Wood boiler: new ECS installation diagram and PCs

[Christophe]

Didn't you notice yet?

Well the solar circuit is not represented ... because it is independent from a "fluid" point of view and has nothing to do with the assembly of the deom ...

In fact it is very simple: a pump (640 W hey yes it's not nothing) pumps water into the reserve, injects it into the panels and it returns to the reserve. All at P atm. because it is a drain circuit which explains the power of the pump.

Advantage: system + simple, no risk of frost and longer life

Disadvantage: noisier, slightly lower efficiency than the pressurized system, pump consumption

One could imagine transforming it into a pressurized system by putting an exchanger at the bottom of the buffer, but given the huge construction site that this represents, I don't know if it's worth it ...

[fc89]

Do you want to heat 70m3 of water with solar panels that consume 640wh and during the cold winter season?
A+

[Christophe]

Well here is a question UNDERSTANDABLE ...

The answer is: yes, what is the problem?

The pump starts only when the panels are hot (finally when there is a sufficient delta between the top of the panels and the buffer ...)

We had a few days of great weather just before Christmas, we gained around 1,5 ° C for 6 hours of operation. I let you estimate the average power of the panels and the COP ... I have no doubt that it is much higher than that of heat pumps ...

[fc89]

For the cop it is indeed very good.
Raising the temperature by 1.5 ° per day from 15 to 20 ° is fine, but is the tank already mounted higher this winter? What is its average temperature?
A tank at 20 ° is insufficient to heat anything except to help heat the DHW.
All houses have heat losses you agree, now do you have temperature sensors (needle type mounted on the pipes) between the flow and return of the heating?
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[Christophe]

For the cop it is indeed very good.

How much does it cost? I had estimated it but not under these conditions ...

On the other hand, a 20 ° tank is insufficient to heat anything except to help heat the DHW.

Yes, it is an extreme case ... the reserve has never been so low, after the days of good weather before Christmas it was a little less than 30 ° C ... well vi the solar ca not heat when y has no sun

All houses have heat losses you agree, now do you have temperature sensors (needle type mounted on the pipes) between the flow and return of the heating?
A+

Well there is the sensor for regulating the 4-way valve and needle thermometers on the PC velta collectors.

Inlet: 25-26 ° C approximately, outlet 18-19 ° C approximately, i.e. the room temperature. After there is the complement of the stove in the living room ...

I can raise the inlet T ° C by closing the valves V1 or V2, but I cannot close them completely otherwise when V19 closes, C2 will pull the mouth (nothing to suck)

[Christophe]

Raising the temperature by 1.5 ° per day from 15 to 20 ° is fine, but is the tank already mounted higher this winter? What is its average temperature?

No it has never been at 15 ° C, 1,5 it was between 24 and 30 ° C ...

Max temperature? It depends, when does winter start for you? When I started the deom (at the end of November) there was barely enough T ° to make 100% solar DHW ... so around 35 ° C.

Average I would say so far: 25 ° C ... it has mostly dropped since 2008, not a ray of sunshine but it is a bit at random that is why I am thinking to put a continuous temperature recording system with graphics and all the bazaar in order to really know the perfs and possible points of optimization (???) ...

If kk1 knows such systems?

[fc89]

Finally, concrete elements.

You say:

Inlet: 25-26 ° C approximately, outlet 18-19 ° C approximately, i.e. the room temperature. After there is the complement of the stove in the living room ...

Exit 18-19 °, now can you tell me what your tank is for since it is 20 °? It cannot raise the heating return temperature.
For me it is useless except to preheat the DHW.
If you take into account the natural losses of the tank + the consumption of the pump, I am afraid that all this is not as profitable as that!
What do you think?
It's a shame because you have a lot of potential.
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[Christophe]

Already 21.9 ° C is not 18 ° C ... then yes currently, it is no longer used much except DHW preheating but it is mainly the fault with no sun for 10 days ...

For "natural" losses yes, but they indirectly contribute to heating the house, don't they? The reserve is placed under the living room which is far from being a coincidence in my opinion ...

And the reserve increases the inertia of the house also.

It may not be as profitable but it is more than a heat pump ...

The COP I estimated was 70... with 80% of losses (which is largely overestimated it is anything ...) that leaves a COP of 14 average ... So in comparison, no heat pump has such a COP. ..

ps: when we arrived the reserve was at 9 ° C, empty house (second residence), solar system not used for "a means". So I think that 9 ° C is the minimum temperature that the reserve can reach ... it was also the temperature of the cellar.

[fc89]

For me and I will stop there.

You should connect your solar panels to the DHW, once at temperature redirect to the tank.
This way you will have hot water for a good part of the year.
Heat and maintain your DEOM at 30 or even 35 ° if it is really cold, your tank.
Connect your radiator and DHW PCs to the tank by three or four-way valves.

A+

[jean63]

For me and I will stop there.

You should connect your solar panels to the DHW, once at temperature redirect to the tank.
This way you will have hot water for a good part of the year.
Heat and maintain your DEOM at 30 or even 35 ° if it is really cold, your tank.
Connect your radiator and DHW PCs to the tank by three or four-way valves.

A+

Yes I will see it like that. This is what cuicui does with its 40 m2 of "home" sensors, it heats a 1000 liter DHW tank (I believe) but not the house.

I am not sure that the inertia of these 70 m3 is worth being "activated" by heating up a few degrees in winter to lose them again faster than they were acquired as soon as the sun is absent for a while. week. It is better to heat a small volume and use it at 30 35 ° as said fc89.

One speaker even said that his father (Belgium) did not use his sensors in winter to do ECS.

When I built in 1985, there was a company in the Alps called ASDER which made PSD (direct solar floor): recovery of calories from the sensors directly in the underfloor heating.

I'm not saying I'm right, but I tend to agree with fc89 on this point.

I find that it still works a lot even if Christine complains that it is a little cold in some rooms (not heated by
the living room stove).

And finally, only one thing matters: what will the cost of the heating season be?

Are you sure that only the "cost" criterion of the heating season matters?
If you curdle yourself all the time when you are sitting in front of your PC (personal computer .... no heated floor !! ), it is not very pleasant, but hey on the other hand it is a choice.

At home, I notice that when the temperature of the tiled floor decreases, we immediately feel the difference (with a wooden floor it's different but the tiles radiate from the cold). The return temperature of my PC is 23 to 24 ° C with a departure between 28 and 30 ° (+ if it is -10 °) and there are 20 ° in the rooms.
But I agree my gas bill will be higher than your wood bill .... I must say that I had "shower takers" during the Christmas holidays !!!

Today, it is 13 ° outside, I stopped the heating. There are 20 ° inside.