Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to its loss ... and it is right!

Current Economy and Sustainable Development-compatible? GDP growth (at all costs), economic development, inflation ... How concillier the current economy with the environment and sustainable development.
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by Ahmed » 28/10/18, 21:24

To follow up on my last message, there is a parallel which seems striking to me and which however has never, to my knowledge, been noted, it is that between peak oil and peak profit *. We know that the conventional peak oil was reached in the USA in 1970, but that the new hydraulic fracturing methods push this peak further, however this period can only be slim (Cf. the excellent and recent explanations of Sen-no-sen), similarly, the peak profit of conventional industries is around the same period, rather the early 80s, and the collapse that should have occurred did not occur because new abstract-value extractive methods have emerged at this time (more precisely, experienced a very rapid development: it is above all the scale that constitutes the novelty) based on the financial industry. Just like hydraulic fracturing, this industry which has managed to generate a mass of considerable abstract value, with human damage ("social fracturing" : Wink: ) and environmental even more considerable than shale oil and gas (the latter being more geographically circumscribed), only postpones the deadline by a little bit, all the more so in so doing, it brings systemic contradictions to a level never achieved.

* As we will have understood, the "peak profit" is the inflection point of the curve representing capital gains, its ability to self-value.
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by J-Pierre » 30/10/18, 09:20

Thank you Christophe ...
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by Christophe » 10/10/22, 09:00

Bruno Latour left us a few days ago, at barely 75 years old, so he will not see the end of the world...(or not?):

The tributes which followed the death of Bruno Latour, theoretician of ecology, show that his thought is very much alive

An internationally renowned philosopher, anthropologist and sociologist of science and technology, Bruno Latour died on the night of October 8 to 9. Multiple researcher, he was 75 years old and his ideas widely inspire those who claim to be ecological, but not only. The climate regime he mentioned calls for other policies that are struggling to find an electoral translation, despite the rise of imbalances on the earth he called Gaia. He opposed them with constructive theoretical alternatives, far from sterile catastrophism.

"The contrast between the calm with which we continue to live quietly and what is happening to us is dizzying. Especially since I do not believe in the virtues of cataclysm, and people will mobilize more and more as time goes by. that disasters will multiply", said Bruno Latour. His death triggered a wave of tributes intended to raise awareness of his rich and complex thought, crossing techniques, sciences, philosophy and sociology to rethink the links between humans, nature and machines. He advocated a constructive ecology based on a theoretical vision that he had summarized in his book released in 2021, "Memo on the new ecological class. How to make an ecological class conscious and proud of itself emerge".

For him, the new climate regime that is already installed, requires a general mobilization to rethink all dimensions of daily existence, at all scales and on all continents. Bruno Latour headed the Sciences Po research laboratory from 2007 to 2012 and remained associate professor emeritus. He had inspired many research programs whose common point is transversality and collective work and had created the Medialab there.

His former students, such as the journalist Paloma Moritz, testify to the originality of his thinking and his ability to intellectually shake up his students and "seize up their automatic thinking machine".

Bruno Latour was aware of this but nevertheless deplored, in an interview with Mediapart in April 2022, the limits of his "bifurcating" capacities: "When I think that there are among the McKinsey consultants many of my former students from Sciences Po is terrible!"
“A situation of generalized war”

In this same interview after the first round of the Presidential elections where Yannick Jadot obtained 4,5% of the votes, Bruno Latour acknowledged "that it is difficult for someone who has written about potential hegemony, at the national or world level, of the ecological class to end up at 4,5%". He added to explain this situation: "Today we find ourselves in a multitude of wars for land, the one that Putin is waging in Ukraine, but also extractivism, the different forms of colonization. We therefore find ourselves in a situation of generalized war, but whose fronts are not stabilized. This means that each of us finds himself in the paradoxical situation of being mobilized, in the sense that we are aware of the threats, but nevertheless immobilized".

To shed light on the way in this destabilizing world, it is urgent to read, reread and listen to Bruno Latour, whose thought will survive him all the more because it helps to convey another story of this period that is deliquescent at first sight. This is what Arte offers for example.

Opposed to collapsologists, Bruno Latour advocated the awareness of an "apocalypse which shows that faced with a given situation, we must abandon false hopes to start a positive story again by noting that there is plenty of room for maneuver, innovations too, In short, to say: no, the Earth is not going to disappear, neither are humans. We have to get to work!"


https://www.novethic.fr/actualite/envir ... 51102.html
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by J-Pierre » 11/10/22, 14:54

In physics, all work produces heat. But the economy forces humanity to work (sometimes as slaves) to earn an income that "must allow to live" and this forced labor warms the planet. This exploitation of the earth, not for the just necessary, but above all to gobble up a capital that is constantly growing, always asking for more, to feed the ever more, such as the obese who feeds ever more his bodily over-growth (see the link "the just necessary").
Global warming and the fever that announces more severe evils to come.
The economic system is based on the return on capital, it is the problem of the leaky bathtub (in dividends and interest) and to maintain the level, we produce surplus value, except that the bathtub leaks more and more and that the water which must bathe humanity decreases (growth) and obliges to seek surplus value green (electric car, wind fan, etc... energy saving).
Until governments kill capitalism in favor of a “non-growing” and recycling economy, the world will implode thanks to Putin or someone else.
Humanity must impose a real democracy "over the whole planet" if it wants to live and perpetuate itself, because we see that a dictatorship (not neutralized) can endanger the living conditions of billions of humans. Any undemocratic power, whether political, religious or financial, is a danger, proportional to the weight of this power, which must be stopped, out of respect for those who are its victims.
The governments are not ready to change this economy, where capitalism does not want to give in despite the strikes (and this for centuries), the economy must be stopped until the governments (or environmentalists) rethink it globally, be crazier than the madness of the economy.
It is a bet where humanity risks its life.
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by Exnihiloest » 11/10/22, 19:04

J-Pierre wrote:In physics, all work produces heat. But the economy forces humanity to work (sometimes as slaves) to earn an income that "must allow to live"and this obligatory work warms the planet...

How much energy is consumed globally, compared to the energy received from the sun?!

Global warming has nothing to do with the heat equivalent of the energy consumed, but with the greenhouse effect.

We do not take the pretext of a manifestly misunderstood science, to make ideological propaganda and prophecies à la Nostradamus.
Moreover, it's cool, capitalism, in fact, there's no better.

Humanity must impose a true democracy...

When you impose, it is no longer a democracy! The worst environmentalists have moreover shamelessly warned that democracies being incapable according to them of putting in place the measures which are essential in their eyes, it is necessary instead a strong power emanating from their doctrine and decisions of " expert".
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by J-Pierre » 11/10/22, 20:30

"Exnihiloest""In physics, all work produces heat."It's an image that I used. But the 5km3 of oil that has been burned every year since the end of the 20th century produces not only CO2, but also the 11.400 billion dollars in dividends in 10 years thanks or because labor (part of global warming) and overconsumption maintained by companies and complicit states Democracy exists as long as it does not upset the economy, does not harm capital and allows countries to remain in economic competition But depending on the country, 10 to 50% of the populations are poor and under the dictatorship hunger, and are still waiting for a gesture from the democracies.
When striking refinery workers can decide with shareholders about employee and shareholder incomes, they will have a taste of democracy.
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by Exnihiloest » 11/10/22, 21:13

J-Pierre wrote:"Exnihiloest""In physics, all work produces heat."This is an image I used.

A misleading image, because on earth it is only 0,1% of the thermal energy received from the sun, so it is negligible heat.

But the 5km3 of oil that have been burned every year since the end of the 20th century produce not only CO2, but also 11.400 billion dollars in dividends in 10 years thanks to or because of work (part of global warming) and overconsumption maintained by corporations and complicit states. Democracy exists as long as it does not upset the economy, does not harm capital and allows countries to remain in economic competition. But depending on the country, 10 to 50% of the populations are poor and under the dictatorship hunger, and are still waiting for a gesture from the democracies.
When striking refinery workers can decide with shareholders about employee and shareholder incomes, they will have a taste of democracy.

First of all, the past forecasts of the IPCC over 5 years have turned out to be overestimated by two or three times compared to the observations. The models are unreliable, certainly unable to predict the temperature in 20 or 30 years.
Environmentalism is a science, but 99,99% of those who claim it are political activists, not scientists, they know nothing about it and use all this alarmism as a pretext because it serves their political discourse.

On the other hand, fortunately, we don't upset the economy, that's what makes us live, and to give it up for climatic reasons is to commit suicide right away for fear of a very hypothetical future apocalypse, that doesn't makes no sense.

Then it is not because there are poor populations, moreover less and less, that scuttling the economy will feed them. : roll: There have always been famines in Africa before capitalism, and today much less.

When supermarket cashiers are on strike, there is not the impact of a strike in the refineries. The effect of a strike is unequal, there are profiteers, and there we see less expression of the champions of anti-capitalism. The striking refinery workers take advantage of their situation, taking the rest of the French hostage. It's pathetic, as if we don't already have enough problems right now. Among Exxonmobile workers, employees, technicians and supervisors, “their guaranteed minimum annual remuneration is €25.000 gross per year, without bonuses; the average is around €40.000 gross, all premiums included", at Total it's kif-kif, so nothing to complain about.

Wage earners make capitalism live, and profit from it. If they were not satisfied, they would go elsewhere, as all migrants from less favored countries do. And the consumers who are often also the employees, also benefit from it, no one puts the gun to their head to buy the products of capitalism, they would even like to be able to buy a lot more. You also encourage them to do so by asking them to have a say in their salaries, and we suspect that they would not see them lowered.
Everyone walks in capitalism because it is in their interest, and it is a chance to have it since no other economic system has shown that it is better. On the contrary, not only were the alternatives bad and therefore did not last, but they had to be imposed by force, like communism. Capitalism is the natural economic organization that is established when people are left free, therefore in democracies, which only regulate it. It is not a political system.
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by GuyGadeboisTheBack » 11/10/22, 22:36

Exnihiloest wrote:A misleading image, because on earth it is only 0,1% of the thermal energy received from the sun, so it is negligible heat.

In absolute value, it is far from being "negligible" and I remind you that without this 0,1%, there would be no life on earth.
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by izentrop » 12/10/22, 01:38

J-Pierre wrote:In physics, all work produces heat. But the economy forces humanity to work (sometimes as slaves) to earn an income that "must allow to live"and this forced labor warms the planet.
Work, until before the industrial era, except excessive use of fire, did not warm the planet.
What heats it up, as Exni rightly pointed out (then he completely went off the rails as usual), are greenhouse gases, but he forgot to add that it is through the excessive combustion of " fossil fuels" releasing CO2, a very stable gas in the atmosphere, which, as Janco said, will take a very long time to dissipate.
There is also methane, a greenhouse gas warms the planet 300 times more than CO2 , whose recent releases will probably have a significant impact...
J-Pierre wrote:glut a capital that continues to grow, always asking for more, to feed the always more
simplistic vision, everyone owning a car, a house is capitalist, it is rather the value of money which is more and more fictitious.
Exnihiloest wrote:Humanity must impose a true democracy...
When you impose, it is no longer a democracy!
True, at the same time with the rise of extremes and nationalists as in Italy and everywhere in the world, we are far from taking the path.
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Re: Bruno Latour: the current economy will lead the world to ruin ... and he is right!




by Exnihiloest » 13/10/22, 19:10

izentrop wrote:...
Which warms her up, as Exni rightly pointed out (then he completely went off the rails as usual),

To derail, that remains to be demonstrated, and I think that you are not able to do it.

these are greenhouse gases, but he forgot to add that it is through the excessive combustion of "fossil fuels" releasing CO2, a very stable gas in the atmosphere, which, as Janco has rightly said, will take a very long time to dissipate.
...

I have not forgotten what is claimed everywhere. I only avoid the truisms, to seize it gives pleasure to the less well off intellectually. 8)
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