"Regulator" or "variator" lever ...

Tips, advice and tips to lower your consumption, processes or inventions as unconventional engines: the Stirling engine, for example. Patents improving combustion: water injection plasma treatment, ionization of the fuel or oxidizer.
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by buga » 30/04/07, 07:25

hahaha
thank you citro ...
I had two c4s of 29 and 32, and like most cars of those years, the advance was adjustable from the dashboard ....

But..

I was not talking about adjusting "advance" with this system ..
well, not only ....

because on my deuche, I see another possibility, by letting the case pivot freely, and a bike cable, controlled from the dashboard ...; easy in my opinion ....


this system would be intended to regulate various things proportionally,
for the benefit of all here,
whether it is steam for a "steam boost",
whether it's various inputs or outputs for a pantone,
or other applications where a variation depending on the engine speed could prove to be very interesting ....


the delay of which I spoke is a "possible" delay of reaction of the system, if necessary ...

I try to think of possibilities of application for the maximum of kinds of tests, experiments ...

So I think in a "certain time" to build me this kind of regulator, in the simplest way, with if possible easily accessible parts in the trade, then you put the diagram on this site ....
if however it works as I hope ....
but there are also other unknowns;
-the power developed at the output lever, depending on the weight of the balls.
(a compensation spring can however be provided if the system to be adjusted requires more power for its movement)
-and especially the size of the system which must be vertical, as well as its location in a modern engine ...
I have enough space ....

I will therefore have to try to design something small, but "kostô" ...

if anyone has any other idea than the ball regulator ???
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by I Citro » 30/04/07, 15:11

:D No Buga, I was thinking like you about regulating pantone or doping and not just about ignition.

Ah the C4 ... I couldn't resuscitate my grandfather's 1933 "Rosalie", sniff. : Cry:

That said, I am firmly convinced that the "simplest" remains electronic regulation. It alone solves the issues of size and compatibility with many vehicles. It remains to develop the assembly (hardware) and the management logic (software). This is how secondary LPG installations work.
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by buga » 30/04/07, 15:31

yes ... although I don't like electronics at all, except when it is absolutely inevitable (like a computer for the internet ....)
an electronic management unit would undoubtedly be more efficient and less cumbersome ...
because would react to a hundredth of a second, unlike watt balls ...
poor man, with bulky balls ... : Lol:

but...

(happy family, I'm laughing)
a ball system (and not a film of balls)
certainly is;
1) easier to build
2) easier to adjust (simple lever system with several holes, then a bicycle brake cable with possible return spring;) each depending on his car;
3) accessible to any handyman
4) ridiculous manufacturing price
5) cannot fail if it is maintained ...
6) do not give us dependence on electronics or electricity ....
so, if you want to build one or more for the modern cars that are so much to complain about, it's so difficult to work on : Lol:
(humor)
please, it will be of service to a lot of people, since there are far fewer bugs than modern cars ...
but personal, my preference always goes to "mechanics", in "metal" of course, which is always repairable ....
if someone talks to me about plastic, I poop on my keyboard ....
okay ??? :P
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by Eloi » 13/05/07, 10:58

While reading this topic, I had an idea that you may have already had and perhaps missed:
It is a linear motor (a coil drives an axis in translation and thus acts as a jack). the coil would be powered by:
- the current supplying the tachometer (proportional to the engine speed) or the current produced by the alternator
-current flowing through rheostats (variable resistors) supplied by the battery and controlled by various organs, for example the rheostat connected to the accelerator pedal, another to the choke (why not) etc

All this is of course only theoretical. I do not pretend to be able to develop this, I think that all the currents feeding the linear motor must be of the same order of magnitude.

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by I Citro » 13/05/07, 15:36

Eloi wrote:While reading this subject, I had an idea that you probably already had and perhaps dismissed:
It is a linear motor (a coil drives an axis in translation and thus acts as a jack).
The idle control valves (RER valve) work this way. They are mounted on all injection engines fitted with throttle body with cable control, we also mentioned the servo motors used in radio model making.
the coil would be powered by:
- the current supplying the tachometer (proportional to the engine speed) or the current produced by the alternator
The rev counter receives:
- Signals from a hall effect sensor (TDC sensor),
OU
- The coil current (this tends to disappear)
-current flowing through rheostats (variable resistors) supplied by the battery and controlled by various organs, for example the rheostat connected to the accelerator pedal, another to the choke (why not) etc
There we are in a Pantone management calculator logic just like in LPG when the special LPG calculator manages the LPG carburation.
All this is of course only theoretical. I do not pretend to be able to develop this, I think that all the currents feeding the linear motor must be of the same order of magnitude.

Eloi
The currents supplying linear motors are of different shapes and the currents you want to use to control these motors are of different shapes. :|
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by Eloi » 13/05/07, 17:32

Well well well ...
I see that I should have read this subject other than diagonally before posting.
in my opinion if we want the lever to be actuated by several parameters, we can already exclude mechanical systems.
Electronic systems are not too popular for Buga.
There are still pneumatic or hydraulic systems.
imagine that the lever is actuated by a pneumatic cylinder which is fed by under a constant flow (complicated to realize) but it is better to look at the drawing that I made it is a little more speaking than words.

Image

Basically the engine speed and the accelerator pedal operate valves.
If these valves close the flow is decreased and the pressure increases and pushes the piston of the cylinder.
If, on the other hand, the valves open, the pressure decreases in the cylinder and the return spring pushes the piston in the opposite direction.

Is it more convincing than the electronic system?

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by Former Oceano » 13/05/07, 21:47

Hello, given the size of your drawing, it does not fit on the screen which is annoying for reading the forum. You should reduce its size so that it fits on the screen, like 800x600 max.
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by Eloi » 13/05/07, 21:57

that's done

Eloi
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by buga » 14/05/07, 12:13

well...
pretty happy i am that someone has my ideas interested ....
hahaha

I have known for years that many mechanical systems have been invented in the auto field ... thousands ...
generally artisanal, they only experienced development if they were of interest to "big manufacturers" ....
look at the current tightness of the engines ... segments ... valves ...
the current performance of all these things born before the birth of the automobile ...

it is easier and cheaper now to lay a large box full of probes, wires, computers etc ...
therefore, manufacturers no longer bother to design simpler systems ...
I remain convinced that almost EVERYTHING found in an automobile is mechanically achievable ....
no doubt I have a little narrow view, more fond of old cars than recent ....
but good god ...
systems of levers, that exists since antiquity ...
combinations of levers proportional to what you want, it exists .....
springs, it exists .... joints, it exists ....
I therefore find that at the level of experimentation in the fields which occupy us, it would be easier, more reliable, to tinker each with its small system of levers, of watt balls, of tank at constant level,
that to wait that the electronics "us" provide something efficient, which does not break down, and is versatile, allows changes during experimentation .....
change of force, lever, etc ...
only mechanical systems (or even simply electrical) allow this "easily" ...
here is...
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by Eloi » 14/05/07, 17:53

I understand your vision of things: If we start from nothing it is easier to realize exclusively mechanical systems.
But by doing a little recovery we can easily find pneumatic cylinders or even electronic gadgets.
That said, these are still less reliable and then less elegant too.
In fact, since I don't know how to weld, I tend to turn to solderless solutions, that's why I bypass mechanical solutions.
I can see myself turning the spare wheel of my 104 (which is under the hood) to make room for a pair of Watt's balls and a few linkages and other levers.

In fact, if your ball regulator is too massive it will play the role of a flywheel for your engine and may decrease performance. In addition, it will stir air unless you lock it in a housing (which is also good for your safety).
Oops ... there I have a doubt, I'm not sure that a casing will reduce friction.

Eloi
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