Wind power mechanical use?

[Castor]

Bonjour.

A question.
It seems to me that in the days of our grandparents, wind power was mainly used mechanically, in general to pump water.
It seems that this use is today abandoned. I do want electricity to be used in a lot of ways.
But looking at the overall results, I do not understand everything: a "good big" engine, it seems to me that it has an efficiency of 85 to 90% (unless I am mistaken). Used as a generator, I imagine the losses are of the same order. Or at least 20 to 30% loss at least if we produce electricity from a wind turbine and then use it mechanically.

Am I wrong or not?

[denis]

yes, there is a loss, but what to do?
If you can store water at height, you can re-use energy by gravity, when you need it, it depends on the end use of the wind : for the simplest light alternator / battery / bulb
for mechanical effort, water is a good solution, but you need to drop it off with a good reserve / cheap: serve at height (pond). Who else?

[bolt]

generally to pump water.

Am I wrong or not?

good evening beaver
It all depends on what you want to pump your water to put it in reserve:
a centrifugal pump barely reaches 80% efficiency and this is for pumps over 70 m3 / hour, the centrifugal pumps of 2 m3 / h do not greatly exceed 50% efficiency (need double d energy to raise a mass from a certain height)
Otherwise you need a piston pump, without too much friction

Then comes the pressure drop of the water pipes

Then, if it is to transform your water reserve into mechanical energy, there is still a coefficient of performance depending on the "hydraulic motor" that you are going to use:
80% at best with a Pelton wheel (0,8)
85 to 90% with a Sagebien wheel

The formula :

power (ch) = 1000 x flow (m3 / s) x height of the chute (m) x output (ex 0,8) / 75

But here, no batteries are needed: P

bolt

(edited by ex-océano: deactivation of smileys-25/05 / 06-23: 14)

[Castor]

Re-

It all depends on what you want to pump your water to put it in reserve:
a centrifugal pump barely reaches 80% efficiency and this is for pumps over 70 m3 / hour, the centrifugal pumps of 2 m3 / h do not greatly exceed 50% efficiency (need double d energy to raise a mass from a certain height)
Otherwise you need a piston pump, without too much friction

okay, but:
wind turbine => mechanical energy => pump = water tower
the yield must be better than:
wind turbine => mechanical energy => alternator => electrical energy => pump = water tower.
no?

My question was (wrongly asked) why if we want to make renewable energy we no longer use wind turbines to directly fill water towers?

[bolt]

okay, but:
wind turbine => mechanical energy => pump = water tower
the yield must be better than:
wind turbine => mechanical energy => alternator => electrical energy => pump = water tower.
no?

it always depends on the pump principle:
for a centrifugal pump, the disadvantage is that it has its best performance at a certain flow rate and a certain speed
so as the wind speed changes all the time galley to regulate

for a piston and valve pump with accumulators against water hammer (and anti cavitation) suction and discharge, no problem, question of efficiency
but interview

bolt

[Other]

Hello
A piston water pump works with a good performance at low speed compared to a centrifugal pump,
all the old wind turbines of the farms (a large fan were mechanical pumps with seals in cooking, some had a rod which had an alternating movement directly made at the top of the tower in back of the fan, this rod went down to the well the pump is immersed therefore always primed. the rod passes through the discharge pipe,
You can still find in hardware stores for a modest price
a leather seals replacement kit for these pumps and contrary to what you might think it works long before making repairs, there is just sand and frost which damages them.

Andre

[denis]

these pumps work very well, I was part of an association that installed in Ivory Coast, without maintenance they worked a long time, the same from time to time it was necessary to change the seals, to date they must be abandoned (with children who die of thirst and especially of hygiene!)
We don't have the same philosophy

[Castor]

Bonjour.

these pumps work very well, I was part of an association which installed in Ivory Coast, without maintenance they worked a long time, the same from time to time it was necessary to change the seals, to this day they must be abandoned ( with children who die of thirst and especially of hygiene!)
We don't have the same philosophy

There I do not understand everything! Leaving a spring abandoned especially in an area where water is so vital ...

[Philippe Schutt]

Individually and as long as you do not have an urgent need for water or a good reserve, the mill is fine and it can be very pretty. there is also the stirling pump, with even fewer moving parts.
On the other hand, if you want 2 bars of pressure, you need to put your tank at 20m high. So it limits to uses that do not require pressure. In addition, sanitation being paid according to the water statement, you could not discharge this water into the sewer.

For a city, the water towers represent at best only a few hours of consumption, they are mainly used to make constant pressure, and we pump more or less depending on demand

[denis]

to: There I don't understand everything! Leaving a spring abandoned especially in an area where water is so vital ...


And yes beaver, me it also disturbs us westerners, we are not as fatalistic!
This is why at the time, I withdrew from the association. , 6 months + later, the voluntary colleagues who had gone to work on the spot by paying their plane tickets, received stone throws!, And were + or- expelled illico presto. You should know, that on the spot the embezzlement and corruption is very common, and the populations are easily manipulated
6 months later, all French people are evacuated and expelled even those who have integrated and who have honestly invested in businesses, you know the rest ...