Wood boiler: new ECS installation diagram and PCs

[fc89]

Hello,

Christophe after having studied your installation, this is what I think about it:
You have all the elements for economical and to some extent ecological heating.
But, yes there is a "but", your installation is not the top, too many valves, management of the heating that only you control, insufficient diameter of the pipes, bad management of the buffers.
I will share with you an element of comparison:
After the final shutdown of an out-of-use compressor of 250m3 / h, I had to start the one of 500m3 / h.
This compressor has two hour counters, 1 general start-up counter and the 2nd for the working time, ie the "load".
When empty, it consumes 40A in 400V
Charged 100A.
For 100 hours of use, there were 70 hours of work (charge), and no stops.
I installed a reserve (buffer) of 2m3 and modify the outlet diameter of the compressor tubes.
Well now for 100 hours of use, it only works 40 hours and can even stop completely.
Where do I come from, well, you should have opted for this operating principle.
All your heat production devices, DEOM, solar panels, boiler must manage only your pads (300l, 70m3), the 300l pad for the end of winter and summer season, the 70m3 for the full heating season and maintain these pads between 35 and 40 °.
And make one or more tappings for the diffusion of heat.
It must be borne in mind that consumption increases considerably with the number of start - stop of any device even in a year of operation.
With your reserves you could only be able to heat 2 days a week?
It was a bit long but I think there is food for thought.
What do you think?

[jonule]

Hello,
for the summer I cut my DHW fuel oil production, there is an electric balloon which takes over, it gives more life to the boiler (and to the burner ;-)

[fc89]

Hello,

You're absolutely right, that's how he does it.
A+

[Christophe]

Hi,

Ha, you understand me, why such a mounting in opposition?
Where, you like to complicate things!
What is the temperature of all your water reserves (buffer)?

A+

Well, it's not really by choice that they are in opposition: I had to adapt to an existing circuit and the idea was not to be able to make a solar preheating and oil overheating assembly but solar wood. So it's not bad.

The oil rescue can always be done in case of problem since there is a 100% fuel oil tank (but I don't know how long it will stay in place since it works nickel with the wood!)

The main reserve fell due to lack of sun (not a radius in 2008), we are currently at 21.9 ° C precisely. It's barely enough to maintain the inertia of the house.

The DHW tank oscillates between 42 and 45 ° C at 80% of the height (see photo of the probe).

[Christophe]

Christophe =>

With a few days of hindsight, how does your new installation work? does the DHW priority and the PC heating go well?

It works much better, the other installation is therefore strongly discouraged:
- the water is no longer "dirty" (it was at times due to the corrosion of the exchanger)
- the T ° is bcp more constant
- the regulation works well

For the T ° answered just before ...

[Christophe]

With your reserves you could only be able to heat 2 days a week?
It was a bit long but I think there is food for thought.
What do you think?

Uh, I didn't understand much about your idea.

In fact the DEOM can HEAT the tank by 70m3 but a fast calculation gives a very low temperature rise (0.1 to 0.2 ° C I think) per day for an average power of DEOM at 9kW! In short little interest to buffer in the 70m3 with this power if it is not to store the surplus of power (which is not the case, 100% of the power leaves in the PCs).

You have to understand one thing about this arrangement: the deom was taken on a whim without having the intention of heating the house with it. Originally it should have been JUST connected to the radiator in the cellar! That was the idea ...

After as we quickly saw that the DHW was quickly cold in mid season and that the sun could not be counted on 100% for the DHW in winter, I decided to connect the DHW to it.

It was only then that I said to myself: if the DHW is on it, pkoi not put the PCs, especially that the volume of the 300L tank was insufficient to store the calories of a filling.

In short what I mean is that this assembly is a succession of reflections to try to adapt existing elements to each other in the least worst possible way ... and starting from this fact, I find that it does not work bad even if Christine complains that it is a little cold in some rooms (not heated by
the living room stove).

And finally, only one thing matters: what will the cost of the heating season be?

For the moment we have consumed 2,5 Big bags, say 700 kg per big bag, that makes us 1750 kg, that is, at 4 kwh / kg, 7000 kWh. Either related to the surface of the house: 41 kWh EP / m² and we are currently in the mid season, or 80 kWh EP / m² in the end.

ps: I take 4 instead of 5 because the humidity is higher in our briquettes than in "standard" pellets.

And about 1 cubic meter of wood hanging around in the greenhouse when we were out of briquettes for a while.

In short, we should be below 100 kWh EP / m² (DHW included) so it's not so bad but it's already too much for a "solar" house !!

I hope thebuffer optimizationandattic insulation will save a few tens of% ...

My goal is to arrive at less than 50 kWh / m² and I would be satisfied (the house is still more than 20 years old).

ps: for electricity we are around 200 kWhe / month that's a lot for 2 but there are pcs for 2 people of work included (who measures his energy consumption at his job?) + the solar pump which has quite a lot sucked in summer.

[fc89]

Hello Christopher,

You say:

Uh, I didn't understand much about your idea.

Take the time to read it again, even several times.

In any case I understood your diagram, I can tell you that your reserve of 70m3 is only used for DHW and since the water is at 21.9 °, it even tends to cool the water of the PC.
Because the exit from the DEOM goes through water at 21.9 ° before arriving at the PC.
Isn't that right?
A+

[fc89]

Jean63, you who also studied Christophe's scheme closely, do you think the same thing as I do:

In any case I understood your diagram, I can tell you that your reserve of 70m3 is only used for DHW and since the water is at 21.9 °, it even tends to cool the water of the PC.
Because the exit from the DEOM goes through water at 21.9 ° before arriving at the PC.
Isn't that right?

In your opinion?
A+

[Christophe]

Because the exit from the DEOM goes through water at 21.9 ° before arriving at the PC. Isn't that right?
A+

No that's not it, there are 2 circuits, DHW and heating:

a) the reserve preheats the DHW which arrives therefore slightly lower than the buffer water, currently it must be around 18 ° C.

The mains water is at 8/9 ° C, the gain in preheating is therefore not negligible.

b) When the 4-way valve is 100% "hot", the arrival in the 4-way valve is a "mixture" of solar and wood calories. The more the valve closes, the less calories there will be from the solar until it results in a reversal of the flows in the solar-PC exchanger which will therefore buffer the calories of the wood. This also happens when the circulator C1 of the PCs stops.

ps: I reread your post and sorry but I do not really see what I can do in my case ... do not forget that the deom is not a real boiler in terms of power and the current conduct is widely available to transfer its energy (the wood circulator C2 is far from running all the time ... it will reassure you maybe compared to your "example" of compressor). I would say it spins 30-40% of the time ... Really hard to say ...

[fc89]

I do not distinguish the solar panels, where are they?
.A +