Project heating wood and solar heating

Heating, insulation, ventilation, VMC, cooling ... short thermal comfort. Insulation, wood energy, heat pumps but also electricity, gas or oil, VMC ... Help in choosing and implementation, problem solving, optimization, tips and tricks ...
sspid14
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by sspid14 » 09/03/11, 12:54

mathieu444 wrote:The losses of the house are quite reduced 7kw ...

Yes but in winter you have to see if to heat your hot water it will not be too fair.

mathieu444 wrote:For storage, with what formula should I calculate the volume of my solar buffer tank (is there one)? And is there a formula for sizing the panels?

Personally, I will put for 6 m² of sensor a 500l DHW tank. And one of 1000 liters for your heating.

mathieu444 wrote:It is true that if you can add the names on it it would be great.

Not too much time ... but from left to right there are the radiator, the underfloor heating, the pressure breaker bottle, the heating storage tank, the DHW tank with electrical backup, the stove and the solar panels
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mathieu444
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by mathieu444 » 15/03/11, 15:43

I can't find the formula to calculate the volume of the buffer tank I need ...

I have losses of 7 KW

What do I need for other data?

Thank you for your help
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dedeleco
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by dedeleco » 15/03/11, 18:35

You have to define your clear objectives in the different cases and I wrote the guideline:
The principle is to calculate the total energy E to be stored in the buffer by clearly defining its function (power multiplied by time), stove or solar, which makes it possible to calculate the volume of water required by knowing its storage temperature and that the water stores 4,18J / ° Cg is: E = (Tf-Ti) x4,18xV with E in KJ, V in liters, T in ° C Tf, final hot T and T of Ti cold water inlet .

But it is necessary to define the energy needs, duration of hot water heating with stove turned off, or without sun, multiplied by the power.
For the sun, you need to know your sunshine in average winter, the typical duration without sun (therefore the local climate), the efficiency of the collectors (depending on their nature and the T of the heating water or DHW (very different)) which fixes the energy to receive on sunny days and therefore the collector area.
See the site and read while assimilating as well as econology:
http://www.apper-solaire.org/?Calculs
http://www.apper-solaire.org/
http://www.apper-solaire.org/?Faq

Be wary of formulas that are not well understood, in particular the assumptions must be clear, otherwise errors guaranteed.


So try to understand well instead of looking for a saving formula used with your eyes closed without making the effort to understand.

So it all depends on your requirements and the insulation of the ball.

It's like the tens of thousands of pages of nuclear safety that have been planted in Japan !!
Because they forgot correlations of events of low probabilities which with the tsunami, realized all together (theoretical probability multiplied by independent events, of 1 in a billion) suppressed all cooling, even of emergency, on plants which cannot not do without it at all !!

Keeping the heat of summer to heat winter requires a balloon of more than 300m3 (or 1000m3 of mini earth much cheaper with drilling) perfectly insulated with 2m to 3m of well designed insulation !!

You make 25 boreholes at 15m depth on 100m2 of land (volume of 1000m3) with exchanger pipes and adequate solar thermal collectors at low cost and you will no longer need a CO2 stove and pollution in perpetuity !!
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mathieu444
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by mathieu444 » 15/03/11, 20:27

So E = Power * duration i.e. 5000W (average loss between day and night) x 24h = 100000 Wh = 360000 KJ

360000=(65-35)*4.18*V=125V

V = 360000/125 = 2800 liters

According to these calculations, a 2800 liter tank would be needed to store a day of energy.

I just have in my calculation?
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dedeleco
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by dedeleco » 15/03/11, 21:10

Mathieu4 has a funny calculator:

same calculation with correct multiplications:

So E = Power * duration i.e. 5KW (average loss between day and night stored over a full day) x 24h = 120KWh = 432000 KJ (after x3600)

432000KJ = (65-35) * 4.18 * V = 125,4V (V in liters because KJ)

V = / 125 = 3445 liters = 3,445m3

I hope that in Japan Tepco has not calculated its nuclear power plants with the same calculator, because I then understand the current apocalypse !!

If you want a week you need 7 times more and for a winter of 4 months, you need 120 times more !!!
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AXEAU
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by AXEAU » 15/03/11, 21:30

Hello,

I will not do the calculation this way. For me in the middle of winter over 24 hours you can have 5 hours of sunshine to stock up and have a direct contribution if you have well-oriented picture windows. In this case you will need fewer calories to last 24 hours.
To size your reserve I don't know how to do the calculation and in your place I will wait for spending a winter to see how the house reacts and determine what the need will be. Finally I remembered that it needed about 1m² of panel for 100l of reserve, from that look at what surface you can install, this is surely what will limit you.

jlg
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mathieu444
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by mathieu444 » 21/03/11, 15:10

I think I found the diagram I was looking for ... by modifying it a little it would give that

Image

Would it be suitable?

The buffer tank would be a mixed buffer tank, here is the technical sheet http://www.nideck.com/contents/fr/2010%20-%20Fiche%20tech.%20NIDC.pdf

The solar panels (10m²) would be connected to the coil of the balloon, and a solar regulation would regulate the "solar" part.
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lori74
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Registration: 22/03/11, 17:57




by lori74 » 23/03/11, 10:34

sspid14 wrote:
mathieu444 wrote:For storage, with what formula should I calculate the volume of my solar buffer tank (is there one)? And is there a formula for sizing the panels?

Personally, I will put for 6 m² of sensor a 500l DHW tank. And one of 1000 liters for your heating.

mathieu444 wrote:It is true that if you can add the names on it it would be great.

Not too much time ... but from left to right there is the radiator, the heating floor, the pressure relief bottle, the heating storage tank, the domestic hot water tank, the stove and the solar panels


I have a similar system and I cannot calculate the size of the panels. I tried to find a formula on several forums and books, but I can't!
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manet42
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by manet42 » 23/03/11, 12:57

Directions to this location:
http://herve.silve.pagesperso-orange.fr/solaire.htm

good calculations.

JC
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mathieu444
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by mathieu444 » 08/04/11, 10:08

Would this scheme be satisfactory?
I plan to make just a small modification, put a solar buffer between 6000 and 8000 liters (with cubis isolated in series.

Would that be suitable?
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