air gap and lathing?




by Christophe » 17/12/09, 14:59

It's me again about cheap and efficient insulation for improvement (cf. free-insulation-of-attic-lost-t8938.html for 1ere method)! Well it's the climate that must want this right now (-4 ° C warmer today : Cheesy: )!

So here starting on the same principle of isolating with emprisoné air based on this diagram:

Image

If I read between 30 and 40 mm of a vertical air space, it has a thermal conductivity of 5.5 / 5.6, 5.6 take which gives a global R 0.18 ... not great!

But if we suppress radiation (movie reflector) and that limits the convection well hey you fall for about 1 30 40 in mm (well, we find the equivalent R Styrodur type extruded PES 40 mm c ... is not a coincidence!)

So here is the idea: to double the walls with an air space of 30 to 40 mm (more or less waterproof but more waterproof is better) and this thanks to a simple "cladding" (the more compartments the better. 'is thermally) and a thermoreflective film simply attached to the cladding.

Here is the schematic diagram:

Image

The "aluminum" face will obviously be against the wall. The heated room being on the right in the diagram. And this technique would only work with "interior" walls between a heated room and an unheated one.

Character I really want to test (I have all the gear) unless there are indications against?

At the price levels: a film to 3 5 mm PE with aluminum costs between 1.5 and 2 € / m² lathing is proces of nine pallets, say 1 € / m²?

It remains econological ... if it works thermally course!

Edit: read this technical study https://www.econologie.com/etude-techni ... ts-minces/ for theory and practical tests on thin insulators.

These are only "effective" with one or 2 air knives!
Last edited by Christophe the 16 / 10 / 12, 11: 59, 5 edited once.
1 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping

User avatar
elephant
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 6646
Registration: 28/07/06, 21:25
Location: Charleroi, center of the world ....
x 6




by elephant » 17/12/09, 15:16

I am a little skeptical: how are you testing?
0 x
elephant Supreme Honorary éconologue PCQ ..... I'm too cautious, not rich enough and too lazy to really save the CO2! http://www.caroloo.be
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 74046
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8735




by Christophe » 17/12/09, 15:26

Ben too good but I think AC can only improve things ...

A few days ago, you were nevertheless pro "reflector sheet" on this subject: https://www.econologie.com/forums/isolation- ... t8870.html

I am wrong?

I think I'll test by then on the right wall and the bottom: Image

On the other side, there is the living room, so ca be quickly feel if there is an effect ... then I have my laser gun which goes as: https://www.econologie.com/shop/thermome ... p-132.html

In fact I can test within minutes without 2 lathing simply by applying the heat reflection movie directly on the wall.
0 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping
Alain G
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 3044
Registration: 03/10/08, 04:24
x 3




by Alain G » 17/12/09, 15:49

Hi Christopher!

Here the standard is this:

The aluminum film is against the wall behind the lath and the shiny side is the inner side to reflect heat inward.

Small precision that has some importance because much research has been done here in Canada saw the much cooler climate ..

:D
0 x
Stepping behind sometimes can strengthen friendship.
Criticism is good if added to some compliments.
Alain
aerialcastor
Grand Econologue
Grand Econologue
posts: 865
Registration: 10/05/09, 16:39
x 21




by aerialcastor » 17/12/09, 15:52

Before wasting your time, I advise you to read this.
http://www.cstc.be/homepage/download.cfm?dtype=publ&doc=CSTC_Rapport_9.pdf&lang=fr

Who will answer your questions numbers.
Including the performance of an air gap depends a lot on the emissivity of the surface trap that blade.
How is measured lambda of materials ...
0 x

Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 74046
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8735




by Christophe » 17/12/09, 15:52

Yes I wanted to put the aluminum side "hot" side ...

Castor thank you I'll watch ca, ca should also answer this other question: heating-insulation/calculation-of-the-real-thermal-resistance-of-insulation-place-t8970.html
0 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping
Obamot
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 26335
Registration: 22/08/09, 22:38
Location: regio genevesis
x 4820




by Obamot » 17/12/09, 17:53

... It reminds me of another thread or I say this:

heating-insulation/free-insulation-of-attic-lost-t8938.html

4) the plastic films can be stretched between joists and glued with double-sided tape intended for gluing the vapor barriers on the roof (or better, with tar ...). Once a first film has been placed, fix the joists on top of it again, the first then stretch a second plastic film again. Thus, the insulation will be formed by the air held captive between the two films. ... Mébon it will not breathe in this area ... Or you have to develop the idea with an air circulation from one "caisson to another", for example by drilling holes in the joists so that the air circulates in a kind of circuit (and put at the end a kind of exchanger with filter ... one more thing to calculate ...)


Basically with your drawing, you catch my idea ( : Mrgreen: ) And less well as you continue in your logic "air blade...." According to it, the double windows are also designed on the same principle then? ...

:|
Last edited by Obamot the 17 / 12 / 09, 18: 00, 1 edited once.
0 x
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 74046
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8735




by Christophe » 17/12/09, 18:00

I know you've talked about air space but in fact I had hoped that you do not see this in fact ... (you begin to inflate us grve there) ...

And for your "info" YOUR idea has been known for a while:

Image

And this pattern, resulting from the .pdf quoted above confirms my idea that ca ... can walk to see ... thicknesses and performance / cost of a traditional solution ...
0 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping
Obamot
Econologue expert
Econologue expert
posts: 26335
Registration: 22/08/09, 22:38
Location: regio genevesis
x 4820




by Obamot » 17/12/09, 18:05

: Shock: Let me tell you, with all due respect to the administrator of a forum. That this is very serious:

Christophe wrote:I know you've talked about air space but in fact I had hoped that you do not see this in fact ...


It's called intellectual dishonesty. : Frown: ... Politely said
0 x
Christophe
Moderator
Moderator
posts: 74046
Registration: 10/02/03, 14:06
Location: Greenhouse planet
x 8735




by Christophe » 17/12/09, 18:11

No it's the franchise.

Is completely're stupid or you do it on purpose?

You're a twisted and many people here are beginning to see and be fed up by your words (ca is the politeness) ...

So good advice: you should take a vacation in relation to this forum... be careful what you are going to answer as this could be your last answer for a moment ... : Frown:
0 x
Do a image search or an text search - Netiquette of forum - Support the forum doing Useful shopping


 


  • Similar topics
    Replies
    views
    Last message

Back to "Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ..."

Who is online ?

Users browsing this forum : No registered users and 278 guests