France, mobilization for the climate

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eclectron
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by eclectron » 24/09/19, 09:16

Grelinette wrote:
In short, what mode of mass action can allow people to convey a message of disagreement or concern and get an answer?

Desertion is also an answer: do not participate as much as possible in the system. For lack of 'fighters' and lack of money, it would not last long.
I do not believe it too much as the personal cost is high: breaking your ass to make his healthy and sustainable autonomy, 365/365, while the neighbor is stuffed with lobster, must have the convictions well hung but it is a possibility.
There are of course intermediate levels of commitment in this sense, to participate as little as possible.

By cons it is not spectacularly media, except to reach a point that would scare the winners of the system in place.
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by Ahmed » 24/09/19, 10:48

We look forward to seeing you! Phil, for your contribution which goes in the direction of my approach: for concrete questions, I trust collective intelligence and prefer to make my contribution in a more theoretical form, which is also inseparable from the practical considerations which result from it.
Si Guy would like to constitute a catalog, I think it will find food for thought in the writings ofIvan Illitch, which, in particular, distinguished the user-friendly technique from the alienating technique which makes man heteronomous to the latter (or will say to put it simply: low-tech and high-tech).
Grelinette I appreciate your analysis, however when you write:
In this sense, the "Greta Thunberg" method is very interesting and admirable, because, step by step, part of a simple individual strike in front of the door of her school, she now manages to be the guest of honor for speak out before the UN! ...

It does not seem inappropriate to me to think that when the institutions show themselves to be sensitive to this point, it is because they intend to use it for their own benefit, as I have already had the opportunity to express: the " energy transition "is an extraordinary market!

Eclectron, desertion is practically impossible and, since I was talking about it just now, Ivan Illitch explained in this regard that any technical development devalued previous practices by making them useless, ineffective or inapplicable. All ideology tends to be totalizing, that is to say to include all forms of activity and to exclude those which do not conform to it. This competition makes it difficult to survive outside the system *, but that a few "escape" will in no way oppose this system: it can only be refractories who will thus have become inaudible and invisible ...

* On another scale, it is this same competition which is exerted by the enriched countries on the producers of the less "advanced" countries.
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by Ahmed » 24/09/19, 14:47

Here, to relax your neurons a bit (don't thank me, it's kindly!):
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by eclectron » 24/09/19, 16:07

Ahmed wrote:...Ivan Illitch ...
that I didn't know, except by name.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Illich
Yes, the 'always more' ends up shooting himself in the foot.
It is measurement in everything that must be learned; starting with mental sobriety, calm, silence.


As an extension of Ivan Illich's work, American artists close to the Carfree movement imagined an alternative city project, called "Illichville". Unlike previous urban utopias, this project is recent since it dates from the end of the XNUMXth century and it is resolutely conceived in opposition to the American "automobile city" whose sprawling model is Los Angeles [ref. necessary]. It is also an urban project with a strong ecological connotation. It is based on walking, cycling and public transport. It is a city which in fact offers a model of decline based on the refusal of the consumer society and the automobile and promoting the conviviality defended by Illich. The Vauban district of Freiburg im Breisgau is one example.

There's a beginning for everything : Wink:
No doubt our destiny begins in Freiburg im Breisgau : roll:
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by Ahmed » 24/09/19, 16:19

Is the Vauban district a convenient starting point or showcase? Especially since I no longer have the conviction, despite the positive points that I have observed on the spot, that it does not change anything in substance *: certainly an evolution, or rather a reconfiguration of the rather sympathetic urban space, but which in no way calls into question the model of global development.

* Which explains why this project came to fruition.

PS: you forgot the slowness! : Wink:
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by izentrop » 24/09/19, 16:57

Ahmed wrote:the "energy transition" is an extraordinary market!
Especially for those who scuttle it for their benefit. https://www.sauvonsleclimat.org/fr/
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by eclectron » 25/09/19, 11:13

Ahmed wrote: you forgot the slowness! : Wink:

Yes i rushed : Wink: an old reflex ...

Otherwise, I can only agree, if we take an instant photo of the planet today, nothing has really turned towards healthy and sustainable. At the macroscopic level, the mad rush continues.

It pleases me to think, even to note, that initiatives initiate a gestation towards healthy and sustainable. : Wink: and I have to be right, because whatever happens, Cata (insufficient level of changes) or Eden (changes at the height of the problems), it is in the making. : Lol:
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by Ahmed » 25/09/19, 15:15

Do you mean that you fear a miscarriage? : Lol:
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by Christophe » 25/09/19, 15:22

Tell me is there a demonstration for the climate which advocates the economic sobriety personally? Personal investment eco rather than ego?

Or else, as I see and deplore, are they all accusing and asking for and awaiting solutions from others?


See the message I just wrote here: climate-change-co2 / greta-face-to-deputies-t16068-60.html # p367589
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Re: France, mobilization for the climate




by Exnihiloest » 26/09/19, 11:08

GuyGadebois wrote:...
Could you name some "false good ideas"?
I have one obvious: The electric car.


There is no "evidence".
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