My kitchen garden of the least effort

[Did67]

for the rest, there have been much better days, I will try to follow you, but I will make myself more rare in my participations, I have another more vital fight to lead, I start the cures Monday, at a rate of 'once every 4 days, suddenly I started reading the Palme, it educates during the waiting hours ...

All my support ...

And I see in reading the Palme as a sign: "a vegetable garden in the heart of winter", it can also be read "life when conditions are difficult"!

[Biobomb]

I gave tomato plants to my neighbor, they were beautiful plants, and at her place, things are not going well, the plants are stunted, have partly caught the mildew or something else.

I'm joking. but maybe you had to plant them yourself.
What does your neighbor think of the way you manage your garden? She is not tempted or even convinced?
As I also give plants to others, they are always great, and the result is very often like your neighbor's. People do not understand what we are doing and why, hay and not working the soil or at least are suspect in their eyes!
Many vegetable gardeners here come from farming families and always have tons of fertilizer available. A handful of that, another of this, wheelbarrows of fresh manure sure don't hurt, I hear that often. And since they use and abuse copper sulphate they do not understand that their tomatoes are sick soon after they are planted. Their gardens are invaded by unwanted weeds that they do not know how to eradicate because they are nevertheless wary of cans of herbicides.

[Doris]

in some places with several years in a row of legumes in the same place

Don't you practice crop rotation? With legumes, don't you fear an excess of nitrogen? Or an exhaustion of something else?

Yes, I do the rotation, I misspoke: the same place means on my original vegetable garden, which was only 30 or 35m2. On this old part I had been rotating the legumes for several years, plus last winter in two places that were still poorly fertilized, a bean cure. So same place means my original vegetable garden. Regarding the excess nitrogen, in my sandy soil and of poor origin, the risk is very small (relying only on legumes, of course)

[Doris]

What does your neighbor think of the way you manage your garden? She is not tempted or even convinced?
As I also give plants to others, they are always great, and the result is very often like your neighbor's. People do not understand what we are doing and why, hay and not working the soil or at least are suspect in their eyes!

Yes, it has changed a bit, but it takes time. Already she no longer abuses Bordeaux mixture, that's a good point.

[Did67]

Regarding the excess nitrogen, in my sandy soil and of poor origin, the risk is very small (relying only on legumes, of course)

Be careful with leaching over time: these are soils that mineralize faster (lighter, warmer, more aerated). So the more so-called stable OM you have, the more the 2% that will mineralize, which could be 2,5%, will make significant amounts of leachable mineral nitrogen ... You can exceed what the vegetables absorb. Find you with significant leftovers in the fall, which, if you do not sponge, slip into the water tables.

I think that for your autumn-winter, you have to think more and more about "nitrophilous plants": chickweed, plantains, phacelia ...

[Moindreffor]

in some places with several years in a row of legumes in the same place

Don't you practice crop rotation? With legumes, don't you fear an excess of nitrogen? Or an exhaustion of something else?

No, that was the point of my remark, we must stop believing that legumes produce vegetables and fertilize the soil, for me the legume can bring nitrogen back into the soil, but for that it struggles a little and therefore the harvest is not at the top, it is one or the other

and like me I prefer a good harvest, I prefer to feed my legumes well, which will then refrain from storing nitrogen so no risk of excess

after what is an excess of nitrogen? too fertile ground?

[Moindreffor]

for the rest, there have been much better days, I will try to follow you, but I will make myself more rare in my participations, I have another more vital fight to lead, I start the cures Monday, at a rate of 'once every 4 days, suddenly I started reading the Palme, it educates during the waiting hours ...

All my support ...

And I see in reading the Palme as a sign: "a vegetable garden in the heart of winter", it can also be read "life when conditions are difficult"!

when life is easy, you take it easy, and therefore you do not ask yourself questions, things work, it is in difficulty that you have to be able to think, to share, to be united

in any case, the Palme and the Coleman on the subject of winter crops are very enriching, but not only in winter, because they tackle much broader subjects which can give food for thought and therefore adapt our practices over a period of time. much wider than winter

[Biobomb]

after what is an excess of nitrogen? too fertile ground?

No, I don't think so, but above all an increased potential for pollution of the water table by nitrates.
I would have to find what Didier wrote, there is already some time and elsewhere than on this forum, on legumes and their propensity to fix nitrogen, it is highly interesting and informative. And if he allows it I will publish it here without modifying anything.

[Did67]

after what is an excess of nitrogen? too fertile ground?

For my part, this term (or the expression I often use: "overdose" - nitrogen is a bit of a dope of the gardener, well of the vegetable patch from the gardener's point of view), in fact covers two things:

a) during the period of vegetable growth, an excess of mineral nitrogen soluble in the soil solution, which results in exaggerated vegetative growth (to the eye: often dark green to bluish colors - of course to be put into perspective according to species and varieties). This exaggerated growth is linked to two things (at least): a growth / development imbalance (therefore less fruit set, in fruit vegetables) AND a greater sensitivity to diseases, due to too fragile tissues, 'a too strong attractiveness for certain suckers-stingers (in search of nitrogenous nutrients and which "know" how to detect plants having this richness; aphids "drip" the plants!

[It is also often linked to a lower quality: antioxidants, flavors, vitamins, minerals are in fact "diluted" in a larger volume of biomass!]

[I do not distinguish the "chemical" or "organic" origin of the overdose: in my opinion, although the "organic" more often use complex and organic fertilizers, which de facto relativizes the overdose, dilutes it over time, an excess of organic nitrates has nothing to envy to an excess of chemical nitrates. The "organic" too often has a good back! "Shut up, it's organic" should replace the famous "Eat, it's organic" of sore meals]

b) at the end of the season, these residues of mineral nitrogen, especially nitrates (or ammonium likely to be further nitrified): this will be linked to the risk of leaching; it is not a question of "production" of the vegetable garden; it is an ethical question: can we criticize farmers and do just as badly, or even worse? (the farmers have nitrogen fertilization plans which take into account the residues!).

The excess nitrogen is therefore not to be taken in absolute terms. The nitrogen contained in organic matter is not in question (it is about tons of N per ha !!!). We should always say "excess of directly assimilable mineral nitrogen". This is the one vegetables can gorge on. And it is that one, and that one only, that can be washed away.

[Did67]

No, I don't think so, but above all an increased potential for pollution of the water table by nitrates.
I would have to find what Didier wrote, there is already some time and elsewhere than on this forum, on legumes and their propensity to fix nitrogen, it is highly interesting and informative. And if he allows it I will publish it here without modifying anything.

I was writing while you were posting ... As I am long, I get doubled!

But there.