Food and hunger: the dead of junk food and malnutrition

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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by Janic » 29/07/18, 13:24

Eating pasta and white bread at all meals is not better if it is not balanced by a consumption of fruits and vegetables.
No need to make it an emotional affair, the equation is simple and repeated before each advertisement: eat everything without excess (especially fat and even slow sugar), a little physical activity and everything is fine
Ideally: yes! In its reality, white bread like pasta was born from the industrialization of flour mills, depleting this product and promoting cardiovascular diseases, of which we see certain current effects. But consuming fruits and vegetables full of chemicals is not much better.
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by yves35 » 29/07/18, 17:23

Hello,

Janic wrote:[Quote
Ideally: yes! In its reality, white bread like pasta was born from the industrialization of flour mills, depleting this product and promoting cardiovascular diseases, of which we see certain current effects. But consuming fruits and vegetables full of chemicals is not much better. [/ Quote]

we deplore it every day ...
http://www.observationsociete.fr/popula ... e-vie.html

yves
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by Janic » 29/07/18, 18:04

we deplore it every day ...
http://www.observationsociete.fr/popula ... e-life.html
a saying says "that it is not enough to give years to life, but to give life to years " and unfortunately it is rather the first part that we see. : Cry:
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by Bardal » 29/07/18, 19:35

Yes finally...

Since the second world war, in a triumphant period for the development of the chemical industry and mechanization, in particular in the agro-food field, we have witnessed a remarkable increase in life expectancy, and even in the duration of life without particular disability; it still seems quite difficult to deny it; this translates as much into significant progress in the period of the most advanced age, but also in accidents and neonatal mortality, in the incidence of childhood illnesses, in the frequency of accidents at work, etc. .

These evolutions seem mainly due to improvements in hygiene conditions, nutrition, life in general, but also to advances in medicine ... Denying all this seems a bit strong to me, even if white bread has not my preference, and if fruits and vegetables look better without chemical swelling.

It would be easy enough to come and say that all this would have been even better if the bread had remained gray and the fruit spoiled, it costs nothing to say it and no one will be able to demonstrate the opposite. Explaining that we might be better off with a diet less loaded with technology doesn't shock me either. But arguing at length to explain that mechanization and chemistry lead to a humanitarian regression, even a catastrophe for our species, against a background of cancer and cardiovascular disease, seems to me above all a severe example of cooking and ignorance. Sorry...
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by Janic » 30/07/18, 09:42

Yes finally...
Since the second world war, in a triumphant period for the development of the chemical industry and mechanization, in particular in the agro-food field, we have witnessed a remarkable increase in life expectancy, and even in the duration of life without particular disability; it still seems quite difficult to deny it; this translates as much into significant progress in the period of the most advanced age, but also in accidents and neonatal mortality, in the incidence of childhood illnesses, in the frequency of accidents at work, etc. .

These evolutions seem mainly due to improvements in hygiene conditions, nutrition, life in general, but also to advances in medicine ... Denying all this seems a bit strong to me, even if white bread has not my preference, and if fruits and vegetables look better without chemical swelling.

It would be easy enough to come and say that all this would have been even better if the bread had remained gray and the fruit spoiled, it costs nothing to say it and no one will be able to demonstrate the opposite. Explaining that we might be better off with a diet less loaded with technology doesn't shock me either. But arguing at length to explain that mechanization and chemistry lead to a humanitarian regression, even a catastrophe for our species, against a background of cancer and cardiovascular disease, seems to me above all a severe example of cooking and ignorance. Sorry...

Beautiful lyric flight which is justified in certain aspects. So I answer globally:
Yes, mechanization increased food production well before the second world war and the war period upset the balance with respect to peacetime and this is a primary factor. But agricultural industrialization, by NPK fertilizers, [*] only happened after the war to use the chemical surpluses of the war, precisely, and this gave the illusion that our western world was going to join the American model. But the bride was too beautiful and the farmers became hostages of the industries in question, with a final cost increasing regularly (independently of a fall in the sale prices linked to the brutal overproduction, plus the mechanization to excess indebted always the peasants who thus find themselves trapped in an endless system and who, now (after having strongly criticized it) think they are finding, progressively and despite the pressures of agrochemists, a way out in the bio.

For life expectancy.
Indeed, thanks to progress and the discovery of certain products such as sulfonamides, antibiotics, etc ... these have improved, overall, the health situation of industrialized countries (thanks in large part to hygiene) drastically reducing selective mortality ( especially infantile), Darwinian, by gradually decreasing also, the robustness of the populations concerned (as for agriculture because same causes = same effects). Then yes " chemistry leads to a humanitarian decline, even a catastrophe for our species, against a background of cancer and cardiovascular disease, Because it is not a question of smoky theories, but of a reality on the ground that even the "blind" can see every day in the official statistics that it would be good, for everyone, to consult and analyze.
It would be easy enough to come and say that all this would have been even better if the bread had remained gray and the fruit spoiled, it costs nothing to say it and no one will be able to demonstrate the opposite.

Except that these spoiled fruits are an exaggeration of reality due to agrochemistry. And for gray bread (false vision of reality also that should not be confused with real wholegrain bread), it is the result of this war bread comprising of everything and especially anything intended to feed populations in need of food during this period, while real bread (from the countryside) fed successive generations of robust populations.
For millennia, without a chemical industry, without a fridge, without long-distance transport, humanity has lived in spite of these shortages, but there was not a frantic race for the production of the more, even more, always more as for the rest of the society besides and that Ahmed and consort analyzes very well.
So, trying to go up against a subway corridor during rush hour, it's dangerous and almost impossible and that's what our society has become.

[*] https://sosbiodiversite.wordpress.com/2 ... coupables/
"At the armistice, production will be redirected towards nitrogenous fertilizers for agriculture, which will be associated with the phosphorus and potash couple dear to Father Liebig to give the paragon of chemical soil manure, the NPK trinity. Haber is therefore at home. the origin of the boom in "modern" agricultural production and its corollary, water pollution by nitrates. Fritz Haber will receive the Nobel Prize in 1920 for his discovery, but amid a heated controversy fueled by jurors French, British and American who boycotted the ceremony because of Haber's military activities which had earned him to be one of the first to be prosecuted for crimes against humanity. "
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by Ahmed » 30/07/18, 13:33

Yes, even if it means analyzing a trend, it is better to consider the long term rather than focusing on the current limited period.
The ideology of progress is based on facts, but postulates an evolution contrary to observation and reasoning: what makes the debate so difficult is that what is favorable coexists in an inseparable way with what is harmful, in the sense that the modifications likely to introduce a better result in perverse effects which do not necessarily manifest themselves quickly, or in the same place as where the improvements appear.
A striking example can be found in the case of China: it perfectly illustrates the progressive European * project of universal development, but its temporary success is at the same time the greatest threat to the whole world, not in the outdated form. of a "yellow peril", but for having given shape to an unrealizable utopia (if you can forgive me this pleonasm!).

* "Progressivism" could only be justified by invoking from the start what it was, by definition, incapable of accomplishing.
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by izentrop » 31/07/18, 00:42

Easier to accuse others than an individual handling.
Because eating fatty and sweet momentarily cheers us up, we tend to eat more and more fatty and more and more sweet. A behavior which, in fact, makes us even sadder. One more vicious circle to add to junk food!

Fight the effects of junk food:

The good news is that the trend can be reversed. By eating more fruits and vegetables, rich in antioxidants, we fight the inflammations initiated by junk food. Oily fish and avocados, on the other hand, boost the rate at which new neurons are made. And physical exercise has a positive effect on the neuroplasticity of the brain. https://www.futura-sciences.com/sante/q ... veau-6939/
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by Janic » 31/07/18, 07:30

Easier to accuse others than an individual handling.
exactly what I repeat endlessly, but which you constantly challenge and not just me. Yes, awareness is individual because without it nobody acts effectively and the powerful lobbies, which condition the minds, precisely prevent this takeover: exple lobbies of pharmacy, lobbies of agrochemicals, lobbies of the food and its chemicals. Ah, these are the same? !!!! : Cry:
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by Bardal » 01/08/18, 11:16

Janic wrote:
... / ...

Beautiful lyric flight which is justified in certain aspects. So I answer globally:
Yes, mechanization increased food production well before the second world war and the war period upset the balance with respect to peacetime and this is a primary factor. But agricultural industrialization, by NPK fertilizers, [*] only happened after the war to use the chemical surpluses of the war, precisely, and this gave the illusion that our western world was going to join the American model. But the bride was too beautiful and the farmers became hostages of the industries in question, with a final cost increasing regularly (independently of a fall in the sale prices linked to the brutal overproduction, plus the mechanization to excess indebted always the peasants who thus find themselves trapped in an endless system and who, now (after having strongly criticized it) think they are finding, progressively and despite the pressures of agrochemists, a way out in the bio.

For life expectancy.
Indeed, thanks to progress and the discovery of certain products such as sulfonamides, antibiotics, etc ... these have improved, overall, the health situation of industrialized countries (thanks in large part to hygiene) drastically reducing selective mortality ( especially infantile), Darwinian, by gradually decreasing also, the robustness of the populations concerned (as for agriculture because same causes = same effects). Then yes " chemistry leads to a humanitarian decline, even a catastrophe for our species, against a background of cancer and cardiovascular disease, Because it is not a question of smoky theories, but of a reality on the ground that even the "blind" can see every day in the official statistics that it would be good, for everyone, to consult and analyze.
It would be easy enough to come and say that all this would have been even better if the bread had remained gray and the fruit spoiled, it costs nothing to say it and no one will be able to demonstrate the opposite.

Except that these spoiled fruits are an exaggeration of reality due to agrochemistry. And for gray bread (false vision of reality also that should not be confused with real wholegrain bread), it is the result of this war bread comprising of everything and especially anything intended to feed populations in need of food during this period, while real bread (from the countryside) fed successive generations of robust populations.
For millennia, without a chemical industry, without a fridge, without long-distance transport, humanity has lived in spite of these shortages, but there was not a frantic race for the production of the more, even more, always more as for the rest of the society besides and that Ahmed and consort analyzes very well.
So, trying to go up against a subway corridor during rush hour, it's dangerous and almost impossible and that's what our society has become.
... / ...


Yes, mechanization and fertilizers (after the 2nd World War in Europe) increased productivity and yields, lowered prices (making products accessible to the greatest number), greatly improving the lives of farmers (new concept) and agricultural workers; do you want to complain? And, yes, the corollary is that there has been, as in any process of industrialization, an accumulation of capital, with all that accompanies it: circuits of realization of surplus-value and renewal of this capital, desertification campaigns, radical change in lifestyles ... But also access by the greatest number to adequate food and an improvement in living conditions ... Do you want to complain? There are regrettable counterparts? Yes, without a doubt, but it is up to us to remove the essentials (even if it remains wishful thinking for the moment), your trap being only the one that we have built or tolerated…

The increase in life expectancy is mainly linked to the improvement of living and feeding conditions (which brings us back to the previous point), secondarily to drugs and medicine (tuberculosis regressed long before the invention of antibiotics and sulfonamides, which only improved the decrease); As for your "Darwinian selection", allow me to smile about it: your "robust" peasants would die before the age of 60, and their surviving children dragged the consequences of childhood accidents and illnesses all their lives. Today we no longer die of cancer or heart disease because we live long enough to be affected; the difference is a life (which interests a certain number of people)… So let the blind people take a long look at the hazy theories that you are developing for us here. I'd rather die of cancer at 80 than from "healthy eating" at 40 ... but I'm probably wrong ...

Finally, no spoiled products are not an invention of agro-chemistry (whatever its wrongs) and gray bread, of war as of peace, was only the product of what was available, not of that that we chose; the populations were not "robust", but very fragile on the contrary, and the lifestyles of the peasants and agricultural workers very close to what was called poverty ... But where are you going to invent everything you come to tell here ?

Indeed, humanity has lived without industry, without fridge, and without eating to its end every day; and did not die from it ... As it did without the internet, and the talkers who plague the forums, via IT, a network and big data running on nuclear electricity and coal.
No doubt it is very true, but the frantic race for production already existed; the big difference is that it was for little results ...

PS I never take the metro, and especially not at rush hours or against the meaning ... Question of choice of life ...
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Re: Food and hunger: morbid junk food and malnutrition




by Bardal » 01/08/18, 11:52

Ahmed wrote:Yes, even if it means analyzing a trend, it is better to consider the long term rather than focusing on the current limited period.
The ideology of progress is based on facts, but postulates an evolution contrary to observation and reasoning: what makes the debate so difficult is that what is favorable coexists in an inseparable way with what is harmful, in the sense that the modifications likely to introduce a better result in perverse effects which do not necessarily manifest themselves quickly, or in the same place as where the improvements appear.
A striking example can be found in the case of China: it perfectly illustrates the progressive European * project of universal development, but its temporary success is at the same time the greatest threat to the whole world, not in the outdated form. of a "yellow peril", but for having given shape to an unrealizable utopia (if you can forgive me this pleonasm!).

* "Progressivism" could only be justified by invoking from the start what it was, by definition, incapable of accomplishing.


We are going to leave there "the ideology of progress", or "progressivism", a portmanteau word which could contain everything and its opposite, the blackest liberalism as well as the most sordid state capitalism, even a vulgar operation of communication. 'politicarde (the "progressive republicans"). For a long time now, I no longer believe in the great explanatory theories of the evolution of humanity, the various social Darwinisms in particular.
On the other hand, I pay attention to various sectoral, but rational approaches, related to contexts and interactions… In this framework, there is not THE progress, but possibly progress, which should be judged with all limits apprehensible, based on improvements that are deemed desirable. It is not ONE law that makes history, it is men, in connection with laws, strictly limited.

China is indeed a huge danger. What! These Chinese who no longer want to be satisfied with dying of famines at regular intervals, and start dreaming of a western standard of living? But who do they think they are? Indeed, we must react quickly to this colossal threat to the free world; see that, we bring them civilization, and opium, and now they buy our Medoc castles and ogle our women ...
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