Isolate vertical walls with an air gap and lathing?

Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ... short thermal comfort. Insulation, wood energy, heat pumps but also electricity, gas or oil, VMC ... Help in choosing and implementation, problem solving, optimization, tips and tricks ...
Alain G
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by Alain G » 18/12/09, 13:39

Here's how our exterior walls are made:
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by bham » 18/12/09, 15:25

To take over Alain's site and confirm your study Christophe
http://www.maisonsbonneville.com/FR/construction.htm

The exterior walls of our houses are constructed with 2 "x 6" covered, on their exterior faces, with high performance tar fiberboard (Tentex) panels and a Tyvek coating. Tyvek is a non-perforated material that prevents air and water from entering the interior of the home, while allowing water vapor to escape. Also, because it is non-perforated, Tyvek acts as a barrier for pollutants and pollen. Once these operations are completed, our homes fully comply with the National Building Code of Canada. We then affix oblique wooden slats that will allow us to create a first air chamber. In general, construction contractors do not install this type of slats. At Les industries Bonneville, we install them to prepare our homes for transport. Thus, they are provided with two air chambers, which makes them much more effective in terms of insulation.
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by Christophe » 18/12/09, 16:01

quovadis wrote:confusion. It all depends on what is called "air gap". An air space cannot be an enclosed space, by definition, right? Otherwise it becomes a pocket of air trapped between two films (well that's how I understood the trick). But that's just my opinion and frankly it didn't really make you want to read the link.


Precisely in the doc it gives the definition of the air gap (there are 3 types) ...

What makes you want to read?

Thank you Alain for your diagram, so how do you have cardboard and paper houses in Quebec? : Cheesy: We do not see there is an air gap between the aluminum and the cellulose?
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by Alain G » 18/12/09, 17:01

Hi Christopher!

Thank you Alain for your diagram, so how do you have cardboard and paper houses in Quebec?


Uh! Yes!

It's the latest hay bale! LOL! : Cheesy:

Bahm

In the text of Maison Bonneville it is written:
In general, construction contractors do not install this type of slats.


It is only misleading advertising because all the manufacturers manufacture in this way.
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more losses with vacuum and super insulation




by dedeleco » 15/02/10, 16:01

Canadians with their winter are a step ahead of us.
The ideal is to replace the air gap with a high vacuum, because then, with the super-insulation of a dewar under vacuum and 1 to 2 cm of this insulation with vacuum and super-insulation (reflective aluminum sheets), the heat losses are reduced to almost zero.
Thus, no need for heating with 1 or 2cm of insulation !!
Instead of walls, there would be quasi double glazing with aluminized sheets and the total vacuum and no more heat losses.
The vacuum would be checked and pumped once a year with a getter or degassing gas traps.
Done in series, the price could be that of double glazing ???
You can put stainless steel plates as in boats carrying liquefied gas, where the insulation is maximum in huge rooms.
It is not sure that the prices, if well adapted, are so astronomical as that?
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by Jacob127 » 28/02/10, 00:35

Hi,

Too much air thickness creates a convective cell. This technique is only useful if the air is stagnant (i.e. around 5 mm -> double glazing). You cannot stack the air knives without inserting walls, without creating a cell. So we make materials mainly composed of air, and blades small enough for the material to hold together and be "stackable at will" -> these are all expanded foams, hemp wool ... (okay, the air "blades" are very small to the point of making cavities. But no one knows how to do otherwise)

Transforming a house into an empty bell risks being quite costly, yes ^^ It is the builders who set the prices, and in view of human inertia for change ...
Metal walls, waterproofing, vacuuming, periodic checks ... will always exceed the cost of wood or brick.

The BBRI announces a thermal resistance of 1,3m².K / W for 40mm (two blades of 20mm), while an identical thickness of an insulator inflated with air (conductivity 0,02W / m².K) offers resistance th of 2m².K / W.

Conclusion: For 4cm thick walls .. 'not enough to break bricks
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Re: Insulate vertical walls with an air gap and lathing?




by Remundo » 23/11/22, 12:03

what I do at home.

1) I double the walls from the inside by screwing 63 x 38 mm joists (or 40 x 60 mm depending on what you find).

2) horizontal joists prevent updrafts, 2-3 depending on the height of your wall (I usually put 3, it divides every 60-70 cm in height for a ceiling at 2m50). For a basement, 1 or 2 halfway up. This is to avoid convection phenomena in the wall.

3) in the small boxes, I glue or I staple thin multilayer aluminum insulation: this insulation has the role of blocking infrared, while the 40 mm of air block thermal conduction.

4) I pass all the power lines and ground conductors that are missing

5) I cover the joists with OSB3 or chipboard.

here to illustrate the photo of a construction site in 2018

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Image

Image

with the kind collaboration of my daughter : Oops:

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Re: Insulate vertical walls with an air gap and lathing?




by Remundo » 23/11/22, 12:57

so i did this in the whole house, Ground floor and 1st floor. 120 m² are inhabited/heated in the house (about 75 m² on the 1st floor and 45 m² on the ground floor). Our heating temperatures are 19°C on the 1st floor, 17-18°C on the ground floor.

Here are the results over 3 years:

gas_heating_performance.png
performance_chauffage_gaz.png (71.28 KiB) Consulted 2216 times


According to the data collected by EDF-GDF, our household compared to the average of all households (with the situation corrected in terms of inhabited surface and equipment) consumes almost half as much (between 50 and 60%).

In 2020: 7729 / 13873 = 0.557
in 2021: 11079 / 18230 = 0.607
In 2022: 6783 / 12015 = 0.564

I would point out that my wife also cooks with gas, which is not in our favor for gas consumption.

Reduced to m², on average over the 3 years we consume 71 kWh / m² / year in heating, which places us in the middle of category B.

This other link from Engie says that for 100 m², heating + cooking consumes an average of 11 kWh/713m²/year, or 100 kWh/m²/year, I'm still at 71/117 = 60%

For a thermal strainer built in 1960, it's safe to say that the insulation I installed works well.
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Re: Insulate vertical walls with an air gap and lathing?




by izentrop » 23/11/22, 15:20

Remundo wrote:what I do at home.

1) I double the walls from the inside by screwing 63 x 38 mm joists (or 40 x 60 mm depending on what you find).

2) horizontal joists prevent updrafts, 2-3 depending on the height of your wall (I usually put 3, it divides every 60-70 cm in height for a ceiling at 2m50). For a basement, 1 or 2 halfway up. This is to avoid convection phenomena in the wall.

3) in the small boxes, I glue or I staple thin multilayer aluminum insulation: this insulation has the role of blocking infrared, while the 40 mm of air block thermal conduction.

4) I pass all the power lines and ground conductors that are missing

5) I cover the joists with OSB3 or chipboard.
thin insulation between 2 non-ventilated air gaps: Rmax = 1,7 m²K/W, same thickness of glass wool = 3.15 double : Mrgreen:
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Re: Insulate vertical walls with an air gap and lathing?




by Christophe » 23/11/22, 15:25

Lost penis... 40 mm of glass wool is at best an R of 1 to 0.04 of lambda!
But Zizi invented the 0.013 lambda glass wool with the wave of a magic wand!

Like Zizi had invented the vaccine that protects against transmission!

Have you ever thought about going to therapy? : Shock: : Shock: : Shock:
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