Electrification of an isolated house without EDF

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sextasy
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Electrification of an isolated house without EDF




by sextasy » 27/07/10, 11:37

Hello,
I have already posted on others forums therefore those who browse more than one will have a duplicate history. I ask for other opinions because I do not know anything about it and I cannot afford to be wrong.

I explain the topo ..

I inherited a house in the drome, absolutely isolated, which is reached after 3km of tracks by car (4x4 in winter or snowmobile). The first neighbor is 2,350km away. For lovers of old stones, it is absolutely splendid (old sheepfold) with impressive volumes: 300m2.
Water would be available by drilling (could not test it).

Inside, everything is neatly furnished with modern comfort: kitchen, living room, bathroom. The inhabitants used a powerful generator year round in order to have the current.
Heating and hot water is by gas with a large tank.

I could not test anything because the generator disappeared (it would have been sold ..)

I plan to restore it: we have to redo the roof (very expensive)
change all windows with double glazing (very expensive) and some work. It would be to go on vacation (a real crazy luxury) and my retirement.

And above all I have to find a solution to have current in a reliable way for the evenings when I go there.
I know absolutely nothing about renewable energy, except that there are many boxes which understand nothing and who want to fill their pockets. I have heard very negative opinions on batteries, expensive and whose duration life would be very brief.

The house is somewhat encased in a valley. So the path of the sun is quite reduced (to check). By cons the mistral often blows ...
There are no rivers nearby.

So I don't know what to do. I estimate the work in full at 200.000 euros, between the roof, the windows, and the photovoltaic, I can not afford to be wrong especially as I have to buy the share of my brothers and sister of the heritage in more of that. I do not know its amount because the different estimates vary between 0 and 200.000 euros (!!!) the property being so atypical. The agencies do not know how to say if it has a lot of value or no value. There are still several hectares of land that go with (classified woodland) We would make an average of the different estimates.

Credit level I can not go beyond and I would put all my savings in contribution.

I would like to know if I can really imagine one day having autonomy in electricity, even if it means supplementing with a generator.
I would like to know if maintenance is tedious.

In fact I would like to know how it goes on in everyday life very concretely, the breakdowns, the concerns encountered, or the more positive points.

Otherwise, the town hall offered to buy the site for 1 euro symbolic.
Thank you for your informed opinions
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I Citro
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by I Citro » 27/07/10, 11:58

: Arrow: Considering the topo that you prepare, it would be necessary that there is a very strong emotional load so that you launch out.

Investing such sums in a second home is not very reasonable ...

The takeover by the town hall for the symbolic Euro appeals to me:
- Your property would therefore have no value. :?:
- How then to quantify the share that goes to the heirs who cede theirs. :?:
- Could the town hall have dishonest intentions. :?:
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dedeleco
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by dedeleco » 27/07/10, 13:45

Personally, I would watch what is really at risk of falling apart next winter !!

Above all, protect yourself from vandals by closing everything, with low consumption alarm on rechargeable batteries.
Especially that it does not look abandoned, because it attracts vandals !! (cut or cleared grass, flowers, etc.)

Even rotten, but dry, the woods last a long time, except vandals, because most of the time a house is destroyed by vandals who have fun on a house without surveillance !!
For summer, and even winter, unnecessary double glazing !!
Companies push to spend the maximum !!

How is the frame, the roof made, how old, with what top, tiles, slates, etc.? !!
How long has she been in this state !!
What altitude (snow)?
For lovers of old stones, it is absolutely splendid (old sheepfold) with impressive volumes: 300m2.

With this description it is not worth 1 € !!
The town hall or the agency jumps at the opportunity !!

If the frame can be kept dry for a long time!
If not dry, I would put it dry by any means, tiles or slates, to put back, tarpaulins, plastics on the leaks, tape, to test after with the rain and to watch the winter!
After dry, nothing hurts !!!
If the frame has weaknesses (slack), I would put vertical reinforcements in beam or were masons or doubling of critical beams!
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dedeleco
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by dedeleco » 27/07/10, 13:53

And above all I have to find a solution to have current in a reliable way for the evenings when I go there.


To camp in summer you do not need electric current, the gas camping gas lamps work very well !!
In the past, child and adult, I camped a month each summer without electricity !!!
Just make the effort to go back to the old one !!!
A wood fire heats and lights up !!
The oil or petrol lamp also lights up !!!
There are absorption gas fridges !! (I used one in a caravan in the past!)

A small generator of good quality gives current, but it is noisy and smells !!

Secondly simple and rechargeable photovoltaic panels are possible !!
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by Forhorse » 27/07/10, 14:38

I already followed your problem on others forums, and here is the solution I would suggest. This is the one I applied to a barn used as a stable which I own and which is also not connectable to the EDF network (refusal of the electrification union)

This solution consists of a double source of energy.
The main one is PV panels (around 500Wp) which charge batteries. A pure sine wave inverter "made in china" provides 230V for the lighting circuit and small utilities which need electricity permanently (fridge, water pump)
In parallel a "big" diesel generator of 4KVA with electric start.
It takes over automatically in the event of excessive battery discharge (when the sun is lacking) or manually in the event of an important punctual need.

This entirely homemade installation (I am an electrician) cost me around 5000 €, generator, battery and electrical installation inside the barn included.

Do not hesitate to document yourself, such an installation is ultimately nothing complicated and can be done by any good handyman.
If necessary you will find a lot of help here. Do not hesitate to ask.

And then I'm sure spending a week of vacation in the drôme, far from everything, to give you a hand would probably interest some volunteers here : Wink:
Just take advantage of the community aspect of internet econologists

EDIT: in any case sell this property for 1 symbolic euro is clearly to be plucked. Even without talking about the house, the land is worth much more than that.
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by dedeleco » 27/07/10, 16:23

For those who respond information on other forum :
forum-photovoltaique.fr/viewsujet.php?t=15342&p=157103

The house does not collapse !!!
But check in the attic if leaks have not appeared, on a rainy day carefully !!!!!

To avoid setbacks, start with cheap, and train and learn gradually, to fend for yourself !!
So first camp there without electricity, with gas lamp and absorption fridge on a gas caravan gas campsite (used). I had an old one that worked, but I dumped it for scrap for lack of space 20 years ago !!
http://www.neb.fr/camping.htm
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%A9fri ... ion_de_gaz
http://www.toutypasse.com/frigo-caravan ... 8a263434p1
http://www.next-enr.fr/frigo-et-glacier ... itres.html

After, more effective solutions, but always gradually, to learn and avoid scams !!

Small wind turbine (mistral) and small photo-voltaic cheap to see the problems!
No need for a building permit, because portable portable, even of large surface.
In summer, for hot water a black pipe in the sun is enough to have hot water (zero expense!).
Don't want great comfort right away with a big fridge!
A 30 € Peltier effect camping cooler (department store) helps out well and works on car battery (5A, 12V) for hours and easily recharged with the car or small generator.
Collect simple rainwater from the roof in a container of several m3, as an inexpensive inflatable or removable pool !!
See if the drilling exists and works with a generator, even rented in Kiloutou (determine its voltage 220V or 12V) !!
If the high-voltage line (how much, 200KV) passes through your home, if a vertical neon tube lights up by itself alone, you can recover some electricity by putting insulated conductive aluminum sheets underneath, like the neon tube, without nothing to say, normal losses of the line and you have electricity with tension to regulate !!

I also think that you have to know a minimum and I don't even know how to change a fuse.

But you can learn and therefore for this challenge you can learn to know, being careful to start with simple and inexpensive !!
First camp without electricity with camping gas!
Buy a small inexpensive wind turbine to put at the end of a guyed mast to recharge car batteries and learn without losing money.
See on econology the wind turbines to play !!
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sextasy
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by sextasy » 27/07/10, 19:25

The house is currently abandoned, so it is getting damaged. But it is not yet in ruins at all, but there is work to be done. The roof is leaking a little, I fear that if she spends another winter in this state all this will worsen.

I am really torn between the desire to set up this project and the reason that tells me to give up. I would like to be able to resell the property at least the amount of the work, if I ever realize that I was wrong. And it's almost impossible to estimate.

What could be nice is to make it profitable by renting guest rooms for example, especially when I will be retired in 10 years. By betting on the green side, a bit like those who rent cabins. Or why not rent a part a year to ensure a presence on site. But without EDF it is very difficult. I am afraid of not assuming financially if I do not have a plan behind.
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dedeleco
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by dedeleco » 27/07/10, 21:00

The roof is leaking a little,

Leaks to be removed by searching for points and replacing or replacing broken tiles.
One or two damaged ones are enough to destroy while a few hours to change with scales !!!
It happened to me, with only one broken tile !!!!
Crucial and little work !!
The roof should not leak a little !!!


After dry we can wait 10 years !!

There is a way to have minimum electricity for a low price !!!
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paotop
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by paotop » 08/09/10, 09:40

otherwise there is also the possibility of a generator with inertia.

it's more expensive but it's not bad and little known: http://www.energiestro.com/fr/groupe_electrogene.htm
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by chatelot16 » 08/09/10, 11:28

as long as you don't live there full time, the generator is the best solution

thanks to the chinese we find 2000w for 170euro, with 4 stroke engine imitation honda

even if it only lasts 1 year it makes a cost price quite reasonable

the first one I bought of this kind still works ... but I had to modify the carburetor float whose transmission to the needle has worn out

I had to change the main circuit breaker which was blowing at a lower and lower power

I had to redo the electronic regulator of the alternator, which burned out after 3 years of service


since I used other and these 3 breakdowns continue to happen on recent models but never before 1 year of service

another point to watch carefully: drain often: if you run too long with the same oil, the exhaust valve gets stuck, impossible to start, you have to open the rocker cover and tickle the valve until it closes completely: this problem never happens if you drain every 200 hours of walking, but happens every time if you forget too long


there are small 2-stroke model 700w at 80 euro, economical in petrol when you have to run a long time at low power, but problem, they get dirty, it works well for 1 month, but then you have to dismantle the exhaust every week to decalaminate the exhaust light, I used only synthetic oil
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