Croquettes, butts and corvids ...

Agriculture and soil. Pollution control, soil remediation, humus and new agricultural techniques.
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Grelinette
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Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by Grelinette » 12/09/18, 15:31

It's a new project that can fit into several themes,
but maybe you need to create a new theme: feather econology
: Cheesy:


The corvids form a large family of birds (crows, crows, magpies, jays, ..., 130 species) to which we attribute an intelligence clearly above average (that of passerines, but not only ...).

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Corvids have a great ability to adapt to their environment and amazing learning skills: they know how to use objects as tools, to fabricate them from scratch, and understand how to operate complex mechanical systems which gives them a reward when they are there. arrive, which presents a playful aspect or which pleases the trainer with whom the corvid has an emotional bond: they are birds who have not only a bird's brains and a great memory! (corvid video Some even know how to use cars to crush nuts!)

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This explains their proliferation in our cities and countryside, but also classifies this species in the category of "pests" and are cruelly exterminated in certain regions.

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Among the large family of corvids, it is the Floor that interests me, the one we call the chatter, Talkative or even thief.

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The project consists in repeating the experience made at the Puy du Fou leisure park, presented in the article of moinsdewatt (which I thank in passing for this original information).

This involves designing an automatic magpie feeder that will deliver a reward (a cat kibble) in exchange for human-made litter that the magpie will have found in its environment and then deposited in the kibble feeder. According to the experiment made at Puy du Fou, it would take less than 1 hour for corvids to fill 1 bucket with various butts and litter!


Lately I have participated in actions to "clean up" public places (picking up waste thrown on the ground (I talked about it here), and the problem of micro-waste, in particular cigarette butts (which would be the first waste in the world) is a much more serious scourge than it seems: 4500 billion cigarette butts a year abandoned on Earth (72 billion in France), 2/3 of which end up in the wild, in rivers, then in the sea. Knowing that a cigarette butt pollutes up to 500 liters of water and that it takes 12 years on average for a cigarette butt to decompose… you imagine the disaster!

These are, as Nicolas Hullot said when announcing his resignation as Minister of Ecology by evoking the gesture of throwing a cigarette butt on the ground, micro-pollution that destroys the planet and suffocates us but which we “s 'accommodates'.

So much for the slightly shiny decor!

In parallel with this observation, and to return to more pleasant things, all summer I had the visit of magpies. They entered my veranda to work the kibble in the cat bowls. They passed through the door or a half-open window, another time through the cat flap or a small ventilation.
Magpies have a very opportunistic behavior and quickly find the fault to access the kibbles of cats which they love. Most often they leave where they entered but sometimes panic, some do not know where to go out and I had to catch them to put them outside ... until the next day.

I put a bowl in the garden with some kibble: the magpies took only a few minutes to spot it and empty it. Then I put a lid on the bowl, which did not present any difficulty for them, even with a pebble on the lid. Little by little I have complicated the task of the magpies so that they reach the kibble: they always end up finding the trick.

corvidae pie reflection.jpg
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I also noticed a funny phenomenon: while I prepare for them a new test of croquette to pilfer, the magpies remain perched in the trees of the surroundings while chattering noisily, then arrive as soon as I move away as if they take the game to thwart each new test: they pose and observe the new device by making head movements all around the system, then they start to search for the solution with great pecks!
Another interesting detail: some magpies have made their dormitory in a large oak tree next to the place where they can find food and they come to sleep there every night. So they now have room and board. It bodes well for the rest of the experiment…

The objective is to put the croquettes in a more subtle dispenser which will require a special action from the magpie such as pressing a tab, lifting a lid, opening a drawer or tilting a container…
So I will start by doing the comparative test of the different systems that corvids know how to handle to reach the kibbles (press a tab, lift a lid, open a drawer, tilt a container, ...) in order to find the most intuitive for them.

Then, but it will be another pair of wings, it will be necessary to design the mechanical system which delivers the reward only if there is a small detritus posed as an exchange, then find a way to make greedy and mischievous magpies understand what '' we expect them to: 1 litter brought back = 1 kibble. The deal seems fair to me!

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These birds also having the ability to observe and imitate a congener, it is likely that as soon as one of them has understood the feeding technique, the others will quickly learn to get the tasty kibble from the distributor. exchange of micro-trash…
The risk, as explained to me by a corvid specialist, is that magpies will bring everything they find around, from the clothes pin to table cutlery via the car keys of my neighbors : Cheesy: : this will be an opportunity to organize meetings over a drink to return everyone's goods!

Example of corvid collection (source of info)
Corneilles.jpg collection
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In short, I give a little wing shot to the comment of moinsdewatt, and I take the pen to submit this new project idea to you so that I can peck in the suggestions that rare birds and other migrants coming to land here will have generously put in the nesting box incubator for ideas that represents the econology site…

I will try to take photos and keep you informed of the progress of this experience and the results obtained with the magpies from my garden.

If there are among you handymen of any hair, any hair, and any feather, or simply if you have ideas, in particular on the system of distributor which releases a kibble in exchange for a micro-waste (of some grams), you can lay them here ...



Note that this project is just experimental: it goes without saying that it is not the corvids, even with their superior intelligence, which will regulate the behavioral drifts of men and stop pollution on our planet.
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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by phil53 » 12/09/18, 16:30

Superb idea, I knew the demonstration of the Puy du Fou but did not know if it took so little time for the
learning.
From a practical point of view I would go on an electromechanical system with detection of waste by a camera.
It was little overpriced, but not anymore.
The advantage is that the same sensor can accept several types of small waste and why not modulate the reward to see if the magpies react.
For learning, put the chosen waste close to detection, the birds may be the link.
Then move the waste away, to finally put more.
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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by fl78960 » 12/09/18, 16:37

Hello,

that seems to me a very fun idea, especially since I already have magpies squatting a tree in the garden, but ...

like discerning a cigarette butt, an "unnatural" waste from any plant debris?
is this not going to increase the number of magpies in my garden (it's not my favorite bird)?
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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by Christophe » 12/09/18, 21:24

Just about the intelligence of corvids ... this "old" video has always fascinated me:



And to think that we still say "Bird's brain" ...
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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by Did67 » 12/09/18, 22:25

Grelinette wrote:[b] 4500 billion cigarette butts a year abandoned on Earth (72 billion in France), 2/3 of which end up in the wild, in rivers, then in the sea.


Uh .... Cigarette consumption has fallen to around 53 or 54 billion per year in France. And I still know a number of smokers who “harvest” their butts. Without doubt the majority, it seems to me ... Well, maybe?

That said, the idea remains good.

But I don't like people faking the figures, even for good causes.
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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by Ahmed » 12/09/18, 22:42

Grelinette, you write:
Note that this project is just experimental: it goes without saying that it is not the corvids, even with their superior intelligence, which will regulate the behavioral drifts of men and stop pollution on our planet.

Two remarks. A minor: by providing a solution to negligent behavior, this does not encourage their authors to change ...
More important: the "behavioral drifts of men" are in no way the cause of the pollution and the destruction of living conditions on Earth, but of the determinisms which escape them, which in no way makes explicit a simplistic moral judgment (and there , of course, I'm not talking about butts!).
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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by moinsdewatt » 13/09/18, 08:27

Thanks to Grelinette for this thread.
Keep us posted on these ethnological experiences and observations.
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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by moinsdewatt » 13/09/18, 08:31

A crow annoys a dog:
Video
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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by moinsdewatt » 13/09/18, 08:36

And here a raven that feeds dog and cat food!
Video

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Re: Croquettes, butts and corvids ...




by Grelinette » 13/09/18, 10:54

Did67 wrote:
Grelinette wrote:[b] 4500 billion cigarette butts a year abandoned on Earth (72 billion in France), 2/3 of which end up in the wild, in rivers, then in the sea.


Uh .... Cigarette consumption has fallen to around 53 or 54 billion per year in France. And I still know a number of smokers who “harvest” their butts. Without doubt the majority, it seems to me ... Well, maybe?

That said, the idea remains good.

But I don't like people faking the figures, even for good causes.

Many sites give statistics on the consumption of cigarettes in the world, and on the number of butts thrown, starting with this one there (but many other sites give figures on this subject): https://www.planetoscope.com/recyclage- ... a-rue.html
(there is even a wiki page on the subject whose figures are those which I gave although they do not come from wiki)

Admittedly the figures vary according to the study and the site which gives the information but overall the volumes are exorbitant and are in the same orders of magnitude, namely in tens of billions!

I am glad that this subject and this experiment interests you, and I quickly respond to a few comments.
I will give you feedback as soon as I have more information, and I will also try to film the behavior of magpies looking to recover the kibble stashed in the feeder.

phil53 wrote:From a practical point of view I would go on an electromechanical system with detection of waste by a camera.
It was little overpriced, but not anymore.
The advantage is that the same sensor can accept several types of small waste and why not modulate the reward to see if the magpies react.

An electromechanical solution seems to me to be too sophisticated and expensive compared to a simple and economical mechanical system, and above all that anyone can do it themselves if the experiment gives positive results. Of course, after it will be necessary to sort the micro-waste collected (cigarette butts, plastics, metals, wood, etc.) but it would already be good for magpies to adopt the behavior expected of them. At worst, magpies can understand that a simple small pebble can allow them to trigger the system, but it will be the object of the mechanical system to make a rough pre-sorting, a priori with the weight of the waste.

Ahmed wrote:Two remarks. A minor: by providing a solution to negligent behavior, this does not encourage their authors to change ...
More important: the "behavioral drifts of men" are in no way the cause of the pollution and the destruction of living conditions on Earth, but of the determinisms which escape them, which in no way makes explicit a simplistic moral judgment (and there , of course, I'm not talking about butts!).


For your 1st remark, it is recurrent to say that if we provide an answer to correct a problem, we do not attack the cause of the problem; we also make this comment currently for plastics (see the last issue of Cash-Investigation by Elyse Lucet). Certainly, but one does not prevent the other. In my opinion, to date there is an emergency to clean up the environment, which does not exclude also tackling the causes.

For your 2nd remark: given the extent of micro-pollution in public places, in particular that in faculties and public places in which I have been called upon to intervene, I think that "behavioral drifts" respond to multiple complex factors.

It is a pleonasm, but "pollution and destruction of living conditions on Earth" of human origin... is one of the causes of this pollution ... anthropogenic! (Or else I did not quite understand your remark).
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