Microemulsion

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abyssin3
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Microemulsion




by abyssin3 » 04/10/06, 14:16

I just saw a post that I had forgotten about olio, but which was not very successful despite some particularly interesting results:
http://oliomobile.org/forum/viewsujet.p ... 8b16a8f0cc

It consists in making a HVB / ethanol microemulsion (85 / 15)

This started from an idea of ​​remaking a stable GO / water emulsion (90/10) to make a "homemade aquazole". Satisfactory but dangerous experience for the injection pump (water :!: ).

The idea has deviated in microemulsion with butanol in HVB, whose suspended particles are not visible, so that the mixture becomes clear (see post) if I understand correctly.

What I just saw is interesting: a person tried this time a micro emulsion HVB / ethanol (85 / 15), ie the proportions that I used when I tried to make biodiesel in homeopathic dose ( without success). But there, he stirred and then passed in the microwave. His solution ends up becoming limp and golden, and stable over time.

Trials very soon. Thank you for telling me what you think :P
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by bob_isat » 04/10/06, 17:02

Hello

it's funny because that's what we're trying to do right now in "transesterification"!

http://oliomobile.org/forum/viewsujet.php?t=8114

small precision: we brew 95 ° (NO CATALYST) oil and alcohol and we get a less viscous 40% fuel, which burns better (almost more smell).

I will say even more, nickel operation to:

100% on indirect injection tuture (without modifications)

60% on direct injection (without modifications)

We who thought that the drop in visco was due to esterification ... not at all! if the product is left in the open for a long time, it returns to its original visco.

http://www.oliomobile.org/forum/viewsujet.php?t=8092

so it's just a micro emulsion! as you did in 2005!

we will continue in this way!

come on!
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by abyssin3 » 04/10/06, 17:32

bob_isat wrote:if the product is left in the open for a long time, it returns to its original visco.


Interesting, but then the presence of water would stabilize the emulsion in the end or not? I did not understand everything about that.
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by bob_isat » 04/10/06, 18:11

no no

the emulsion is stable with 4% ethanol max, the surplus is out of phase.

to be able to put more, one must add a surfactants.

among those possible: butanol (successfully tested on olio but petrochemical ...), sorbitan sesquiolate, glycerol monooleate

(These 2 being organic, the problem is to find a supplier to do the tests!)
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by elephant » 04/10/06, 18:33

and can it work with methanol?
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by Christophe » 04/10/06, 18:36

elephant wrote:and can it work with methanol?


Uh ... what interest? methanol is a petroleum product ...
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by delnoram » 04/10/06, 21:00

Christophe wrote:
elephant wrote:and can it work with methanol?


Uh ... what interest? methanol is a petroleum product ...


You're sure, I took a look at the Universalis, they do not talk about it, on the other hand it is also done with wood, elephant may be his small craft production : Cheesy:
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by Other » 05/10/06, 03:33

Hello
bob_isat wrote:no no

the emulsion is stable with 4% ethanol max, the surplus is out of phase.

to be able to put more, one must add a surfactants.

among those possible: butanol (successfully tested on olio but petrochemical ...), sorbitan sesquiolate, glycerol monooleate

(These 2 being organic, the problem is to find a supplier to do the tests!)


Last week, following your tests, I made a mix of 99% alcohol and peanut oil at a dose of 20% alcohol. It mixes well, once stirred, it becomes whitish at first and the next day. oil becomes lighter gilded yellow like engine oil it remains on the surface a transparent layer alccol, I separated the surface alccol and pass the oil in the tank.
The question that I ask myself is the 4% if one exceeds it and that one raises the surplus it returns to the same thing as if one had made an exact dosage?
Why the engine would not be able to take more, if it is well brewed in the loopback circuit.
If this mixture is better for the combustion chamber of the engine it becomes interesting, I will consider a sytéme to inject into the loop on the alcohol will always be mixed,
When I tested explosion engines with pure alcohol they became clean as if the alcohol had a cleaning property.

Now you have to heat this oil in a recipian it petrifies as if it had water, what will happen in the heater at 70c? I know that I had problems when I forced the dose with 15% gasoline in the oil when the heat sink climbed higher than 70c in the traffic the idling engine starts to make mistakes and vibrates .. rolling fast this is taking place, I concluded to lock vapors in the loopback circuit ..
Anyway it's a small problem easy to adjust just increase the flow in the loop ..

Andre
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by abyssin3 » 05/10/06, 13:38

Andrew wrote:The question that I ask myself is the 4% if one exceeds it and that one raises the surplus it returns to the same thing as if one had made an exact dosage?

Indeed, it amounts to saturating the oil with alcohol. And this saturation value is globally constant.

I tried to mix alcohol and rapeseed oil (~ 15% alcohol). It did not give anything. Oil and alcohol separate automatically.
What did you use as alcohol (ethanol or isopropanol?) Because I heard that isopropanol, which dilutes perfectly with oil is more used on your continent.
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by bob_isat » 05/10/06, 14:08

Andre wrote:
Last week, following your tests, I made a mix of 99% alcohol and peanut oil at a dose of 20% alcohol. It mixes well, once stirred, it becomes whitish at first and the next day. oil becomes lighter gilded yellow like engine oil it remains on the surface a transparent layer alccol, I separated the surface alccol and pass the oil in the tank.
The question that I ask myself is the 4% if one exceeds it and that one raises the surplus it returns to the same thing as if one had made an exact dosage?
Andre


exactly! (4% is for 95 ° theoretically less water and you can put alcohol ...)

Andre wrote:
Why the engine would not be able to take more, if it is well brewed in the loopback circuit.
Andre


it's a microemulsion ... maybe by stirring constantly you can hold it longer.

note also that it holds better if it is made hot.


Andre wrote:
If this mixture is better for the combustion chamber of the engine it becomes interesting, I will consider a sytéme to inject into the loop on the alcohol will always be mixed,
When I tested explosion engines with pure alcohol they became clean as if the alcohol had a cleaning property.

Now you have to heat this oil in a recipian it petrifies as if it had water, what will happen in the heater at 70c?

Andre


ethanol boils at 78 ° c ...

there are 2 factors that can cause 2 to separate:

humidity + cold

-the hot

Andre wrote:
I know that I had problems when I forced the dose with 15% gasoline in the oil when the heat sink climbed higher than 70c in the traffic the idling engine starts to make mistakes and vibrates .. rolling fast this is taking place, I concluded to lock vapors in the loopback circuit ..

Andre


this is the principle of the micro emulsion:

when it is injected into the cylinders, ethanol suddenly passes into the gas phase. this micro explosion fragments the drops of oil into smaller drops that burn better.

(I did not invent it, it is explained in this patent of the school of mining nantes (emulsion water-alcohol-grease animal-surfactant like fuel):

http://v3.espacenet.com/origdoc?DB=EPOD ... =FR2875810

(8 and 9 page for the micro explosion)
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