Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"

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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by Janic » 23/11/20, 19:56

ps: in history I have 1/5 !! That's all !
Me too, 1 in 5 with the virgin, we can understand why! Part comtre an dickter I found 7 fotes. So to read again.
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by Exnihiloest » 23/11/20, 21:19

Christophe wrote:So that's good, do you have a book on the certificate? Cool !

I have lots of them on lots of domains. I even have comics, I can pass you a Marvel occasionally.

Ah ah ah very good idea the events dedicated to girls and boys !!
...

Do you know what a historian is? He is above all a guy who is able to relate the facts of the past and to explain them in their context.
And you know why your answer is the opposite of his science? He knows how to avoid judging history only in moral terms and from plastering the past with interpretive grids that are only valid for the present.
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by izentrop » 23/11/20, 22:40

My engineering degree :P
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by ABC2019 » 24/11/20, 06:52

Janic wrote:
ps: in history I have 1/5 !! That's all !
Me too, 1 in 5 with the virgin, we can understand why! Part comtre an dickter I found 7 fotes. So to read again.

me 4/5, there is just the name of the French competitor king at the start of the 100 Years War which I did not remember, after checking it was Philippe VI. Otherwise Calais, Poitiers, Duguesclin ... I think I would have it anyway :).
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by Janic » 24/11/20, 07:35

me 4/5, there is just the name of the French competitor king at the start of the 100 Years War which I did not remember, after checking it was Philippe VI. Otherwise Calais, Poitiers, Duguesclin ... I think I would have it anyway
The certificate was not limited to history, many over-graduates today would be unable to answer other questions such as dictation and, in my time, 5 mistakes = 0!
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by Rajqawee » 24/11/20, 08:54

Yeah. But hey, I'm not sure that knowing the history of France helps our engineers much (eh, since that's the basic subject!) To build wind turbines or reactors.

What we can clearly see is that the skills / knowledge required, at "the same age" are not at all the same.

Therefore :

Exnihiloest wrote:plating on the past interpretative grids that are only valid for the present.
is actually not very relevant. And vice versa !
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by Christophe » 24/11/20, 09:25

Rajqawee wrote:What we can clearly see is that the skills / knowledge required, at "the same age" are not at all the same.


That's all I wanted to highlight when talking about double integrals ...

Well, the math of the Exni scan is not double integration but it is a level of good student in current 2nd scientific I think ...
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by Rajqawee » 24/11/20, 10:01

Perhaps we misunderstood each other then! It is often possible by forum.

To come back to the initial subject: the problem is not so much that we do not hear a lot of engineers. In fact, you don't hear a lot of specialist in the media most of the time.



A funny video on the subject, but which sums it up well I find: we often invite people on TV (or radio) to "sellers" rather than specialists.
This is the case for any field of expertise, everyone who is an expert in a field has already experienced it (by reading articles or television appearances on the subject in question, it is often .... anything.), and engineers are no exception!

The worst part is that when these media sometimes invite a specialist (notably, an engineer!), I always see the same steps happen:

First, the specialist is put in "confrontation" with a journalist or an "expert" of the media, who he / she does not know much about.
For example, I have in mind a passage from Thomas Porcher who reminds us that he is a doctor of economics, which requires a certain amount of knowledge and diplomas, and therefore that he does not have to comment frankly on the words of 'a Director of Thinktank who is basically nothing. It often makes the specialist pass for someone very condescending, even haughty.
Then the specialist sets out arguments, a view of the subject, which is very often different from popular opinion. Jancovici, for example, is often in this case when he is told things like "renewable is growing!" "Oh well? 80% of the world's energy is fossil." It creates instant cognitive dissent in everyone, including other stakeholders!

And finally, the specialist often adopts a posture which is now rare in the media: he is certain. He states things with precision, and with certainty (rather than our usual followers of sentences that don't mean much, and therefore we can't prove that they are false!), Which we are no longer so used to to have !
I think that in addition, engineers are specialists of specialists in the real world: they integrate into their work both physical constraints, but in addition market constraints, time constraints, etc. They are therefore very "down to earth", which once again, is no longer very fashionable ...
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by ABC2019 » 24/11/20, 12:32

Rajqawee wrote:Then the specialist sets out arguments, a vision of the subject, which is very often different from popular opinion. Jancovici, for example, is often in this case when he is told things like "the renewable is growing!" "Oh well? 80% of the world's energy is fossil." It creates instant cognitive dissent in everyone, including other stakeholders !.

it's a feeling that I get extremely often :)

and then you get turned on by people who hate to be made to give up their illusions, and who call you names in defense.
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Re: Etienne Klein: "Engineers, frankly, we don't hear them much"




by Christophe » 24/11/20, 13:20

Rajqawee wrote:


It's been 20 years since I knew BHL was a big asshole (he edited it again on a show on France2 live a few weeks ago) ... but I didn't know Honfray was an idiot .. : Mrgreen:

French philosophy is definitely doing well !!

In short, very good video!
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