Make electricity with wood!

[Ptilu]

He well, according to you the benefit of steam injection is to limit the temperature in order not to destroy the material, even reduce yield ... I just told you that we can can get the same effect with good control and simulation. And gun down without performance ...

The condensate is energy, I grant you, but the value will be a challenge in itself ... We must first separate the steam from there, their rheology must be complex, much like a super dirty oil, doughy fried;) the guys at the burner could be atomized ball do something. On my project (which is only a demonstrator TP) is not refroidiras gas, therefore the problem will not arise ...
You have ideas for this?

[chatelot16]

must anyway that the warm part is between 1000 and 1200 ° c: if AC was not hot enough ca would make CO2 and less CO

there is no preobleme has ateindre these 1000 ° with cold air intake

What is a heat gas that comes out?

for good performance the engine intake has to be as cold as possible

I prefer to use heat from the gas leaving the gasifier to preheat the air going into it, if it makes up the AC temperature can inject more steam, so to make more fuel gas

there is not much to invent to enhance the product condensable: return to the era or alcol has called burn wood spirit: the distilation (today pyrolysis) of wood was an important source of product chemical all this indusrie disappeared replaced by the oil: it reborn when there will be more

we find exactly the same product condensable in the pyrolysis of wood or a simple gasifier gas: I think it is a waste of destroying everything in the gasifier cocourant

but at last while are those who burn wood to heat alone, make electricity more heating is already better! me I want to do even better: electricity, liquid fuel and heat

[sdefzone2]

Hello

As part of your experiments wood / electricity / gas plant, I take the time to tell you my experience of thermoelectricity.
With two modules connected in series, I could charge batteries via a PWN photovoltaic charge controller.
I had to get a circulator for liquid cooling on the "cold" side of the module, the exchanger of a gas water heater immersed in cold water ensuring the evacuation of the heat.
The modules look like this:



The 12v circulator is of solar thermal installation type, adjustable, and must ensure a flow of at least 300l / h
The set has cost 450e with piping and other gadgets to monitor temperatures.
And this product ... not much.
At peak, the wood stove fully loaded: 38 about watts! (23volts 1.7ampère *) which must be subtracted 6w circulator.
But an average is reached rather 23w with only 3w circulator.
once we know with this gas plant if one burns wood ... good performance growing exponentially with heat (at constant temperature of cold side), until the destruction of the module (260 ° )
I found a place on the stove where the temperature stays in a good range.
Despite the high cost, I intend to double the system. Indeed these 40w be lifesaving to the period when the signs give the least (winter night) period where it is that the most heated ...
Regular 20watts obtained have allowed me to spend the winter a little more cushy, only those that run on batteries can grasp my joy
Thus, in addition to a minimalist config photovoltaics, thermoelectricity permits with a minimum of moving parts and wear, and certainly a pathetic performance, electrically live in the heart of winter (light, zik, computer, DIY .. .). The interest is to keep the batteries at the stage where they work best when they are full (when not in use say the gossips).

(Note that the company that sold me the modules do not apply too much on cabling ...)

Two bad pictures of the device:




Sdefzone

Edit by modo: put pictures on the site image hoster

[Ptilu]

slt
20 to 40W? You're sure? AVC that you barely feeds a light bulb ...
Forgive me my sceptissisme ...

[dedeleco]

shabby performance

2 with small modules, I do not think so, because it corresponds to their maximum possible, apparently looking at their size on your best photos of your simple realization.
Your practical experience with more detail is very useful and deserves to be reproduced, discussed and improved, especially in price and number of modules, if you provide more information on parts, suppliers, and prices.
Could we have more information and details, as the supplier and module type, their characteristics, the different elements the price because I feel that most of the price is in the hardware to run, circulator, faucet, pipes, etc ...?
Tensions obtained low with 2 priori modules, batteries used, and the hot real temperatures, cold on the surface of the modules, measured with thermocouples (even rudimentary as welding copper wire to wire) to verify that the exchangers function well, which is not very easy to get in your configuration on the stove, where cold water is heated a little on the burning stove.
I wonder if you put a surface sufficient insulation between the two temperatures, view photos; your modules with air exchanger unchanged aluminum, are placed on the plate of hot stove, with cooling by circulating cold water, which is a simple solution to a test, but with a very bad regulation hot temperature, apart from the inertia of the cooker and heat losses between the two exchangers.
A bracket screwed aluminum on the hot heat exchanger aluminum keeps the cold exchanger gas heater that is what material (aluminum, copper, iron?), How isolated, and what is its price by which supplier a priori it seems that you have made yourself?
I think we can improve more complex, as also with circulation of hot water from a heat exchanger in the boiler or stove, better insulated modules, to reduce the required flow rate of the circulator, more modules in series to obtain a valid voltage without approaching too maximum temperature of destruction of modules (260 ° C).
A temperature control with control of circulators would be possible for more power with more modules.
The flow rate of the circulator seems high, and with better insulation against heat on the stove, it seems that it could be reduced with lower power consumption.
Your achievement is simple, and allows you to write:

only those that run on batteries can grasp my joy

and therefore if you give precise details (supplier, material prices, councils) will be very useful to others like you, who will try to replicate and improve your simple and practical realization as a reference and starting point.

To forestall an ironic evil that is sure this suggestion, I noticed that taking a stationary bike and a dynamo and pedaling hard (150Watts) can do the same to charge batteries and good warm up with the exercise !!!

I think with more modules and more optimized thermal level can be more powerful.

[dedeleco]

slt
20 to 40W? You're sure? AVC that you barely feeds a light bulb ...
Forgive me my sceptissisme ..

But 40 200 LED is supplied in order to see !!!
Between nothing and enough is night and day !!!

Also the conditions are far from optimized to keep it simple.
Your Peltier modules are provided with any electrical power to cool in the fridge?
There is no limit to the number of modules used and therefore power possible.
I feel that the Peltier thermoelectric modules are underused due to this basic misunderstanding !!!

Doinc this simple concrete realization is a good starting point to motivate others without electricity and winter sun !!

[Forhorse]

Yes I also think that production can be significantly improved.
In any case the experience is interesting and encouraging results.

It would already treat the insulation between the two side modules, and then review the redroidissement circuit.
As the system is mainly intended to be used in winter I suppose, we could take advantage of the outside temperature to cool the system, with brine we can go down to the outside temperature (interesting if outside it freezes at -10 ° C)
And inverssement for the hot spring an oil circuit can be used, it would be easier to reguler a very high temperature without the risk of reaching the destruction temperature

[Ptilu]

I think you have trouble you realize the power brought into play ... A fridge is already 300W and a small apartment 'is rather 3kW peak (when it exceeds trips). So to get that power, it faudrais cells 90 and 400 € / cell, it goes up to € 36 000 !!! To add it to the boiler.

Of course an improvement can be made, but even increasing the efficiency of a factor 3 (utopian) the gazo will largely profitable ... Besides it is not power limited.

[dedeleco]

No and no, the cell is not to 400 10 € but at least 15 times the basic module and the remaining exchanger does not multiply so well designed.

This is a basic error that is wrongly overlooked !!!!

[Ptilu]

I prefer that;), it is true it is not desirable to make a heat exchanger / cell. Autan for me