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nlc
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by nlc » 05/04/12, 17:23

dedeleco wrote:JC Chermann and many others after, found the HIV AIDS virus, and solved the "Cornelian choice" proving that this is the cause of AIDS, against Gallo who had found before another virus that was not the right one, mixed with HIV !!!


Ok, how did they prove it?

And I know it has nothing to do with it, but what was your area of ​​research?
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by dedeleco » 05/04/12, 17:35

My area of ​​research, right now, is to teach some stubborn people to read carefully the work of 40 years of research by other highly valued researchers, such as JC Chermann:

dedeleco wrote:JC Chermann and many others after, found the virus HIV AIDS, and solved the "Cornelian choice" by proving that it is the cause of AIDS, against Gallo who had found before another virus which was not the good, mixed with HIV !!!

Instead of holding forth,
Read carefully the book of the man who was the scientific director of the Nobel Prize, as he taught them all, what looked like retroviruses, 10 years before!!

JC Chermann : 45 60 pages and also to the 100 page, so scientifically proven that they persuaded their US competitor with Gallo, very stubborn too, that was wrong with the wrong virus !!
http://www.amazon.fr/Tout-monde-connait ... 2234063752
Everyone should know this story
that stubborn, obstinate in your denial, you refuse to 20 years late !!!!


So start by reading and my field of research has nothing to do with the subject, since I can read, analyze
!!
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by nlc » 05/04/12, 17:40

New dodge, but

dedeleco wrote:So start by reading and my field of research has nothing to do with the subject, since I can read, analyze
!!


Okay, so you say above:


dedeleco wrote:JC Chermann and many others after, found the HIV AIDS virus, and solved the "Cornelian choice" proving that this is the cause of AIDS, against Gallo who had found before another virus that was not the right one, mixed with HIV !!!


He therefore resolved the difficult choice, like the others, and proved, like others, that HIV is the cause of AIDS.

Fine, but how did they prove it? Can you answer this question? Finding a virus does not prove that it is responsible for this or that effect.

So simple question: if they proved the cause and effect link, how did they do it?
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by dedeleco » 05/04/12, 18:03

But damn and damn, read, even written in wkipedia, in a few words !!!

Buy the book !!!

You are going to reproach me again for being copied, pasted !!!
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by nlc » 05/04/12, 18:08

I am not asking you how they found it, but how they prove that it is the cause of AIDS! Where is the scientific study or publication !?
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by Obamot » 05/04/12, 19:12

dedeleco wrote:But damn and damn, read, even written in wkipedia, in a few words !!!

Buy the book !!!

You are going to reproach me again for being copied, pasted !!!


So if you need to copy / paste, you don't know your subject!

Before saying that the others are "negationists" - since you assure us that you have read everything, here is a basic question concerning immunity against viruses - there is one point on which everyone will agree: is the fact that any virus or retro-virus cannot enter a cell whose membrane is impermeable. Simply because in this case, it stays ... outside and therefore can neither infect nor replicate.

I would like to know what your Chermann says about this?
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by dedeleco » 05/04/12, 19:58

I am not asking you how they found it, but how they prove that it is the cause of AIDS! Where is the scientific study or publication !?

Perfectly indistinguishable, especially to convince someone like Gallo or any scientist, and the publications are those of JC Chermann et al ... (the Nobels, or rather, al .... and JC Chermann, the director, p57, " L. Montagnier had never seen a retrovirus "the same for" the buds ... with its microcope "!!, and the discovery is the same, as the fable of La Fontaine, the cat and the monkey, JC Chermann to go out fire chestnuts).

Also read this article and all the references in it especially: ref 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10:
Nature 406, 15-16 (July 6, 2000) | doi: 10.1038 / 35017662
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v406/n6791/full/406015a0.html

also :
Science, vol. 4599, no 220, May 20, 1983, p. 868-71
Barré-Sinoussi F, Chermann JC, Rey F, Nugeyre MT, Chamaret S, Gruest J, Dauguet C, Axler-Blin C, Vézinet-Brun F, Rouzioux C, Rozenbaum W, Montagnier L., "Isolation of a T-lymphotropic retrovirus from a patient at risk for acquired immune deficiency syndrome (AIDS). In Science, vol. 4599, no 220, May 20, 1983, p. 868-71


http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran%C3%A7 ... 9-Sinoussi
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Claude_Chermann

and also Gallo, who did a lot of work and not just rediscover afterwards and mow:
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Gallo

The four papers are,

Popovic M, Sarngadharan MG, Read E, Gallo RC. (May 1984). "Detection, isolation, and continuous production of cytopathic retroviruses (HTLV-III) from patients with AIDS and pre-AIDS". Science 224 (4648): 497–500. doi: 10.1126 / science.6200935. PMID 6200935.
Gallo RC, Salahuddin SZ, Popovic M, Shearer GM, Kaplan M, Haynes BF, Palker TJ, Redfield R, Oleske J, Safai B, et al. (May 1984). "Frequent detection and isolation of cytopathic retroviruses (HTLV-III) from patients with AIDS and at risk for AIDS". Science 224 (4648): 500–3. doi: 10.1126 / science.6200936. PMID 6200936.
Schüpbach J, Popovic M, Gilden RV, Gonda MA, Sarngadharan MG, Gallo RC. (May 1984). "Serological analysis of a subgroup of human T-lymphotropic retroviruses (HTLV-III) associated with AIDS". Science 224 (4648): 503–5. doi: 10.1126 / science.6200937. PMID 6200937.
Sarngadharan MG, Popovic M, Bruch L, Schüpbach J, Gallo RC. (May 1984). "Antibodies reactive with human T-lymphotropic retroviruses (HTLV-III) in the serum of patients with AIDS". Science 224 (4648): 506–8. doi: 10.1126 / science.6324345. PMID 6324345.

dedeleco wrote:But damn and damn, read, even written in wkipedia, in a few words !!!

Buy the book !!!
and read,

You're going to blame me again for being mister the king of the copied, pasted then, that by not reading, you oblige me !!!


The evidence that AIDS is caused by HIV-1 or HIV-2 is clear-cut, exhaustive and unambiguous, meeting the highest standards of science3, 4, 5, 6, 7. The data fulfil exactly the same criteria as for other viral diseases , such as polio, measles and smallpox:

Patients with acquired immune deficiency syndrome, regardless of where they live, are infected with HIV3, 4, 5, 6, 7.
If not treated, most people with HIV infection show signs of AIDS within 5–10 years6, 7. HIV infection is identified in blood by detecting antibodies, gene sequences or viral isolation. These tests are as reliable as any used for detecting other virus infections.
People who receive HIV-contaminated blood or blood products develop AIDS, whereas those who receive untainted or screened blood do not6.
Most children who develop AIDS are born to HIV-infected mothers. The higher the viral load in the mother, the greater the risk of the child becoming infected8.
In the laboratory, HIV infects the exact type of white blood cell (CD4 lymphocytes) that becomes depleted in people with AIDS3, 4, 5.
Drugs that block HIV replication in the test tube also reduce virus load in people and delay progression to AIDS. Where available, treatment has reduced AIDS mortality by more than 80% (ref. 9).
Monkeys inoculated with cloned SIV DNA become infected and develop AIDS10.

Further compelling data are available4. HIV causes AIDS5. It is unfortunate that a few vocal people continue to deny the evidence. This position will cost countless lives.

In different regions of the world, HIV / AIDS can show altered patterns of spread and symptoms. In Africa, for example, people infected with HIV are 11 times more likely to die within five years7, and more than 100 times more likely than uninfected people to develop Kaposi's sarcoma, a cancer linked to yet another virus11.



Montagnier's group, in France isolated HIV, almost one and a half years before Gallo, [18] while Gallo's group demonstrated that the virus causes AIDS and generated much of the science that made the discovery possible, including a technique previously developed by Gallo's lab for growing T cells in the laboratory. [3] When Montagnier's group first published their discovery, they said HIV's role in causing AIDS "remains to be determined." [16]



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by nlc » 06/04/12, 00:28

Oh no, the Durban declaration, please, we leave for 100 pages :?

When the president of South Africa Mbeki also doubting the official hypothesis wanted to meet the orthodoxy of AIDS but also the opponents of the hypothesis it caused an uproar, and our friends of orthodoxy, rather than debate with arguments (which they do not have !?), preferred to launch a petition, yes, you read correctly, a petition, which they made sign to a maximum of world of the scientific field.

This petition was accompanied by this:

Wain Hobson, 2000 wrote:Many of you [whose signature we are seeking] will say that HIV / AIDS is not your specialty. However, since the time this has been talked about, you certainly know enough to understand the relationship between HIV and AIDS "



Each argument (or rather affirmation!?) Dismantled from Durban's declaration: http://www.sidasante.com/science/refutation.htm
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by Obamot » 06/04/12, 01:39

dedeleco wrote:moderate


Now it's clear.

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by Christophe » 06/04/12, 01:41

Moderation !!!
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